Bipolar, or no?

[Eireann]

This isn't an item of burning importance. It's just something I've been wondering about for some time, so I thought I'd ask all of you.

I used to know a woman who claimed to be bipolar. This is what she told me, anyway. She didn't tell our other mutual acquaintances. She didn't mention being on any medication for it, and she never told me whether or not a doctor had diagnosed her as being bipolar.

I never saw any of those high highs and low lows, such as a low mood where she barely spoke or the like. When I dealt with her, she would just burst out with a comment, whether or not it was appropriate, either in a good mood, or a bad one. She also had the tendency to cry when things weren't going her way.

Gradually, she alienated those around her. One woman refused to speak to her, or speak to me about her, because of her behavior. It seems she had a habit of calling up this woman, and/or her boyfriend, and screaming at them. She was very pushy, had to have her own way, tended to fly off the handle if she merely THOUGHT you were criticizing her or asking her something that she'd already been asked, and tended to dominate conversations.

Bipolar, or a spoiled brat claiming the condition?

[Der Cute]

Could be both.
Bipolar I is the kind that can swing HIGH (like..imagine running naked through downtown yelling I love everyone [super manic]), or mortgaging your house to buy a Ferrari, when you make 10$ hour. Very irrational, very stupid; money/sex/bad decisions. That's UBER manic.

It can also swing down as low as suicide, asking to be killed..death around corner.
Do understand that these do NOT have to be same -day, same-week, same- MONTH. These swings can be LONG...like...super dark for 3 months than a swing gradually up to super happy...happy lasting 12 months.

Bipolar II is where you have swings, but not as dramatic. Think of a baseline, rational thinking, doot de doot, you're doing things like you should, a grumpy day here and there...but when you have a mood swing up, it goes up only a little bit. Hypo-manic, like..feeling free-er, less inhibition (but not going money/sex crazy), very optimistic, willing to start projects. Then can swing down to bleh, I hate life, a DRAG of depression, the kind where you hate moving your feet but not near death. These also can be long swings.

You may not have seen the highs and lows due to length of swings. You mention she cries when not going her way - could that have been overreacting to life? (bratness or irrational/depression-mental illness). Screaming at people, one focus?

I'd not call that bipolar. look at the website about.com , and there are criteria taken from DVM-IV.

I'd also not reach in and try to figure out what she was. Call it weird, or impolite, and leave it at that.

[Sapphire Silk]

If she was bipolar she could simply have been well medicated. But her behavior reminds me more of Borderline Personality Disorder.

Bipolars swing from high energy phases (mania) in which they are very energetic, move and speak constantly. They start a lot of projects they don't finish. They may or may not be psychotic in this state. Then they crash into depression and will hardly move or do anything. They may become suicidal in some cases.

Borderlines are manipulative as hell. They like to use medical conditions to excuse their behavior or gain privileges they should not have. They'll use health problems to justify behaviors that would not be tolerated in others.

They tend to alienate everyone around them; people get tired of the BS and the excuses. Of course, this is true in many forms of mental lllness, but these guys raise it to an art level.

[RecoveringKinkoid]

I have a bipolar relative, and when it's bad, it's bad enough the person can't function. In fact, I've seen it so bad the person can't even communicate. The person is not bratty or bad tempered. In fact, the person is quite pleasant to be around.

Granted, this does not make me an expert. I'm just saying my relative is a pretty high functioning, pleasant mannered person.

I also know this is a condition that gets claimed by moody, overly dramatic people fairly frequently because they don't know really anything about it. They think bipolar means mood swings. Or they think it means they can act however they want.

Maybe she is and maybe she isn't, but if she hasn't been diagnosed, I tend to look askance at her claim.

[42_42_42]

I have a friend who is a diagnosed Bipolar II (although, I think she ALSO has Borderline Personality Disorder as well). My grandfather was a diagnosed Bipolar I, although he was well-medicated by the time I came along, apparently when he was a younger man his swings were pretty wild. Based on your description of your friend, I agree that she is more likely iether a Borderline Personality Disorder or just an immature jerk.

[MoonCat]

Borderlines are manipulative as hell. They like to use medical conditions to excuse their behavior or gain privileges they should not have. They'll use health problems to justify behaviors that would not be tolerated in others.

They tend to alienate everyone around them; people get tired of the BS and the excuses. Of course, this is true in many forms of mental lllness, but these guys raise it to an art level

You...just described my co-worker, General Manager of the Universe.

Hell, I think it describes two of them, with a third possible.

[Barracuda]

I had a friend who had borderline personality disorder, and she also claimed to be bipolar but acted more in the way you described. Very manipulative, was a "chameleon" (would change who she was to fit the wants of whoever she was around,) cried a lot and was VERY good at getting people to feel sorry for her and do what she wanted. It could also be other things, however, such as a combination of depression and adult ADD. I tend to burst out with things because I literally forget them if I don't mention them as I think of them, for example. I also can wander incredibly off topic very, very quickly as my brain makes random associations between the topic I am talking about and other topics. Whichever condition it is she has, I feel for her---while this behavior is not acceptable, she may very well know that and believe it yet be almost helpless to get rid of it. As a result, she's probably alienated and lonely and doesn't even entirely understand why. I myself have experienced that problem on a regular basis, and have to work very hard to be consciously aware of behaviors that come natural to me but aren't appropriate in a social setting. She is probably not a happy person. Nevertheless, don't tolerate her behavior unless you can deal with it. There are people she can talk to who understand if she really decides she wants help.

[Mytical]

Although never officially diagnosed think I am bipolar II..my father would be bipolar one...

I have more normal days..and a lot of them, but there are periods where I am really depressed or in a really good/creative/take on the universe and laugh mood. Oddly enough my 'up' days seem to fall on full moons though not all of them, nor do I always feel 'up' on full moons.

My dad can be paranoid, abusive, and mean when 'down', but 85% of the time is the nicest person you can know.

[Squeaksmyalias]

I would say it could be BPD, but it's hard to tell sometimes just because bratty people can be THAT bad. So you can't really tell unless you have an official diagnosis in your hands or you are a professional.
I have Bipolar II, lucky enough not to be medicated for it yet, but I've had to learn how to handle myself. It doesn't always work out that way, but I have a lot more level time then anything else and the doctor I was with taught me quite a bit of coping techniques. That being said I still have really bad downs and sometimes I can't always catch them and try to prevent them (hard to explain) as a few people on the board know. My lows I pretty much want to hide and not come out, my thoughts are grey and foggy (am I the only one who thinks in color?) and I might not talk as much, until I force myself to which is how I get myself out of my lows, or try to. My highs tend to be sever hyper activity, in the shorter highs I'm ok with it, but for a long time that can lead to panic attacks where I tend to feel out of control, like I'm watching myself do this. I would say it's like you are on a fun ride, then it won't stop, and it's not fun anymore and you can't get it to stop until it runs out of power. I tend to either sleep a lot the next day, or get a down, the downs after are fairly rare right after, they don't happen until a couple months after.

Normally with BPD and bipolar you can tell the difference between the two if you have two people who really have them in your life. Sadly like ADD, bipolar can be over used term with no diagnosis to back it up. There is someone I know who claims to have it and having known her as long as I have, it's just an excuse for her to be a jerk sometimes which then leads to people expecting me to be a jerk during my downs because I DO have bipolar. Another reason from my experience, is people will tell people they don't have it. You are just grumpy, depressed or something along those lines, which leads them to not be treated because they go down more and feel that they are just troubling others, or are just crazy and nothing is wrong. Which is why anyone who thinks they might have it or feels like they might be predisposed to it should go and get it diagnosed. It could be something else and either way it really should be treated. FYI if your doctor right off the bat suggests medication, ask why and also make sure they teach you coping techniques, not everyone needs or does well on medication. If they ONLY suggest medication, especially for just occasional sadness/depression RUN. Even on medication you need to learn those techniques, medication doesn't fix depression, especially when they are working on the right dosage for you.

[42_42_42]

Although never officially diagnosed think I am bipolar II..my father would be bipolar one...

I have more normal days..and a lot of them, but there are periods where I am really depressed or in a really good/creative/take on the universe and laugh mood. Oddly enough my 'up' days seem to fall on full moons though not all of them, nor do I always feel 'up' on full moons.

The way you describes yourself, it sounds to me like perfectly normal mood swings. Everyone has days/periods where they're down (sometimes really down/depressed) and days when they'e on a natural high. If you feel "normal" more often that not, I'd bet you are, in fact, normal. After all, "normal" is not being on an even keel 100% of the time, that would be abnormal.

[Eireann]

Those are all very good insights.

This woman is actually married, to a very sweet guy. At least, the last time I saw her, she was married. He had a patience with her that boggled my mind.

It's been a few years since I last saw her. It seems everyone got sick of her antics and just went away. The other woman I mentioned, the one who refused to talk to her, told me that she used to give Ms. Possibly Bipolar a lot of slack, until she met a woman who was in a wheelchair with some very serious additional problems, and saw that the woman in the wheelchair didn't try to get any sympathy for her plight, or make excuses. That's when she began to get highly irritated with Ms. Possibly Bipolar.

Like I said before, it's not a hugely important topic, and I'm certainly not trying in any way to criticize people who are bipolar, or to suggest that it's not a serious condition. I'm just wondering what this woman's condition really was/is. It may be that, as suggested above, she's a drama queen who found a convenient label for her actions (with the added convenience of claiming that she couldn't help herself), or a borderline personality disorder.

[Mytical]

My swings are generally light (compared to my father), but I get into the suicidal moods, as well as the 10' tall and bulletproof moods very often. The thing is..when I say 'normal' that really is a misnomer. Means I do not feel down enough to want to harm myself, or do a running jump off a cliff just to see what happens (this in an up mood..to feel the wind in my face type of thing).

At one time it was much more frequent and severe, but meditation and focusing on being very Zen helps.

[MoonCat]

From what info I can find online, people with Borderline Personality Disorder have abandonment issues. People who want attention all the time, who manipulate others and act like they're special have Narcissistic Personality Disorder (which really fits the behavior of the person I work with).

Anybody on here have experience with a person who has NPD?

[teh_blumchenkinder]

(snicker)
Bipolar II is where you have swings, but not as dramatic. Think of a baseline, rational thinking, doot de doot, you're doing things like you should, a grumpy day here and there...but when you have a mood swing up, it goes up only a little bit. Hypo-manic, like..feeling free-er, less inhibition (but not going money/sex crazy), very optimistic, willing to start projects. Then can swing down to bleh, I hate life, a DRAG of depression, the kind where you hate moving your feet but not near death. These also can be long swings.
(snack)

HUH. ... Maybe I should mention this to my counselor-type person next time I see him. I always thought bipolar was like the first type you mentioned... but I do have those type 2 swings... not as bad now that I'm taking close-to-overdose on some vitamins (doctor's recommendations for other problems, working wonderfully for those problems...) ... why yes some of them are B vitamins, why do you ask?!

42, I'm really happy your grandfather was able to be helped by medications! So often the case is, even now with vastly improved treatments, medication, and science, that people with mental illnesses are out of luck, made worse, or have the side effects to deal with...

:shudder: Borderlines remind me of the definition of mental illnesses, roughly equating to:"It causes a big enough problem in their sociality/mentality as to be a problem with the rest of society." I want to hug them... but it's so hard to separate the person from their problem!

[Eireann]

Yeah, this woman could be very friendly and open, but even when she was in a good mood, she talked too loudly, interrupted other people, went off on various tangents, and was generally hard to deal with. When she was tired and/or in a bad mood, she'd start whining (at best) and often, start crying, too. I don't know what it was or is.