Age of Responsibility

[Tama]

I use the child free reddit board and there I always advocate lying like a dog. That is, taking a random friend who's a girl, and going to the doctor and saying he has 3-4 kids with her already. Yes, it's untruthful, but you do what you have to.

[mjr]

Aren't vasectomies reversible, anyways?

They are. But here's the issue:

It basically comes down to "you might change your mind".

I'm 41, and I've recently investigated "the snip" myself. I've found the procedure itself is around $700 or so (depending on where you go, scalpel vs no-scalpel, etc.), and I think it's partially covered by health insurance.

Vasectomies are supposed to be 99.9% effective. I think they sy 99.9% because of people who don't follow the doctor's directions and have unprotected sex too soon afterward. And sometimes it doesn't take effect.

Anyway, yes vasectomies can be reversed, but apparently the procedure is very expensive. In the neighborhood of thousands of dollars. And reversals, as far as I can tell, are not covered by insurance. And they range in "effectiveness". I believe that some place say a reversal is about 50% effective or so.

But hey, if OP's son is 24, and wants a vasectomy, he should be able to get one.

Side note: Do you know the time of year when most men in the U.S. get vasectomies? During the "March Madness" basketball tournament.

Subsequently, the Husband and Wife were using multiple forms of birth control till she could schedule getting her tubes tied and burned. Husband's Mother was fully aware of this BUT had a VERY BAD CASE OF BABY RABIES. Mother went so far as sabotage ALL of the couple Birth Control.

First off, I'm stealing the phrase "baby rabies".

Second, and more importantly, how did the MIL get her hands on the birth control to sabotage it? And how did she sabotage it all? Replace the pills? Poke holes in all the condoms?

[EricKei]

On the intrusive MIL who put the wife's life at risk: Maybe she was living in the same house, or nearby, such that she had easy access while they were both at work or something? No matter how it was done, that's some focked up shit.

[notalwaysright]

Buh, WHAT?! O_O These are kids we're talking about, not spare articles of clothing or car keys...

I haven't personally had this said to me by a doctor but more than one women I've know has said that a (male) doctor said that to them. I also actually know a woman who had her tubes tied after having two children, then got remarried and DID change her mind. I have no idea how but the doctors did something and she got pregnant. I won't go into details, but the pregnancy was fraught with problems.

But here's the thing... It's not anyone's business if she chose to do this to herself. My doctor is not my keeper, and other than advising me on the risks, has no place interjecting an opinion about whether I have children or not. Honestly, this issue is like a relic, a holdout from a previous age, why does it persist?

[Mental_Mouse]

Obviously, he needs to break up with her ASAP. For the vasectomy, do you have a planned parenthood in your area? https://www.plannedparenthood.org/le...-get-vasectomy They provide reproductive and health care for men as well as women.

I strongly recommend that your son avoid being alone with this person so that she can't make false accusations against him.

Um, I'm not the NAR poster, I just linked it.

[Monterey Jack]

In response to Racket-Man's post...

[Blue Ginger]

Actually there is one form of not-quite-human protoplasm who is lower than this. I recently came across a post on reddit's MIL sub-form about this very subject.
....
Wife plans PRO Revenge on MIL. MIL demands to tag along with wife to Dr. appt. Wife walks out of Dr. appt. and shoves a bio-harzard bag into MIL hands and SCREAMS "HERE IS YOUR GRANDCHILD I HOPE YOU ENJOY IT" and walks away.

(note not really fetal tissue but like 2 or 3 oz of ground meat but the message got across to MIL).

Damn, I want to buy this couple a drink or three.

I really, really hope they went no-contact with this piece of shit. I would also be telling family exactly what she did so they can make their own choices about talking to her or not.

[Racket_Man]

Second, and more importantly, how did the MIL get her hands on the birth control to sabotage it? And how did she sabotage it all? Replace the pills? Poke holes in all the condoms?

From what I remember of the story the MIL for some reason had some free rein in the couples house for a while. The how it was sabotaged is yes all of the above somehow she tampered with the birth control pills and poked holes in ALL the condom packs.

And YES the MIL FREAKED HER SHIT when the DIL handed her the bio-hazard bag with bloody (unknown at the time) ground meat. The DIL got home and started getting calls about what had happened and finally told MIL about the ground meat and basically said Back off NOW

The thing is is this story (obviously taken with a grain of salt) is by far NOT the grossest, meanest, or anything else story over there. I am not doubting the truth of that or any story over there BUT I have been to several other MIL type sites over the years and the consistency of the situations is VERY SCARY.

One from another board involved the MIL wanted and getting a certain plant. Now certain aspects of the life cycle of this plant can produce a SERIOIUS deadly toxin (as in with not too much work darn near military grade toxin and NO anti-toxin period) the DIL got slightly to mildly sick every time she ate at MILs house. DIL finally did some research and found the plant thing was the problem.


And yes Monterey it was evil

[mjr]

The thing is is this story (obviously taken with a grain of salt) is by far NOT the grossest, meanest, or anything else story over there. I am not doubting the truth of that or any story over there BUT I have been to several other MIL type sites over the years and the consistency of the situations is VERY SCARY.

I ran the story by my wife. She doesn't completely buy it, though you did say "grain of salt". Because her argument is if a miscarriage almost kills you, you probably don't try again to have another baby. Let alone two more times.

When my wife and I first got married, we wanted two kids. However, when my wife was pregnant with our son, she developed preeclampsia late in the pregnancy. The doctors basically told us that if we tried for a 2nd, there might be more complications and some bed rest involved. So we stayed with one.

I've briefly broached the subject of me getting a vasectomy with my wife...I don't think she really wants me to. But I don't know why, because our son is almost 13, and we're done, because we're both over 40.

[Eireann]

Reddit Childfree contains a series of anguished posts by a guy who has had a vasectomy. He was living with his fiancee, who didn't want children either, and knew that he'd had the snip.

Whoopsie! She turned up pregnant.

He knew that she couldn't be pregnant by him, but just to be sure, he went to the doctor. The doctor confirmed it - the odds against him being responsible were astronomical. He confronted his fiancee with the news, and at first she claimed that it had to be him; it couldn't be anyone else. Oh, and since he had had a vasectomy and she got pregnant, she decided it was simply "meant to be".

He refused to believe that horseshit, and finally, she admitted that she'd had an affair. With the sole purpose of getting pregnant and forcing him to act as daddy.

Oh, and the affair? It was with his best friend.

The drama went on and on. The message being, if you're childfree and determined to stay that way, make sure the people around you can be trusted. This guy was not only angry at his (now-former) fiancee, but beating himself up because he thought he knew her better than that.

[Tanasi]

A follow-up: He broke up with the girl but before having done so he changed the locks on his home and codes on his gate. He had her stuff packed up and waiting when she arrived. He said that she insisted her mother and sister were lieing.
What else he found out was she is on some sort of meds for mental problems (don't know which kind) and she occasionally skips them as they make her feel "different."
He loaded her stuff in her car and put her out and told her to leave him alone and he didn't believe her. To me he seemed to be a little down-in-the-dumps but his mother and sisters insist that he is heart-broken. He did ask to go to out mountain land this coming weekend with me and his little brother. Unless I'm mistaken he's wanting to get in some trigger time. Gonna let the big dogs eat.
As to the vasectomy: He said the doctors refused because of his age and that he had no children and has never been married. He checked over five doctors and all said the same and religion had nothing to do with it. He said he has an appointment with the department doctor (he's a fire fighter) and is going to insist on getting the snip done. I asked him why he didn't want kids and he said that he didn't think he would be a good father and he already has 9 nieces and nephews and a little sister and brother. I told him that IMO he's a great brother to his siblings especially to the younger ones and it's in our will that if something happens to his mother and I before his brother is 18 that he's to take care of his brother. He said that his older sisters or brother would be a much better choice than him.

[Blue Ginger]

A follow-up: He broke up with the girl but before having done so he changed the locks on his home and codes on his gate. He had her stuff packed up and waiting when she arrived. He said that she insisted her mother and sister were lieing.

Good on him for doing this. It is probably the best thing he could have done.

I asked him why he didn't want kids and he said that he didn't think he would be a good father and he already has 9 nieces and nephews and a little sister and brother. I told him that IMO he's a great brother to his siblings especially to the younger ones and it's in our will that if something happens to his mother and I before his brother is 18 that he's to take care of his brother. He said that his older sisters or brother would be a much better choice than him.

You need to have a proper discussion with all the siblings and find someone that does want to be a guardian to take care of any under 18 kids. The best option would be someone that either already has kids or wants them. Then you need to change the will to reflect this.

My whole family has finally accepted that I will never have kids, but I love being an aunty. My sister is yet to have kids (she wants 2) and my brother has 1 with his ex. We had a family discussion when our Nana passed a few years ago about what would happen to any kids in the family. If anything happens to my brother and his ex, their son will be looked after by our parents or sister (depends on age of all). If anything happens to sister and BIL, the kids will go to our parents or brother. I will continue to be Aunty, but will only have custody as a last resort or if it's a short term thing, e.g.: don't want to leave area in final year of schooling.

In my case, my mental health comes first. I am ok on my own but cannot be responsible for anyone else. I need my space and quiet time in order to function. Just being aunty for 1 day leaves me exhausted for 2-3 days afterwards. And my nephew is a really good and chilled nearly 3 year old.

I don't know what your stepson's reasons are for not wanting to be a parent, but you need to listen if he wants to share them. And respect them. Kids are not for everyone.

[Tanasi]

Good on him for doing this. It is probably the best thing he could have done.

You need to have a proper discussion with all the siblings and find someone that does want to be a guardian to take care of any under 18 kids. The best option would be someone that either already has kids or wants them. Then you need to change the will to reflect this.

FYI: He's my kid not a step sorry for the confusion, my youngest son is adopted.
To be fair when we composed this version of our will we did ask him first and he agreed, we also asked our youngest and he wanted his Bubba and his Sissy (youngest daughter 19) had to come along.
All three of my youngest spend a lot of time together either working around the farm or playing.
I know my three oldest would gladly raise him but they already have kids (9 between them.) I don't know how far to push him for his thoughts about the no child thing. I'll give it a few days before pushing any further than I already have. When I was his age I didn't want kids mostly because I didn't think I would be very good Dad not to mention with all my scars I was positive no woman would have me, thankfully I was wrong about the latter and the jury is still out on the former.

[Blue Ginger]

To be fair when we composed this version of our will we did ask him first and he agreed, we also asked our youngest and he wanted his Bubba and his Sissy (youngest daughter 19) had to come along.

Ok, that makes better sense. Maybe it's time to re-look at the guardianship of the younger kids again though. Things change and what might have been good when the will was written may not be good now. I always tell people to re-look at their arrangements at least every 5 years. (I'm only 33 but have seen too many family dramas regarding old wills. This includes one part of the family where the executor had died 25 years before the person who written the will. No one had looked at it in about 35 years.)

I don't know how far to push him for his thoughts about the no child thing. I'll give it a few days before pushing any further than I already have. When I was his age I didn't want kids mostly because I didn't think I would be very good Dad not to mention with all my scars I was positive no woman would have me, thankfully I was wrong about the latter and the jury is still out on the former.

Maybe don't push him at the moment regarding kids. He has already dealt with a big change in breaking up with his gf. Given him a chance to unwind and relook at his own situation first. Maybe in a couple of weeks bring up the guardianship.

Just an FYI, there are a few levels of not wanting kids. Some people don't want them right now or in the near future. Some don't want them unless certain conditions are meet, e.g. good job, the right partner, a house, etc. Some are open to the idea of adopting, fostering, mentoring or guardianship. And some people don't want them at all (childfree).

Regarding the 'good dad' part. Good dad's listen and then respect the decisions their kids make even if they don't completely agree. Sure, you can say 'what the fuck' but you still need to listen. If your son decides that he doesn't want kids ever or decides that he doesn't want guardianship of the younger ones, you just need to respect that. It doesn't mean he loves them or you any less, it just means that he sees his life going in a different direction.

From what I've read regarding the current situation, you are being a good dad even though the 'no kids' thing has clearly thrown you for a loop.

[Racket_Man]

I ran the story by my wife. She doesn't completely buy it, though you did say "grain of salt". Because her argument is if a miscarriage almost kills you, you probably don't try again to have another baby. Let alone two more times.
.

TO be fair medicine may not have pin pointed the cause until after the 2d miscarriage. I do not remember all of the circumstances in the story. To be fair one miscarriage + almost dying =/= not always kill off any hope of children.

My Ex wanted more children even though she had problems the first time through. Serious Problems...... even after several major surgeries and being told 9 months of bedrest AND major problems predicted with any pregnancy she still wanted to try but we (Dr's and me) convinced her it was not worth it to die.