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friendofjimmyk
04-17-2009, 03:16 PM
So, last Saturday night, I went to a MMA event. Local fighters need support too!

Anyway...there were a few vendors there. Submission clothing line - there are dozens of Tapout imitators now...and then this table selling XS energy drinks. The table selling XS drinks offered a drawing where you could win a variety pack of their drinks. I filled out the card, complete with my phone number, address, and email address. There was a spot on the card to check if you were interested in promoting for the company, which I thought was XS energy drinks. I didn't win the variety pack, but two days later, I received a call from the guy I met manning his vendor table.

He stated he noticed I was interested in promoting. He offered me some time at a local "earth day" thing this weekend, but I am already working. He said that was okay and maybe I should come by on Thursday (last night) to find out more information about this product. He said it would be from 8 - 9 pm. I figured, sure, I can give an hour of my time. I was looking for something to do part time while I am off school.

So, I go. I am greeted by several people in business suits who seem to take interest in meeting me and finding out about me. They seem to be really interested in anything I say. They are all smiling and too happy if you ask me...but who am I too judge. Maybe their underware was too tight and they were smiling to mask the pain...who knows. They have me sit right up front and center. The guy who manned the booth at the MMA fights arrived and starts talking to me. Then, it hits me...they are probably going to try to get me to BUY into this company. I still believed I was there for this XS energy drink. Maybe they wanted me to buy my own supply or share and then try to promote this thing on my own...completely not what I had in mind. I should've left then when the feeling hit me...but I didn't....oh why did I not listen to my instinct!

So, this thing starts. Another guy is starting his spiel. 30 minutes into it, he finally throws it up on this little white board. He puts three circles on the board. One to the upper left, one to the upper right, and then one in the middle lower between the two upper circles. He puts "you" in the lower circle, then B.W.W (business expansion) in the upper left and then ......"Amway Global" in the upper right.

:eek: FUCK! :eek: FUCK FUCK FUCK! I'm trapped. There is no escape. I mean, I could've made up some excuse....started to cough uncontrollably and excuse myself from the room and run like the wind...but I didn't. I sat there for the next 30 minutes hoping that they don't EAT the new people...which there were only 4 of us in the room. How did I know, they asked at the beginning and the conductor of this charade singled us out everytime he asked questions.

I had smoke blown up my ass about how GRRREEEEEAAAAAT of an idea this concept is. All I have to do is Read and Listen (to the motivational shit they make you buy), make a list (of other poor suckers to bring to these seminars, create a game plan - who to sucker, and make money. Can you say "pyramid scheme"?

ANYTHING that says I'll make money if I recruit new people is a pyramid scheme. I find it ABSOLUTELY hilarious that they SPECIFICALLY tell you NOT to Google their company. The guy who invited me even went to show an example...

He said if you google "mother theresa is bad" you will find million of sites about how evil mother theresa is....and he showed us....he googled "walmart is bad" and showed us the millions of sites that show how evil walmart is...he googled "amway is bad" and of course, there were sites about Amway is Scamway, etc....

So, today I googled Amway, without the "is bad" attachment and came up with some good sites and SEVERAL sites that state its a scam! Even one done by Dateline NBC. I mean, I really did not need these sites to tell me that this is a scam. But because they told me not to Google it...I just had to.

Then I remembered, and I really kick myself for this - when I visited the booth on Saturday night, they had given me a free packet of vitamin stuff that you add to water to make it "vitamin water" along with a pamphlet about their products. I remember, a little too late, looking at the back of the pamphlet and seeing "Amway Global" and scoffing.

So...the trance...I mean, seminar ends with them parading people up to the front of the room and they tell you how GREAT this company is and how it has worked so well for them and then it ends. I quickly make my escape only to be caught in the hallway by the person who invited me who offered to walk me to my car...great.

He further tried to push this on me and gave me more brochures. He ended our conversation by asking me if its okay to come over on Sunday to set me up on the Internet. I told him to call me on Saturday. He asked for my address...I started to give it to him..then stopped...and reiterated to call me on Saturday. He said, "Well, that's okay...I have your address on that card you filled out!" Fuck.

I called my friend afterward and told her that I felt violated. She asked me why I was not honest with him right up front. I did not know. I just wanted to leave.

So, when I get home today, I'm gonna call him and tell him "thanks, but no thanks. You can't scam me"

RecoveringKinkoid
04-18-2009, 06:01 AM
See, here's a perfect example of an instance where you don't have to be polite. You should have gotten up and walked out. Seriously, you don't even owe an explanation, but if you'd wanted to include an "oh, HELL no." it would have been appropriate.

Me, the minute I saw "Amway" I would have been up and running, and anyone trying to talk me out of it would have been told to suck it before being run over. That's not polite. And you know what? So what. I've learned to spot the bastards over the years, though. I've gotten savy and I've gotten downright brutal where those people are concerned.

I do love that they told you not to google their company, that is fucking rich.

Nyoibo
04-18-2009, 07:15 AM
I know, or knew, some people that were making damn good money from Amway, as in around 5-10,000 a month, but these are people that started around 20 years ago, when you had a chance of making money from it.

friendofjimmyk
04-18-2009, 12:39 PM
See, here's a perfect example of an instance where you don't have to be polite. You should have gotten up and walked out. Seriously, you don't even owe an explanation, but if you'd wanted to include an "oh, HELL no." it would have been appropriate.

All day yesterday I played the "should've" game. You know, "I should've did this...." "I should've did that..." oh well...

I did call the guy who invited me yesterday and left a voicemail that advised him I was ABSOLUTELY NOT interested. I stated I should've told him the day before, but I didn't. I haven't heard back from him...I don't quite feel I'm in the clear yet. I believe he may call me again.

I do love that they told you not to google their company, that is fucking rich.

I KNOW, right?! It's so funny...Everything bad I read about them is exactly what I experienced and I was only there one time. Everyone who wrote on the web against them stated the same thing...

* The people are SUPER OVERLY friendly. They seem to have a very deep interest in whatever you have to say. I believe that if I had said I like to stick firecrackers up my ass and dance naked on full moons they would've smiled and nodded and said, "Wow, that's awesome!"

* I did not hear "Amway" mentioned until 30 minutes into the presentation. The other newbies stated they had absolutely no idea why they were there...others who made it a bit farther before they caught on stated that people who have been around for awhile are told NOT to mention Amway at all until you have the new fish hooked on some "golden idea".

* There was NO mention of how much it would cost me. The guy who invited me merely stated he would come over and help me get set up on the Internet at home. He never once mentioned how much it would cost. I believe that if I had let him come over, he would then tell me that it'd be around $150 - 200 to get started. I'm a broke ass college student! No way!

* Everyone who wrote bad said the seminars go the same way...they barely mention Amway til late in the game. They tell you about the money you could be making with just 5 - 6 hours a week! Then, at the end of the spiel, they have people walk across the stage, in my case - from the front of the room to the back. These people stand at the front and tell you how WELL they are doing and how fantastic this plan is and then everyone claps (I didn't - I thought it was velveeta central by this point).

I've read Dateline NBC, 60 Minutes, and FCC reports since this evening. It's a scam. The only reason it's not considered a "pyramid scheme" is because of the products. You actually can buy and sell products...so that's the way they escape the "pyramid scheme" label. It's a legal pyramid scheme.

Think about it. If I am a distributor of a product, why the fuck would I want to turn on six other distributors of my product?!?! Don't you think I'd want to be the ONLY one in my area distributing my product? It's like if I opened a bookstore and then told six other people to also open a bookstore that sold similar products for similar costs in the same shopping plaza. It makes no sense!

The only people who make money in Amway today are the fucks at the top who sell the "educational" material to the minions on the bottom. The amount of money people put out to try to make it with Amway is staggering.

My final point on this whole charade is - Amway preys on the weak. Sure, fast good money with little effort sounds appealing to a lot of people...if you are a slave to the dollar. I am in such a place today that money does not motivate me. I could give a fuck less if I make a ton of money in my life time. I know that will not make me happy. I have hopes, dreams, goals and aspirations. I believe that if you are a person without those things...you can fall prey to this big-money scheme.

Blech. It makes me sick!!!!!!

Rapscallion
04-18-2009, 12:58 PM
I don't quite feel I'm in the clear yet.

Yes, yes you are.

The word 'no' is your friend. So are the words 'fuck' and 'off'.

Don't give in to their attempts to get money from you.

Rapscallion

friendofjimmyk
04-18-2009, 01:07 PM
Don't give in to their attempts to get money from you.

That's the kicker...I have no money to give them. So, yes - "no" and "fuck off" will be all they get if he does call back.

Eric the Grey
04-18-2009, 01:11 PM
See, here's a perfect example of an instance where you don't have to be polite. You should have gotten up and walked out. Seriously, you don't even owe an explanation, but if you'd wanted to include an "oh, HELL no." it would have been appropriate.

That's pretty much what I did when someone came over and pitched to my sister, her husband and myself, as soon as they got to their name. It took him a good 20-30 minutes before they did.

I got up and started to leave the room and my sister asked where I was going. I just said "Away" and left.

* I did not hear "Amway" mentioned until 30 minutes into the presentation. The other newbies stated they had absolutely no idea why they were there...others who made it a bit farther before they caught on stated that people who have been around for awhile are told NOT to mention Amway at all until you have the new fish hooked on some "golden idea".

Yea, they bank on you not knowing what they are pushing on you until you've gotten to the point where it sounds too good to refuse. Then once they have you hooked, they reel you in.

On the opposite side, my sister is a "distributor" for Amway, but all they do is buy the products they use, a handful of stuff (laundry detergent, toothpaste, and a few other things) but never actually try to sell it. She saves money on the laundry detergent at the least. I've run the numbers, and it's a good value, and I'll probably have her order it for me once the household goes it's separate ways, because it's one of the few soaps that doesn't irritate my skin.

Edit: I forgot to mention, they do like to try to pressure you, don't let them. If the person tries, mention subtle words like police, and harassment, and they'll likely go away. :)



:cool: Eric the Grey

friendofjimmyk
04-18-2009, 04:10 PM
Edit: I forgot to mention, they do like to try to pressure you, don't let them. If the person tries, mention subtle words like police, and harassment, and they'll likely go away. :)


Yeah, I am really hoping it doesn't come to that. I'd like to think that he'll listen to my message and know that I mean it.

He gave me some stuff to take home and look over. It was a brochure, a CD (one of I'm sure many they'd make me buy if I was gullible enough to fall for this) and a sample of the XS energy drink that I thought I went there to learn about in the first place.

Again, he asked me if 1pm on Sunday would be a good time to come over and set everything up on the Internet. I told him to call me today and I'd let him know. He asked for my address and I started to give it...then I stopped and told him to call me. That's when he threw out, "It's okay, I have your address on that card you filled out for the entry!" FUCK!

If he calls today, I will let my opinion be known.

Oh...and the stuff he gave me - I threw it away. That way if he tries, "Well, I'll just come by and pick up that stuff!" I can say, "You can dig it out of the trash can at the gym because that's where I filed it!"

Jester
04-18-2009, 04:42 PM
I have to admit I fell for this scam several times in college. By "fell for" I mean got roped into going to their little meeting/presentation. And, hell, the first time it actually sounded good in a way. Yeah, I was a sucker. No, they never got any money out of me. But yes, I got roped into similar meetings several times. How many? I dunno....at least three or so.

friendofjimmyk
04-18-2009, 07:35 PM
Did you pay for any of the meetings you attended? I was there as a "guest" but I noticed that others were paying a fee to get in.

Jester
04-18-2009, 10:33 PM
I absolutely never paid a dime to these people. Generally speaking, they would be customers of mine at a place I waited tables, would see how personable I was with my tables, and then set out the bait issue the invitation to something I might be interested in where I could make better money than I was. So I went.

The people who were paying a fee to attend? Something tells me they're not going to have to worry about which stock options to take when they get promoted to CEO, if you follow my drift.

Gravekeeper
04-19-2009, 12:21 AM
Ugh, years and years back before I started working for my current company, I went for an interview at this one place that was suppose to be a call centre job. Suppose to be. About halfway through the interview the company boss completely flipped from call centre to some sort of crazed sales spiel about how awesome their sales were and how people got a cut of the sales and how it was a great system with easy hours etc etc etc. I was wondering "wtf?" but when you're job hunting with rent hanging over your head and new to the city you'll listen to anything once I suppose.

So it goes from interview to sales pitch than he says he'll let me see some of their staff at work so I can see how awesome it is. I'm trapped in this douchebag's office so I agree to at least see whats up.

They were door to door solicitors. Not residential either. They were those fuckers that just walk into your company, office or place of business and try to sell random dollar store shit to you and anyone else there? Yeah, those jackasses. I don't think I've ever been so embarrassed in my life as when I had to be seen with these assholes. They were of course almost immediately chased out of practically every single place they went into.

I made it about an hour driving around with these dirt bags before they drove close enough to a Skytrain station and I told them to just drop me the Hell off and never call me again. Ever.

Ugh, it still aggravates me to this day. It was the absolute height of no shame and total lack of professionalism. These assholes would even hang around outside of secure offices/companies and wait to try and catch the door after someone left or something. Than they'd just wander as far as wasn't locked knocking on every door and harrassing people to buy shit. Despite the "No Solicitors" sign every 10 feet.

Argh!

friendofjimmyk
04-19-2009, 03:06 PM
The people who were paying a fee to attend? .

Yeah. After all the reading I did on the Web about them...that's how those at the top make their money - by charging for these seminars. Also, they say that you HAVE to buy this "educational material" in the form of CD's and DVDs because this is how you learn to make the money. There are 1000s of these CDs and DVDs. Most of the stories I read stated that most people's "upline" or "sponsor" started them off slowly by telling them to buy one or two. Then, they'd come back and insist that you needed to sign up to receive these items monthly. They'd have HUGE - 15,000+ people, conventions that cost upwards of $500 to attend. Not to mention that these people would also have to pay their travel cost there and all those expenses.

Gravekeeper - that REALLY sucks! To be trapped in a car with those people driving around while they get rejected over and over. I mean, did they really think that would turn you on to the job!

I really wish I hadn't been sat right up front...but those are those "should've's" that I can't do anything about now.

On another note...he did not call me yesterday. He had planned on coming over at 1pm today to set me up on the Internet...I won't be home to find out if he just shows up. I'm really hoping he got the point.

MadMike
04-19-2009, 09:19 PM
I have to admit I fell for this scam several times in college. By "fell for" I mean got roped into going to their little meeting/presentation. And, hell, the first time it actually sounded good in a way. Yeah, I was a sucker. No, they never got any money out of me. But yes, I got roped into similar meetings several times. How many? I dunno....at least three or so.

You too, huh?

In my case, it was a friend that got roped into it, and then got me to join. This was back in the early 90s. Just like you said, they make it sound so good and so easy. I'm ashamed to admit they did get about $100 from me for the startup kit that contained sample merchandise.

One of the worst parts had to be the meetings. I'm not one to stay in one spot for very long, and the meetings just seemed to go on and on, and they never ended when they were supposed to. My friend and I were at one that was only supposed to take an hour, and then we were going to hit this one bar that had a free taco night. The meeting ended up running closer to three hours, and by the time we got to the bar, the tacos were gone. We were not happy.

It wasn't long before I realized that I wasn't cut out for this type of thing. I'm great with people that I'm friends with, but tend to be shy and withdrawn around people I don't know. And I don't like people calling me up to try to sell me stuff, and I didn't like doing it to other people either. The final straw was when they had us come to this big presentation, which interestingly enough was at the same place where I saw George Carlin last year. The people in the audience seemed absolutely brainwashed, mindlessly applauding everything the speaker said. It weirded me out to the point that I got up and walked out, and never had any dealings with that shady company ever again.

The friend that got me to join up didn't last much longer. He's one of those people who thinks he's always right, and even he admitted getting involved with that company was a mistake.

friendofjimmyk
04-20-2009, 12:43 PM
The people in the audience seemed absolutely brainwashed, mindlessly applauding everything the speaker said. It weirded me out to the point that I got up and walked out, and never had any dealings with that shady company ever again.
.

Yup...I looked around the room at the others sitting in the room that night and they were all smiling from ear to ear, nodding their head in agreement with whatever the speaker said, taking notes dilligently...about what I don't know...I tried to read the notes the guy next to me was writing....as far as I could tell...he wasn't even writing anything that had to do with the seminar. They all looked WAAAAY to happy.

AND - the guy who is invited me DID call me on Sunday @ 12:55 (he wanted to come over @ 1pm) and told me he got my message and he could appreciate my response. He asked if it would be a good time to come and get the stuff he gave me...particularly the CD. I said that it wouldn't be necessary because I had thrown it all away. He never lost the smile in his voice. He asked, "You threw it away?" I told him, "Yes, I never wanted to have to deal with your company again!" He, still with the smile in his voice said, "Outstanding!" I was really hoping he'd ask me why...but he didn't. Instead, he told me if I ever wanted any product to call him and I said, "No!" and hung up.

Hopefully, that will be the end of it.

4love
04-20-2009, 10:48 PM
Oh, good lord. Yeah, this happened to me too.

I was at an anime convention, for Pete's sake, and the guy next to me in line started up his spiel... never mentioned Amway. Not. Once. Said how he worked for a 'small online retail company', it was really great. Here's his boss's card, and could I give him my number and email?

Two calls from him and one call from his boss later, I cave and agree to meet with boss lady at a Starbuck's near my store to see if I'm interested. Yeah, real professional, I know :rolleyes:, but they were just so flatteringly interested in me. I had a vision of a sit-down receptionist position somewhere I wouldn't be running my feet off carrying books all day. Or maybe working for one of those online anime vendors. That'd be cool.

Took her maybe 20 minutes to mention Amway. Oh no, not a pyramid scheme, see, if you're no good it becomes more of a plateau... blech. Anyway, she pushed some 'informational material' off on me 'to help me learn the truth about our company'... then off-handedly mentioned that she'd need it back, and oh, I should come to this meeting to see what it was really all about, and blah blah blah.

I just wish I could get those hours back. I feel kind of dumb for even meeting with her. Gave her the stuff back and, thankfully, haven't heard from her since.

I wish convention guy hadn't been there- I was looking for an innocently joyful time with my addiction of choice, not a sales pitch. :mad:

Kiwi
04-20-2009, 10:56 PM
my brother got hired as a "salesman" with a company that turned out to be a door to door salesman to, he was told that he would be working in the showroom selling kitchen appliances and when he arrived for his first day that handed him a catalogue and told him to take 3 other salesman out to a neighbourhood (in his own car with his own petrol) and start pounding the pavement.

when he asked about the show room the guy in charge said and I shit you not "the WORLD is our showroom!"

He got in his car alright and hightailed it home.

Parrothead
04-21-2009, 03:42 AM
...Is it just me, or do the Amway stories posted make it sound kinda cultish?

Kogarashi
04-21-2009, 04:34 AM
...Is it just me, or do the Amway stories posted make it sound kinda cultish?

I was thinking that myself.

Of course, having a pyramid scheme cult in the Cults chapter of the World of Darkness book Antagonists might have something to do with it....

Bella_Vixen
04-21-2009, 04:44 AM
Reminds me of Primerica.

This one guy (he was cute!) came in to my gas station to ask for directions. He stayed for a while, chatting me up.

He told me bits and pieces of this great company he worked for, and blah blah blah, and how much money he made. Me, being constantly...if not broke, then stil in need of money, perked up at this.

I was skeptical, but I let him talk me into an interview (hey, he was cute!!). I dragged K with me.

We met at a local Starbucks (why didn't I listen to my gut?!?), and it just felt shadier and shadier...then he mentioned that the "class" would cost something like $200 to get the license for some kind of realtor thing.

Yeah. No. Do I really look that stupid??

I told him that if it was that great, why doesn't he pay for my class/license, and I'd pay him back out of my first (huge) check.

For some reason, he said no. :shrug:

He apparently even suckered his family into this mess, even his father!

I should have know he was full of it when he said that he thought I was great with people and a great people person. :wtf: :lol:

friendofjimmyk
04-21-2009, 07:09 PM
...Is it just me, or do the Amway stories posted make it sound kinda cultish?

OH. Yes! It was so creepy the way these people were smiling...like HUGE BIG FAKE PLASTIC SMILES! Clinging on to EVERY word the speaker said. The people that they paraded across the floor in front of us to show us who is making it big just seemed like they were smiling robots. It reminded me of the Stepford Wives.

Evil Queen
04-21-2009, 07:20 PM
Now I know how people who work at Walmart or Sam's Club feel when they hear about people who bitch about the comapny they work for.

I support Amway because I like their products. If you don't like it, you really could have excused yourself and walked away. No need to get mad or snippy about it at all. After all, YOU walked into the event willingly.

THIS is You and I am your SPONSOR!

I've said enough on this subject. Good night.

Gravekeeper
04-21-2009, 07:44 PM
Now I know how people who work at Walmart or Sam's Club feel when they hear about people who bitch about the comapny they work for.

I support Amway because I like their products.

Ehhh...no offense, EQ. But its not the products, its the practice. I've heard nothing but complaints about the way they recruit ( the sucker in stealth approach being popular ) and operate. They've gotten in legal trouble numerous times for it.

And it is unsettling creepy the way in which many of their distributor groups hold their little meetings and what not. -.-

You could complain about my company all you want ( If you could find it! Muahahah~ ) wouldn't bother me honestly. I've watched with bemusement many a time as people on the board have actually unknowingly mentioned, praised or complained about our clients. Completely oblivious to the true evil behind them. =p Well, in between them. Er...in front of them. Funnelling the evil from them to you, the consumer. Yeah, there you go.

Lil Bunny
04-21-2009, 07:58 PM
Ahem.

I am a sucker. I am stupid. I am the person of low intelligence you all are talking about.

On a happy note, when it finally got to court I managed to recoup 500 dollars. That's oh, about 1% of what I invested in Trek Alliance.

MadMike
04-21-2009, 11:19 PM
Ehhh...no offense, EQ. But its not the products, its the practice. I've heard nothing but complaints about the way they recruit ( the sucker in stealth approach being popular ) and operate. They've gotten in legal trouble numerous times for it.


Exactly. I don't recall any bad experiences with the products themselves. IIRC, there wasn't anything spectacular about them, but they weren't bad either.

It's the misleading and outright lying that most people have a problem with.

friendofjimmyk
04-23-2009, 04:24 PM
Yeah, I wasn't talking about the products. I was talking about the practices. It's a legal pyramid scheme. I disagree with their practices. Yes, I voluntarily went to this thing...that's because I had NO IDEA what this thing was...had I been told UP FRONT what I was going to...I would've chosen not to go. I was not given that information to make such a choice. It was sneaky and underhanded and any "business" that doesn't represent itself upfront and openly...there's something wrong.

I wasn't insulting anyone's intelligence either. If I came across that way...I apologize.

Millahtyme1983
04-24-2009, 06:36 AM
IIRC from when a friend sold amway that XS stuff is made by them and sole exclusivley by them. I just did a quick google search and it confirmed that.

friendofjimmyk
04-24-2009, 02:43 PM
IIRC from when a friend sold amway that XS stuff is made by them and sole exclusivley by them. I just did a quick google search and it confirmed that.

Yes, I believe that all their products they have are exclusive to them. Again...it's not the PRODUCTS...it's the PRACTICE.

But now, I think I'm just beating a dead horse...oh wait....

:deadhorse:

Yeah, like that.