I had to be sucky AGAIN

[Mongo Skruddgemire]

This is a continuation of this thread from a while back.

Son of a #$%^ing bitch but rhapsody is at it again.

It would appear that if a debit card is canceled, merchants have some mystical power to force the charge through ANYWAY!

Since the debit card is attached to a bank account, they have the power to run the charge through even though the card no longer exists since even though you change card numbers, the account number behind it remains the same.

When asked about it...our bank's corporate office told us that our only hope was to close the account and to reopen a new one. Also with sadistic glee telling us that since we are currently overdrawn the odds of us getting a new account are at the whim of the local branch manager.

In short they told us that we were F U C K E D !

My wife went to the local branch and told the manager the whole story. Manager said that in 17 years of her being in the banking industry, she has never heard of such. She made a few calls and found out that Yes indeed, agressive merchants like AOL and Real.com (parent company of Rhapsody) can decide to grab the rough hewn stick and anally violate us at whim.

The good news however.

When dealing with Real.com, demand that they send you to level 2 support in the United States Corporate HQ (I'll see if my wife still has the number and post it later). My wife talked to some guy there and politely but very firmly told them what was going on. The person verified that in the past 4 months I have not used the service at all and in fact only logged once in March for 15 seconds...not enough time to listen to a single song. He will be issuing us a check for the past 4 months of charges.

Our Bank looked at our past banking statement and found out that there were $80 in charges that we didn't authorize in just the past two weeks. No goddamn wonder we're bouncing checks left-right-and center. Our manager is giving us a new account and as soon as my wife's direct deposit hits the old account tomorrow, the full amount (not counting the overdraft we're running right now...all of it) will be transferred to the new account and we will be given a fresh start. Also as an additional bonus, they are going to pull a report going back to January 2007 so we can try to figure out what is a real charge and what isn't. We're not likely to get the money back, but she may be able to reverse some of the overdraft fees especially if those fradulent charges were responsible for running us over.

For anything that needs a recurring charge (Cingular and Blockbuster), we're going to get a pre-paid Visa card. That way if anything bites us on the ass again, we can drop the card and they can't get any money from our bank since the card is attached to nothing and Visa isn't going to pay a dime unless there is money there to spend.

End result? We're staying with our bank which is very helpful and doesn't think that we're irresponsible schmucks bouncing checks willy-nilly. All of the companies who are on us like a pack of table scrap pilfering grabasses aren't going to get another fucking dime from me ever again and we get a fresh start with an account we can not worry and can know that the amount in the check register is the same as what is in the bank.

Moral of the story? TRUST NO ONE! At least don't trust any company that requires a recurring charge. Cover your ass with a disposable pre-paid card.

Mongo

[ditchdj]

Your problem sounds hauntingly similar to what a Ms. Rachel Poor had to contend with....

http://redtape.msnbc.com/2007/05/id_thief_bounce.html

Say, you wouldnt happen to bank with this particular scumbag bank would you??? If so then all you can do is just sit at home and get used to watching the big red numbers on your account get bigger and bigger.

[Jadedcarguy]

And there you have the reason I am leaving B of A for my credit union. The people in the local B of A branches are very helpful, but when you have to deal with corporate, where the real shit goes down, you might as well explain your problem to a tree.

I have been with B of A for 14 years, and I tried to get vehicle financing through them. I figured it wouldn't be difficult since I had been there for a long time. WRONG. They told me my credit was not good enough to justify this kind of loan. I'm thinking WTF? I knew I wasn't perfect but I didn't think I was that bad. I went to the credit union on the advice of a friend, and opened a savings account and applied for my loan. Not knowing me from Adam, they gave me a loan for over $30K within a couple of days! Oh, and my "poor credit score" that B of A mentioned? Over 700. What did the want? 850?

That's just one of the reasons that B of A can kiss my ass.

[FuzzyKitten99]

This is a continuation of this thread from a while back.

Son of a #$%^ing bitch but rhapsody is at it again.

It would appear that if a debit card is canceled, merchants have some mystical power to force the charge through ANYWAY!

Since the debit card is attached to a bank account, they have the power to run the charge through even though the card no longer exists since even though you change card numbers, the account number behind it remains the same.

having worked for a major national bank, I can give you some behind-the-counter knowledge...

The numbers on the card are only linked to the account via Visa or Mastercard (depending on who your bank uses). They control the account number on the card itself and it has nothing to do with your account number at your bank, only the fact that it is electronically linked. Once that card is cancelled, for your account protection, that link is permanently broken, and there is no way a merchant can put the card through anymore *except* if you have a recurring draft on that card number with say, your phone bill company. Since the account is set for a recurring draft, that company has a special authorization they submit it under, so they can continue to use the same info you gave them, even if the card has been cancelled.

Otherwise, no store merchant can run the card itself, as it will just come up as declined.

[chainedbarista]

from where i sit, that's more than just poor customer service, it's a total LACK of service. whatever happened to immediate flags on suspicious activity, followed up by a call to the account owner to verify the activity? apparently, bank of america fails to understand the most basic actions when handling these situations, resulting in ms. poor's paying dearly for their lackluster policies.

i'm glad our credit union does pay attention to these things; in today's world, secure simply isn't secure enough!

[Mongo Skruddgemire]

having worked for a major national bank, I can give you some behind-the-counter knowledge...

The numbers on the card are only linked to the account via Visa or Mastercard (depending on who your bank uses). They control the account number on the card itself and it has nothing to do with your account number at your bank, only the fact that it is electronically linked. Once that card is cancelled, for your account protection, that link is permanently broken, and there is no way a merchant can put the card through anymore *except* if you have a recurring draft on that card number with say, your phone bill company. Since the account is set for a recurring draft, that company has a special authorization they submit it under, so they can continue to use the same info you gave them, even if the card has been cancelled.

Otherwise, no store merchant can run the card itself, as it will just come up as declined.

And therein lies the problem. I had a recurring draft with Rhapsody. When the card came back the first time as declined, they let me know that there was a problem. I told them that the card and the card number was gone and was very polite about it...they assured me that the account was canceled. The second time a week later they bugged me about it I was less than polite. Again they told me that the account was closed and that was that.

Now is when they decided to ram the account through via the method you described. There are also other companies (I'm assuming they nailed me the same way Fandango's bonus partner did) and are likewise ramming through with the special authorization.

With the new account and the old one being closed they will not do so again and if I need to do business with any company that has a recurring draft setup...is going on a pre-paid visa card so if someone is nailing me again I can empty the card, shred it, and buy a new one and transfer my recurring payments to it.

Thus keeping my bank account isolated and protected.

It sucks that we have to now be so goddamn anal about our debit cards anymore. That people out there can't or won't take "I don't want your service anymore" for an answer.

M

[wagegoth]

BofA is one of the worst, and they have been for years.

Many years ago, when I was a kid, my parents had both personal and business accounts with BofA for years. Just like Jadedcarguy, they went in to get an auto loan and were turned down. They immediately closed all their accounts, walked down the street to another bank, opened the accounts and were immediately given a car loan. The topper was that they had enough in their saving account alone to have paid cash for the car; they just didn't want to empty their reserves.

[Jadedcarguy]

BofA is one of the worst, and they have been for years.

Many years ago, when I was a kid, my parents had both personal and business accounts with BofA for years. Just like Jadedcarguy, they went in to get an auto loan and were turned down. They immediately closed all their accounts, walked down the street to another bank, opened the accounts and were immediately given a car loan. The topper was that they had enough in their saving account alone to have paid cash for the car; they just didn't want to empty their reserves.

Glad I'm not the only one. I almost took it personal.

It begs the question, "What kind of credit does B of A require to finance a car?"

[Jester]

My credit union rocks, and I will dearly miss them when I finally move out of the Keys and back to Phoenix. Because, although my credit sucks like a porn star, they gave me a loan without knowing me from Adam for my computer many years ago. Got that paid off, several years later, even though I have not always been great with the account (I am getting better), they are the bank that the dealership went through to finance the new Jestermobile. Despite my credit, despite my sometimes shakey history with that very credit union, they still gave me the dough to get my wheels. And they are always great when I have problems, whether they are problems I caused myself or those that I did not cause.

I think I'll be looking into the credit union my mom belongs to when I get back to the desert.

[BookstoreEscapee]

Your problem sounds hauntingly similar to what a Ms. Rachel Poor had to contend with....

http://redtape.msnbc.com/2007/05/id_thief_bounce.html

:

Has anyone else noticed the irony of her name?

<was going to add a smiley but the story is not a smiley story>

[BlackIronCrown]

Damn straight.
And people wonder why I remain with the old-fashioned check-and-cash system.

[Andara Bledin]

Your problem sounds hauntingly similar to what a Ms. Rachel Poor had to contend with....

http://redtape.msnbc.com/2007/05/id_thief_bounce.html

Say, you wouldnt happen to bank with this particular scumbag bank would you??? If so then all you can do is just sit at home and get used to watching the big red numbers on your account get bigger and bigger.

BofA is one of the worst, and they have been for years.

I had the exact same problems with Wells Fargo. All big banks suck. ALL of them. None of them are really any better than any of the others. The only difference is whether or not they happen to suck for you at the time you're using it.

I have Bank of America, I have never had an issue, and I have been victimized by thieves on two separate occaisions, and all I ever had to do to get all charges reversed was to make a single phone call to customer service. BofA has been nothing but good to me. For my mother and aunt's business account, however, they couldn't have found their asses with both hands.

And two of the managers at my work (who are married) have had similar difficulties with the loan department at Washington Mutual. Everything else is ok, but the loan department seems to be staffed by several villages worth of idiots.

You can't really compare banks to credit unions. Even though they do mostly the same things, credit unions are notoriously better for getting loans. If you really need a loan, find a credit union. If you want convenient ATM locations, get a regular bank account and hope your luck is good.

Once that card is cancelled, for your account protection, that link is permanently broken, and there is no way a merchant can put the card through anymore *except* if you have a recurring draft on that card number with say, your phone bill company. Since the account is set for a recurring draft, that company has a special authorization they submit it under, so they can continue to use the same info you gave them, even if the card has been cancelled.

And that right there is why I have always and will continue to avoid any form of automatic payment plan offered. I specifically arrange for manual payments whenever remotely feasible, as that way, I control when the money leaves my account, and if necessary, I can make alternate arrangements. Yes, I sometimes forget and pay late, but at least I know that if something goes bad with the other company, I won't be footing the bill for their mistakes.

Oh, and I'm not surprised that Real.com is the culprit behind this. I knew they had issues long ago, when I finally gave up on even trying to download their media player, much less actually use it.

^-.-^