"Act like an adult!" How??

[Treasure]

I am 27 and live at home with my parents
I pay rent - less than i would if i were in a place of my own, but that's supposed to be a perk of living w/ parents (right?)
my mother is disabled and it is degenerative, so its getting worse

I have a job, in fact mom works for the same company
i pay all my other bills and take care of my own expenses


i am expected to come directly home from work and cook dinner - its supposed to be ready by 6-630 (dad doesn't even get home til 6, i usu. get home by 530)

while its never been directly stated, attitudes heavily imply that i shouldn't go out during the week

I am expected to do chores, and not just on an "as needed" basis
am expected to do the filing - despite mom having her desk reconfigured so she could take care of it

I am expected to check in with her if i'm going out directly after work on Friday and let her know when/if i'll be home friday and saturday nights

My boyfriend lives on the other side of town, its about a half-hour drive most nights, but after work friday is over an hour; he lives with his parents and has none of these expectations; he also only has a twin sized bed - so staying over is not ideal - however i have a queen sized bed.
I am supposed to ask permission for him to stay the night - but we can't be intimate, like we can at his place

I have been looking for a place to move out - but a lg 1/1 apt for less than 500/mo is proving difficult; so finding a reliable roommate that i can stand to live with.


Mom has begun with passive aggressive guilt trips "i don't know what i'm going to do when you move out - guess i'm just gonna have to stop wearing socks"
"sure move out now while you still can, before i'm in a wheelchair and have to have constant assistance"

when i do my own thing i get yelled at that i'm being disrespectful, and reminded that i'm an adult, not 16 i need to grow up and act like it; often followed with a threat of kicking me out

I have had to stop having certain friends over, because mom is uncomfortable around them; but i apparently can't have friends that she doesn't know or at least met, because when i talk about them she acts like she has no clue who i'm talking about (because she hasn't met them)

So while i do want to move out, i want to do it with her support, and on good terms, not because we're fighting/she kicked me out.


What i want to know is - am i crazy or is Mom still trying to treat me and impose rules like I was still 16; and then complaining that that's how i act when i actually try to act like an adult?

(adult - responsibilities first, fun after - that's what i do - so what am i missing?)

[BookstoreEscapee]

No you're not crazy; they are treating you like a child. It's one thing to have house rules and pitch in with chores and expenses, but you shouldn't need 'permission' to go out and see friends (or have friends, even). When I still lived at home my parents expected me to call if I was going to be really late so they wouldn't worry, but they never said I had to be home by any certain time or couldn't/shouldn't go out and see friends (whether they had met them or not). You are an adult and they shouldn't be trying to dictate your social life. (I tend to be torn on the 'no boyfriend sleeping over' rules for adult kids. On the one hand, it is their house; on the other, you live there too and pay rent, and should be able to live your life. Whenever I read about adult children complaining about their parents forcing them to stay in separate rooms when they visit, I think, it's a few days, surely you can respect your parents' wish to remain willfully ignorant of your sex life. On the other hand, when you are an adult and actually living in the house and paying rent, you should be able to have a certain amount of privacy in your own space.)

My guess is ultimately, your mom is scared because she knows that she will eventually need more help and despite the arguing she is more comfortable with the prospect of you doing it than hiring a stranger. Maybe it's time to sit down and have a (calm, reasonable) conversation about how you feel. You're not going to live there forever and they need to accept that.

On finding roommates: I had good luck with roommates.com. You can search for someone who has a room to rent, or you can also opt to be matched with people who are also looking for a room. That's how I was matched with my roommate and then we found a place together. As much as she drives me nuts sometimes, she's a good roommate, pays her share on time, does her share (maybe more) of the chores, etc. (If she'd just stop talking once in a while...)

[Treasure]

BE, i guess i forgot something - I cannot talk to her - every time i try, no matter how many "I statements" i make she still acts like its a personal attack; She can yell and raise her voice, but if i even *think* about responding in kind - its "don't you raise your voice to me!" through clenched teeth, usually followed with a "do you want to find your shit on the lawn"

I almost feel like i'm better off avoiding her - and i hate feeling that way

[BookstoreEscapee]

Ugh. That sucks. My parents were always pretty reasonable so I don't really have any advice there. Maybe write her a letter? Is there any 3rd party (friend, family member?) that maybe could help play mediator?

[Cookie]

Treasure, your situation is very similar to my own before I moved out. (Got kicked out, actually. They followed through on the threat.) You're not acting like a child, you're being treated like one. It's hard, but the sooner you can move out and demonstrate that you don't need your mother to live, the better. She'll may never see you as an adult, but she certainly won't see you as one as long as you're living under her roof and practically being her servant. Reason doesn't work with someone like this. Expect hell to break loose as you move out. If you can arrange to have some friends come over and help you get your stuff while she's not home, that would save you a lot of grief.

[MaggieTheCat]

I don't have time to reply in detail, but I am fairly certain that things will be better once you move out, whether you move out with her support or after she kicks you out. My mom was somewhat similar to your's, not quite as radical but with similar rules. Once I moved out, with mixed feelings from her ("I want you to be independent but not like this!" -- then like what??) things got a lot better and we're on good terms now, as long as we don't see each other too often.

[blas]

My parents had rules and a midnight curfew for me at age 19. I got the hell out of there, and I'll never go back.

[TheSHAD0W]

I forget who it is that said, there's nothing that can make you behave like a child more than being treated like a child. Just say, "I'm sorry you feel that way" and walk away. Don't roll your eyes, don't stress out.

[Mikkel]

I forget who it is that said, there's nothing that can make you behave like a child more than being treated like a child. Just say, "I'm sorry you feel that way" and walk away. Don't roll your eyes, don't stress out.

I don't know if she is citing someone else, but I remember the cite from Bujolds "A Civil Campaign" and she is completely right.
How the h*ll should anyone act like an adult when they have to keep a set of rules a fourteen year old would rebel against.
Get out or be thrown out, you will be happier for it. Could you move your bed to your boyfriends place? Would his parents let you move in for a time?

[AccountingDrone]

Slowly and gently move all your belongings to a storage locker. Covertly check for a room in someone elses apartment/house. Tell her that you have found a new place, and 'this is the address'. When the fecal matter hits the rotational cooling device, tell her that you are sorry she feels that way, but you are no longer a child and will not be treated like that, and pack the last remaining items and walk out the door.

Sometimes you have to play hardball.

[and for what it is worth, I am stuck with a degenerative condition, and would never treat anybody like that. I simply modify the way I do things and have them set up so I can do it myself. I know full well I will be in managed care at some point in time when I either lose mrDrone, or he no longer can physically help me. Then we will both be in managed care.]

[Gerrinson]

I went through quite a bit of the same thing when I lived with my grandmother. And I used to get family members calling to 'remind' me that taking care of her was my responsibility since they lived too far away to come and help (most of the ones who called lived 40 miles or less from her, but they couldn't even come over one day a week to visit.)

Not to mention my grandmother's crazy shenanigans - always accusing me of doing drugs and insisting I get tested. To which I said 'Sure, as long as you pay for it.' Then I'd get shrieked at for refusing to pay for a drug test - clear proof that I was on drugs! Nevermind that I was more than willing to take it, just not at my expense.

She also use to say that 'everyone' told her I'd lost my job. While I was on my way out to work at 6:30 AM. When I asked her for names, I was told she wasn't going to rat out her sources. Ummm, yeah, cause there were none.

And it's not like the crazy was recent. When my dad was 14 she literally kicked in his bedroom door to yell at him for 'thinking about becoming a Catholic!' That was the room I eventually used with the door still busted 35 years later since she didn't want it to be lockable again.

A couple of my aunts even went so far as to tell me - at age 20 - that I wasn't allowed to have a girlfriend as dating would be too much of a 'distraction' from taking care of my grandmother.

It took me a little bit longer than I had hoped to get out, but as soon as I had an apartment and a roommate lined up, I was gone. Many of the aforemention family felt that I was being ungrateful and spiteful for leaving. Because obviously I should have shown gratitude for the way they treated me.

My advice: Get out and don't look back. If they feel that curfews, guilt trips, and threats are the way you deserve to be treated then they are treating you just like a child. If you're paying rent and expenses then I would suggest you can set your own curfew and have your own friends over since you are actually living with your landlords, who also happen to be your parents.

Here's an idea: In the interests of 'acting like an adult' perhaps you could suggest they write up a small rental agreement stating how much you pay and what you get for it (room, bathroom access, trash removal, snow removal, etc.) Don't sign if they start putting in curfews, list of friends allowed over, etc. Just insist on a basic agreement. Anything they try to enforce that's not in the written agreement just gets a 'Sorry, but it's not in the agreement and I wouldn't agree to that amendment.' Which is what any other renter would do, thus you would in fact be acting like an adult. And if they pull the 'act like an adult' card, you simply respond 'I am.'

Of course, there will probably be much disagreement over the whole thing, but if they insist you act like an adult, do so. Which means taking a firm stance when they treat you like a child.

[Solumina]

Sounds like she is grasping for any control that she can get. Things wont get better, the longer you are in that situation the tighter her grip will become. I know that getting a roommate can be hard and a great roommate takes time and luck but if you think of your mother as a roommate then finding a better roommate doesn't seem quite so hard.

[Seshat]

It sounds to me like she's terrified, and taking out that terror on you.

What your mother needs is medical help and support for managing her condition - and I mean support from professionals.
Occupational therapists will enable her to put her own socks on, if she has even limited mobility. Physiotherapists will enable her to retain what mobility she has, possibly even temporarily reverse some of the degeneration. Rehabilitation medicine has come a very long way in a short time.
Of course, this would require effort on her part....

What you need is to talk to carers' groups, and find out what is considered reasonable treatment of a carer from the disabled person they're caring for. HINT: what you're getting is very very unreasonable!

What I would consider reasonable for an adult child living at lowered rent in her parents' home:
* doing more than a third of the chores, to make up for the lowered rent.
* if one of the chores is cooking dinner, pre-making a microwaveable meal is fine, especially if you intend to be out.
* if planning to be out later than expected, or if ending up out later than expected, calling home to let folks know you're fine.
* if bringing friends home, being careful to let your parents have 'quiet enjoyment' of their part of the house. Even if this means you and your friends go to a cafe instead.
* Respect your parents' wishes regarding sex under their roof.



Reasonable for an unpaid carer, caring out of love, with an adult patient who is mostly 'there' intellectually:
* Organising medication & making sure it's taken.
* Doing physically demanding chores - in exchange, the patient does such chores as she can. (EG: I do almost all our clothes-mending.)
* Being an emotional support, but not being an emotional punching bag.
* GETTING emotional support from their patient. (it IS supposed to be a loving relationship, in both directions!)
* Doing basic physical care of the patient - but WITH such equipment as grab bars, walking frames, and lifting frames. (If the carer's back is ruined, you now have two patients.)
* Most basic physical care is stuff like helping them into and out of bed, chairs, helping and spotting for physiotherapy, etc.
* Basic physical care can include brushing and washing the hair, cleaning teeth, toileting, showering. However, at least in Australia, most municipalities will provide cheap or free carers to do that sort of intimate work - it's not expected of families to do that. It's deemed potentially too embarassing.
* Beyond this, it's nursing care, and it's not something you should be expected to do without special training.
(This does depend on the illness. Parents of children with cystic fibrosis learn a special way to thump their children's ribcages to help them breathe more easily. But that counts, IMO, as special training.)


Expectations the carer can have of the patient:
* The patient will love, respect, and care for the carer. This is a carer/patient relationship out of love and respect and family, right? If not, pay your carer well and in negotiable currency.
* The patient will communicate when she's having a difficult day.
* The patient will make a reasonable attempt to deal with their pain and/or emotions in a way that doesn't stress the carer. (Blowing up computerised zombies, writing letters that will never be sent, etc)
* The patient will apologise when that fails.
(not if - when. And yes, it will fail repeatedly. But the patient needs to keep making an honest attempt not to let their frustrations out on the carer, no matter how often she fails.)
* The patient will continue to strive to maintain functionality and quality of life; in coordination with their carer and their medical team.
(This does not mean switching immediately to a gluten-free diet because the nutritionist thinks it might help: it means she and the nutritionist discuss the whys and wherefores, then she and the carer do a slow, scaled switchover to the gluten-free diet. Sudden changes always make me feel awful, and I've been told that's common.)
* The patient will accept that they may or will need aids and assistance equipment, and potentially external, paid carers. They may need psychological support to come to this acceptance, but there does come a time when relying on loving family is unfair and unreasonable.

[AccountingDrone]

Excellent list Seshat!

I do my best to make it easy on mrDrone - I am getting things gradually set up for maximum accessibility at home. We have grab bars, I have my meds mailed to me in 3 month lots, and I set them up 2 weeks in advance in weekly pill planners I do as much physiotherapy that tricare will pay for [36 sessions per year plus 2 pre evaluations and 2 post evaluations and 2 orthopod appointments] and I am always reading as much as I can on my various ills.

I am fearing that within about 2 years my mom will have to go into managed care because of her alzheimers, my brother lives with her and is main caretaker. Hubs and I go up one weekend a month to give him a break, and we cook a bunch of food for the freezer so he doesn't always have to cook when he gets home.

[Imprl59]

It's a hard leap for a parent to make to recognize your child is no longer a child. Your Moms condition makes this so much harder for her. As others have already said, she is terrified. She is losing her ability to take care of herself and you are right there to take it out on. She can't control what's happening to her but she can control you.

With that said, you need to get the heck out of there. Your parents are not going to change as long as you live under their roof and truthfully you are missing out on an important part of your own life. If you would be comfortable living with someone else I would reccomend you try out a roommate situation. Usually it's better to be the roommate than it is to have the place and try to find the roommate. That way if the other person turns out to be a whackadoodle or doesn't pay their bills it's not so hard for you to getaway. You can always move away from the whackadoodle but it aint so easy to get the whackadoodle out of your place. You can also look for separate apartments that aren't in complexes. Inlaw apartments, garage apartments etc. Some real bargains can be had

This should be your time to have fun and enjoy your life. Don't throw Mom out with junk you don't want from your room but get out their and flex your independence.