State of My Mom's Estate

[Ghel]

I just called Stagecoach mortgage to make sure they got my fax from yesterday. Apparently, they do have me listed as being authorized to get information on the account, but they haven't processed my fax yet. I was told it takes 24-48 hours to process faxes, since they get "thousands" a day.

When I expressed my frustration at how long every step in this process takes, the woman said, "I'm sorry you feel that way." The classic not-pology. I called her out on it, too. "You're apologizing for my feelings, not that it's taking so long. Nice."

She had to ask me for at least half a dozen different things before she would talk to me: my stepdad's full name, my mom's full name, the property address, the phone number, my stepdad's social security number, the loan number... The phone number on the account was not a phone number Mom had ever had. So I gave her my home phone number, which I had included on both the faxes I'd sent them. She said they couldn't update the phone number on an account by fax, it has to be done over the phone.

And she had to repeat the disclaimer that was already given out by the automated system. I said, "I hope someone is listening to this call, so they know how bad your processes are."

[CrazedClerkthe2nd]

I'm not sure where to start, but I need to, um, vent. My mom died in October. I've been talking about her hoarding and the "finds" we've discovered while cleaning out her house in this thread.

Mom had a house, a truck, and an atv, all of which have loans against them. She had a couple small credit cards. I thought that was it for debt (bad enough).

She had two life insurance policies, one that (thankfully) has me and my brother listed as beneficiaries and one that still has her late husband listed as beneficiary. She had a checking and savings totaling about $7000 with the credit union (the same place she had the atv loan), but that was it for deposit accounts. She also had a checking account that was the life insurance from when her husband died in March.

I was/am on the checking account at the CU, but that's moot now. They put a freeze on the account as soon as I told them she'd died, so I couldn't use the accounts to pay her past due utility bills. When I didn't pay off the atv loan within a month after she died, the CU took the money out of the checking account to pay down the atv loan, leaving another $1800 owing on the loan. I'm disappointed that they didn't call me before doing that, but they do have right of setoff per the loan documents.

The mortgage and truck loan, as well as the insurance on both, are with a national bank featuring a stagecoach in their logo. They've been just awful to deal with. Apparently, both the loans were past due the day Mom died. I don't know why - the payments were set up on automatic payment and she had enough money in the checking account. Now it's almost 2 months since she died and Stagecoach is calling and leaving a message on her answering machine every day. It doesn't matter that I tell them that she's dead. They won't take the account off the autodialer as long as it's past due, and the person who gets connected to us doesn't have a chance to look at the account notes before they get connected.

It doesn't help that Stagecoach Mortgage doesn't talk to Stagecoach Auto Loans doesn't talk to Stagecoach Insurance. So even if I do manage to get through to one of them, I have to call the others, too, and have the same conversation.

More to come.

One thing that might help is what's referred to as an executive email carpet bomb. Basically you go to stagecoach.com and go to the corporate section, there you should be able to find names of the senior executives.

So if the Company CEO is John Smith, send an email to johnsmith@stagecoach.com or john.smith@stagecoach.com. Send CCs to any other executive you see on the list you think might be able to help you.

Last year I was getting a runaround from my mortgage company (NOT stagecoach) and after six phone calls had failed to resolve the problem I tried the EECB technique. Within four days we were contacted by a VERY nice and professional executive secretary who got everything taken care of for us.

I'm not saying this WILL work, but it's worked for many people in the past. It only takes a few minutes to do so it might be worth a shot in your case.

[Sapphire Silk]

I'm not sure if the life insurance will be paid to the estate or to my brother and me individually, but that might have to go into the estate account.

Good news for you: life insurance pays to the beneficiary, not the estate. That money is YOURS, and the bank can't touch it. Don't give it up.

When my dad died, he had a number of insurance polices. Most were made out to Mom as beneficiary. One, for about 5K, still had my grandparents as beneficiary (Grandpa had died 15 years prior to this). I contacted the insurance company, got a claim form sent to my aunt (who was Grandma's caretaker), and sent Grandma (via my aunt) the policy so she could make the claim.

A year later, the insurance company calls me since my aunt never filed the claim. I asked what would happen if Grandma died without filing it. They told me my aunt had an obligation to file the claim (as a good caretaker), but that if she didn't the money would go to Grandma's estate, and not to my Mother because Grandma was the beneficiary.

I just realized I hadn't posted an update about the truck.

Now Stagecoach Auto will sell the truck at auction, getting much less than it's worth, and not enough to pay off the loan. Any deficiency will be charged against the estate, as part of that unsecured debt that gets paid last.

How stupid. Guess they were afraid you'd "disappear" it. But that's on them. It's their loss . . . well I guess it's yours since you put money out to try and sell it. That sucks.

[Ghel]

Good news for you: life insurance pays to the beneficiary, not the estate.

Except there's no living beneficiary listed on the life insurance. Mom didn't update it after her husband died. So I'm not sure how it's going to work. The paperwork requested the names of any heirs, so I filled in my brother's and my information. Hopefully, it will come to us directly. But we'll have to see.

How stupid. Guess they were afraid you'd "disappear" it. But that's on them. It's their loss . . . well I guess it's yours since you put money out to try and sell it. That sucks.

Yeah. Their procedures leave much to be desired. When I got home today, I had a voicemail from the insurance company covering the truck. It said that Statecoach Auto had filed a claim on the insurance over the truck. They were closed for the evening/weekend when I tried to call back, so I'll have to call them on Monday. Probably all I'll be able to tell them is "I don't know." I don't know the history of the truck, whether it was in any accidents, or anything. All I know is that it was in working condition when we put it up for sale.

I wonder if it has something to do with that big dent (well, really more of a gash - it goes about halfway down the side of the truck). I don't know how it happened or whether they ever filed a claim regarding it, so I still won't be any help. I guess it doesn't really matter. I'll answer whatever questions the insurance has. I know they can't come after me for whatever to do with the truck, so I'm not really worried about it.

[Ghel]

More annoyances and Possible good news

It's a mixed bag right now. I just found out last week that one of Mom's credit cards was secured by her house. So that's another $6000 we'll have to pay when we sell the house.

Stagecoach Home Mortgage called Saturday morning (woke me up, damn them) to offer me "options" to avoid foreclosure. Most of the options required me to assume the loan, which I'm not about to do. I don't want any of my mom's debts showing up on my credit report. (duh) But one of the options sounded like it might work. The caller said they might be able to offer me up to $3000 to do a deed in lieu of foreclosure. Basically, I sign over the house to the mortgage company, and I don't have to worry about the mortgage. I asked what the qualifications are. She didn't know, and the department that handles that was closed for the weekend.

So I called the number she gave me on Monday. Go through verification. It was the wrong department. They give me the number for the foreclosure department, and tried to transfer me. I got disconnected. I called the number, go through the verification process again, and it's still not the right department. The guy says he'll put me on hold and dial up the right department, and when I come back he'll still be there. So I wait on hold for about 10 minutes. When the phone picks up again, it's a very snippy woman asking for my full name. I tell her. Then she asks what company I'm calling from. WTF? I tell her I'm not calling from a company, I'm the personal representative of the estate. And where's Derrick? He's not there, so I have to go through the verification process a third time. I finally get a chance to explain why I called. What does the estate have to do to qualify for the $3000 incentive for the deed in lieu?

On hold again. Only for a minute this time. That $3000? It's only for reimbursement of moving expenses, so it doesn't apply to an estate account. Well, thanks for nothing.

But it's not all bad. Both life insurance companies sent checks directly to my brother and me, instead of to the estate. So that's money we can keep, free and clear. I'm pretty sure the one insurance paid the funeral bill, too. I need to call the funeral home today to make sure. But that's one less thing I need to worry about.

I also had a VM from the realtor saying he has an offer on the house. I'm going to call him in a bit and find out the details. If it's enough to pay off the mortgages, pay the realtor's commission, and cover the attorney's fees, I'll be happy. Any extra will be icing. I already know I'm not getting anything out of the sale of the house, as I mentioned upthread, but it would be nice to get back the money I spent on utilities and getting the house ready to sell.

[taxguykarl]

Both life insurance companies sent checks directly to my brother and me, instead of to the estate. So that's money we can keep, free and clear.

Even better than that--it's tax-expempt (Pubilcation 525, page 21. I hope the sale goes well enough to cover your expenses.

[Ghel]

Thanks, Karl! That's good to know.

I talked to the realtor. The offer was $30,000. That's not even enough to pay off the loans, much less the realtor's commission. He's supposed to be calling me back with a suggestion of what to counter offer.

The county real estate tax value is $42,000. We should be able to get at least that, even with the slightly run down condition of the house.

[Sapphire Silk]

It's a mixed bag right now. I just found out last week that one of Mom's credit cards was secured by her house. So that's another $6000 we'll have to pay when we sell the house.

I already know I'm not getting anything out of the sale of the house, as I mentioned upthread, but it would be nice to get back the money I spent on utilities and getting the house ready to sell.

If you end up doing a short sale where you get less than the mortgage amount, then that creditor will have to fight it out with the Stagecoach for their money, NOT you. You are in no way responsible for that debt, so don't let them tell you otherwise!

But yeah, if there's debt secured on the house you'll have to pay it before you can take any profit on the house. Honestly, I would not have put any money into the house at all. I would have cleaned out Mom's stuff and just let the bank take it in foreclosure. It will not affect your credit, so it's not your problem.

Thanks, Karl! That's good to know.

I talked to the realtor. The offer was $30,000. That's not even enough to pay off the loans, much less the realtor's commission. He's supposed to be calling me back with a suggestion of what to counter offer.

The county real estate tax value is $42,000. We should be able to get at least that, even with the slightly run down condition of the house.

Make sure you sell the house "as is," to prevent a future buyer from coming after you when problems with the house crop up (and they will). Negotiate with the buyer; he doesn't expect you to take the offer. I'd counter at $45K and settle for the 42K if that's what you need.

[Ghel]

If you end up doing a short sale where you get less than the mortgage amount, then that creditor will have to fight it out with the Stagecoach for their money, NOT you. You are in no way responsible for that debt, so don't let them tell you otherwise!

Right. I'm not going to do a short sale. I'm either going to get enough in the sale of the house to pay off the mortgages, or I'm going to let Stagecoach foreclose. And I'm not going to do anything that would make this show up on my credit.

But yeah, if there's debt secured on the house you'll have to pay it before you can take any profit on the house. Honestly, I would not have put any money into the house at all. I would have cleaned out Mom's stuff and just let the bank take it in foreclosure. It will not affect your credit, so it's not your problem.

What I knew about my mom's debts has changed a lot since she died. I was hoping to get some money out of selling the house, but now all I can hope for is to get paid back for the money I've already put in, before I knew about the huge debt she owed. I haven't paid the utilities for the past two months, but I may need to do that soon.

Make sure you sell the house "as is," to prevent a future buyer from coming after you when problems with the house crop up (and they will). Negotiate with the buyer; he doesn't expect you to take the offer. I'd counter at $45K and settle for the 42K if that's what you need.

The realtor suggested we counter at $47,500, to get a feel for what the potential buyer is willing to give, so that's what we did. <crosses fingers>