Troubles With The Jestermobile

[Jester]

So recently, whenever I've gone to start the vaunted Jestermobile, it seems to have struggled a bit. Very recently, those struggles have gotten downright worrisome: not only would it take longer to start than usual, but it seemed to be turning over much, much slower. Almost wheezing, if you would. So I did what any other red-blooded American male would do: I called my mechanic.

I described the symptoms to my mechanic over the phone, and theorized that it was either the starter, alternator, or battery, but if I had to guess, probably the starter. My mechanic agreed that it was probably one of those three, but his guess as it was the battery. He also said that would be the cheapest, easiest, and quickest fix.

So, given the best guess of someone who is experiencing the problem as opposed to someone who has merely had the problem described to them over the phone, who would you say was correct? If you said "the trained, experienced, professional mechanic," as opposed to, say, "the bartender that knows only the slightest bit more than dick about cars," you would be absolutely correct. Even with my very questionable description, my mechanic nailed it.

The bad news is that it cost me money I had not foreseen spending. The good news is that it was easily and quickly fixed, for less money than either of the other issues would have cost, and the Jestermobile is back to starting up absolutely instantly, like she used to. Money well spent!

[wolfie]

In a situation like this, there are a couple zero-to-low cost measures you can take to further narrow the problem.

First, turn on the dome light, and watch it while starting the car. Does it stay bright, or does it get really dim? This is more helpful in a "won't start" situation than a "sluggish start" situation. If it stays bright, it means that battery voltage is not being drawn down - something is blocking current from getting to the starter. Could be a bad connection, or could be something internal in the starter. If it gets very dim, the battery voltage is being drawn down a long way. Either the battery doesn't have enough "juice" (whether it's because it can't hold it due to deterioration, or the alternator not putting enough in), or the starter is trying to pull too much out.

Get a friend with a known-good vehicle to do a jump start with GOOD cables. Does the problem persist? If so, it's probably the starter motor. If not, it's probably either the battery or charging system.

Don't give the mechanic the diagnosis from these, merely the raw data (i.e. "When I tried starting with the dome light on, it got very dim. When I got a jump start from a friend, the 'slow cranking reluctant to start' issue didn't go away"). Remember that if you bring in a diagnosis "The starter's bad - replace it", he'll do that, and you've got the bill regardless of whether or not that was the problem. If you bring in a set of symptoms, it's up to him to find where the problem really is. The extra symptoms (dome light, response to a jump) help him track things down and could save a bit of time (which you're paying for).

[Victory Sabre]

Well, at least it was a cheap fix, and you didn't have to do what I had to do once: change a battery in my car when it was -30 F outside. That wasn't fun.

[mathnerd]

I don't have anything to add to what Wolfie said.

[LesserSouthernFroglet]

I've had a couple of starters go, usually what happens when you turn the key is a CLICK and nothing. Everything else electrical works. Sometimes a firm whack with a hammer on the starter itself will persuade it to work, but that's a short term fix.

Unless the battery is completely, totally dead, a few wheezy turns of the motor usually means the starter is at least trying.

These days I keep a jump starter at home - I have a motorcycle and a ride-on mower that tend to lose charge when they're not in use. The mower is bad, it tends to completely discharge the battery over a few days. Yeah I know, time for a new battery.

[bhskittykatt]

You should be able to take it in to an auto part store and they can test the battery for free. Many of the ones around here do, at least. Just drive in, yank out your battery, and they put it on a machine that does...magic, I guess. If your alternator is easy to remove, they can often test that as well.

[Buzzard]

Even better, some auto parts stores have the gear to test all 3 possibilities.

The battery, once fully charged (usually can get this for free at parts store) gets a quick load-test to determine if it can hold enough power to properly spin the starter.

Alternator gets a similar load-test by taking the meter out to the vehicle and testing while the engine is running. (can also pull the alternator out and bring it inside store, but is usually more labor-intensive than just taking the car down)

The starter is the one thing that would pretty much be required to pull off to test as an individual item. If you've already tested battery and alternator, there's only the starter, starter relay and wiring that can be the problem. Wiring can usually be eyeballed and/or reach in and feel for corrosion/breaks that impede flow. Starter relay is directly between the battery and starter, usually on/near the starter itself. If the relay isn't working, you'd have strange clicks and/or no cranking at all.

As for the lights dimming while cranking, that's... not the most telling sign, really. Lights take a small amount of amps (aside from the headlights, most lights/radio will draw maybe a couple dozen amps FOR EVERYTHING), while the starter draws several hundred amps (400+, usually) That huge draw *IS& going to make some things dim some. I've noticed in more modern cars, when the starter is engaged, most/all accessories get killed briefly, to save load on battery/save electronics from weird power fluctuations.

[protege]

Sometimes a firm whack with a hammer on the starter itself will persuade it to work, but that's a short term fix.

It's also a last resort...as it can damage the starter's internals.

[Jester]

Luckily for me, my mechanic is both a good guy AND he knows I'm an idiot mechanically, so he takes my opinion with a huge shaker of salt. Just because I think it might be the starter doesn't mean he's going to assume it's the starter. He's the kind of guy that says, "Well, maybe it's that, but it might be this too, so let's check." He tries to save me money, which is why I keep going back to him. If he was out to rip me off, or just follow my untrained guesses at what was wrong with my vehicle, he would not still be my mechanic all these years later.

[dalesys]

... doesn't mean he's going to assume it's the starter...

First, I'm going to check the twister on the back end of the key...

[mathnerd]

First, I'm going to check the twister on the back end of the key...

Jester's not quite that mechanically incompetent. Close, but not quite.

[Kittish]

I think dalesys was referring to the person at the end of the key. Sort of like a pebcak issue, only automotive.

[dalesys]

I plead the 404th Amendment: I refuse to answer on the grounds I may get trolled... for shark bait...

[mathnerd]

I think dalesys was referring to the person at the end of the key. Sort of like a pebcak issue, only automotive.

Yes, I know. Hence my response that Jester's not quite that incompetent. Sort of.

[wolfie]

I plead the 404th Amendment: I refuse to answer on the grounds I may get trolled... for shark bait...

But CS rules prohibit talking about committing a violent act. Trolling you for shark bait would be a violation of that rule. You've got to be mistaken, chum.

Did you intend to leave the "straightline" for a bad pun lying around for anyone to pounce on?