A New Twist on ID Fun.

[Jester]

I work in a bar. Therefore I am often carding people. This is nothing new. People don't always have the appropriate or legally required ID. This, also, is nothing new. And sometimes, the people without the legally required ID try arguing with me. Nothing new there.

Today, however, I encountered a new twist on this little game we play.

Mid-afternoon, not a lot of people at the bar, a foreign couple show up at one of the bar tables. They ask for menus, and when I ask them what they would like to drink, the guy presents a coupon for a little cocktail sampler we have. I ask to see their IDs.

She gives me her ID. It is a foreign driver's license, but I can understand it enough to realize that, and the date is fine. No problem. He hands me....a national ID card from whatever country they are from. (I don't know. I know it was European, and not native English speaking. Beyond that...got me.)

ME: "I'm sorry, I can't accept this."
HIM: "It's my national ID card."
ME: "I understand that. But under Florida law, I can only accept a driver's license or a passport."
HIM: "This is basically a passport."

Thinking that it was one of those relatively new passports that are driver's license sized for ease of use, I take another look at it. Nope, not a passport.

ME: "Sir, this is NOT a passport."
HIM: "No, it's not a passport, but it allows me to travel anywhere in Europe."
ME: "I understand that, but Florida does not allow me to take national ID cards for alcohol purchases. If you have your passport or driver's license with you, I can accept that."

At this point, his girlfriend/wife/concubine/secretary/mail-order bride/whatever chimes in.

HER: "This is his national ID card."
ME: "Yes, I know that, but as I was telling him, under Florida law, I cannot accept a national ID card. I can only accept a driver's license or a passport."
HER: "But there's a number on the back you can call to verify it."
ME: *blink blink*
ME: "Ma'am, that doesn't matter. It doesn't matter if I can verify it or not, or if it's valid or not. Florida law does not allow me to accept that as an ID for alcohol purchases. I simply cannot legally accept it."

At which point what I was trying to tell them apparently FINALLY seemed to penetrate their skulls. And unhappy with the legal brick wall they had run up against--not to mention the bartender unwilling to break the law for their convenience--they left.

I know some people might have a couple of questions about this whole thing. Let me address the two most obvious. First, they were young, and looked young. They looked under 30, and by law, I must card people who look under 30. And her ID confirmed this, as she was around 23 or so.

Secondly, while they were foreign, and had accents, they had no trouble communicating with me in English, and clearly understood what I was saying. This was not a matter of not understanding the words coming out of my mouth, but of them refusing to accept what I was telling them.

Sadly, while the entire rest of my day didn't suck completely, this particular interaction was not even close to the worse part of my day. Just the worst part of my day involving customers.

[BrenDAnn]

At what point is it okay for you to say "No, you know what? Nevermind. Get the fuck out." ??? Honestly, I would think you would've hit that point with them fairly quickly...but then you've probably been through and seen far worse, too. I wonder how many other bars they tried the same shit at that night!

[Teefies2]

Sadly, while the entire rest of my day didn't suck completely, this particular interaction was not even close to the worse part of my day. Just the worst part of my day involving customers.



Oh Jester! Do I dare ask what was the WORSE part of the day??????

[Jester]

At what point is it okay for you to say "No, you know what? Nevermind. Get the fuck out." ??? Honestly, I would think you would've hit that point with them fairly quickly...

Nah.....they weren't rude, they weren't obnoxious, they were just persistent, and to be fair to them, part of it was the fact that they probably weren't familiar with the American laws about such things. I have dealt with far worse, and however annoying these people were, they clearly did not warrant a GTFO. I'm too professional for that, and they weren't even in the rude realm. So....no.

Oh Jester! Do I dare ask what was the WORSE part of the day??????

It started with me running late, getting stuck behind a car driving slow enough to practically be backing up, and having to pay for parking because I couldn't find a free space.

It ended with Arizona State getting their asses handed to them in their bowl game.

These people were but a speed bump in the mine field of my day.

[Canarr]

Okay, that could've happened to me, too... in Germany, we can get practically anywhere with just our national IDs - and driver's license, obviously - and only need the passport to travel outside of the EU. Didn't know that I can't use it everywhere in the US as an ID.

[emt_cookies]

Does Florida have state ID cards for non-drivers? We have them in our state and they look almost identical.

[Lace Neil Singer]

Ugh, I hate people who are persistant and obdurate like that. Where I work, I've encountered a few of these, and it's annoying cuz since they're not being rude or abusive, I can't walk away from them. I just have to keep on talking at them, spelling out the policy they're having trouble with, until it gets thru to them... and that can take ages.

I once had an SC who refused to believe that we were out of diesel. He spent ten minutes asking if we had any diesel in a variety of different ways and refusing to believe my truthful answer that we had none.

[wolfie]

The sad part is that both of them had to have passports. After all, they're from Europe (which is outside the U.S.), and Jester's bar is inside the U.S. - Customs and Immigration wouldn't have allowed them into the U.S. without passports.

[Jester]

Okay, that could've happened to me, too... in Germany, we can get practically anywhere with just our national IDs - and driver's license, obviously - and only need the passport to travel outside of the EU. Didn't know that I can't use it everywhere in the US as an ID.

You can and you can't. It is a valid ID for travel purposes, but not for the purposes of purchasing alcohol in the U.S. More on this below.

Does Florida have state ID cards for non-drivers? We have them in our state and they look almost identical.

Yes. Yes they do.

Here's the deal, and this applies to Florida and Arizona, both of which I've worked in for many years, and probably most other States, though I don't want to say this definitely applies to them, as I have little experience working in other States... .but I believe it does.

To wit, for age-restricted purchases, there are exactly four forms of ID we can take:
--any U.S. Armed Forces ID.
--any passport.
--any driver's license, but if it comes from outside the U.S., we have to be able to read it or understand it. For instance, while I don't know Spanish, I know enough of it to know when something handed to me is or is not a driver's license. I don't read any Japanese, so I would not be able to take a Japanese DL, since I would not know if the ID handed to me was a DL or something else entirely.
--any STATE-ISSUED ID card. And by "State" I mean one of the U.S. States. And by "ID card" I mean specifically an Identification Card. Which means I cannot take any Canadian ID cards, nor can I take an Iowa bus pass, a Michigan fishing license, or a Nevada health card.

Any questions?

The sad part is that both of them had to have passports. After all, they're from Europe (which is outside the U.S.), and Jester's bar is inside the U.S. - Customs and Immigration wouldn't have allowed them into the U.S. without passports.

You are unquestionably correct. But here I feel the need to defend Europeans in general. See, you DO need a passport to enter the country, of course. But that doesn't mean you have to have one with you wherever you go. Since passports are so valuable, many people, Americans, Europeans, and others, will often leave their passports on their cruise ship, in their hotel room, etc. Especially since passports tend to be a bit bulky and hard to carry easily. Which is at least partly why in recent years they came out with the DL-sized passport card, which confers all the benefits of a full-sized passport, but fits in your wallet for convenience.

[Mr Hero]

Does Florida have state ID cards for non-drivers? We have them in our state and they look almost identical.

I think this applies to everywhere, but then again I've only had ID cards in two states. There's plenty of things Non-drivers would need to do that requires some form of identification.

[Teefies2]

Nah.....they weren't rude, they weren't obnoxious, they were just persistent, and to be fair to them, part of it was the fact that they probably weren't familiar with the American laws about such things. I have dealt with far worse, and however annoying these people were, they clearly did not warrant a GTFO. I'm too professional for that, and they weren't even in the rude realm. So....no.



It started with me running late, getting stuck behind a car driving slow enough to practically be backing up, and having to pay for parking because I couldn't find a free space.

It ended with Arizona State getting their asses handed to them in their bowl game.

These people were but a speed bump in the mine field of my day.

Aww Jester I'm sorry AS got beat

[Jester]

ASU didn't get beat.

They got taken out behind the woodshed, beaten to a bloody pulp, and left there for the ravens and buzzards to pick over their remains.

Yes, it was THAT bad.

[Onlooker]

Well, now I know what my dad and brother will be talking about at dinner tomorrow night.

*waves from Phoenix*

[RottenFruit]

Okay, that could've happened to me, too... in Germany, we can get practically anywhere with just our national IDs - and driver's license, obviously - and only need the passport to travel outside of the EU. Didn't know that I can't use it everywhere in the US as an ID.

You could get into the same kind of problems in Ireland. I know that I did once (since when do you need an ID to buy a lighter, I mean, if I knew that I would have brought it but so... I cannot anticipate every stupidity by the nations or corporations I have to deal with).

[Ironclad Alibi]

The sad part is that both of them had to have passports. After all, they're from Europe (which is outside the U.S.), and Jester's bar is inside the U.S. - Customs and Immigration wouldn't have allowed them into the U.S. without passports.

If they were from a cruise ship, the cruise ship may have taken their passports at the beginning of the cruise, and returned them at the end. That is what happened to me when I took a Mediterranean cruise several years ago. Fortunately I didn't need it on any of the shore visits.