PUPPIES!!!!!

[draggar]

Not yet BUT we're expecting a breeding. No, don't worry, this isn't any puppy mill or back-yard breeder trash (or worse, designer mutts like Cockerpoos), but two very high quality German shepherds will be bred this summer.

3x Sptz.V Leri Unesco SchH3,Kkl1"a" will be bred to Fay Van Corsalabroek HIC!!!

Both dogs have incredible temperaments and physique plus are also intelligent, confident (Fayr (a.k.a. Kiri) is often the only GSD in the AKC show ring not afraid of the judge and wagging her tail), love to work and please their pack members, are hard workers, have excellent structure, and are both of incredible lines.

We're expecting the breeding to be this summer with the puppies born early fall. We already have a waiting list of 10-15 people who want puppies (we're going to expect 8-10 puppies from this litter). One of my wife's best friends has volunteered to stay with us to help us with raising the puppies, too.

Kiri received a rating of "SG-1" (no, not StarGate) at a Seiger show (the highest rating she qualified for), where the judge said:

You see a large female with very good expression. Very good top and underline. Very good movement. Excellent angulation. Very good chest proportion and excellent movement."

And from the same show, Fred Lanting wrote:

In the Youth (12-18mo) female class, I got a blue ribbon for Sara and Ed's Winner Assaut daughter appropriately named Fayr (pronounced "fire") but call-named Kiri. A lively but untrained-to-lead-out bitch who should do pretty well based on her anatomy, if not her slightly masculine expression. Owners and dog are lucky to have each other - great temperament in all.

[tropicsgoddess]

Kiri is one gorgeous dog!!! Can't wait to see the pups!!

[Saydrah]

Draggar,

Perhaps you can shed some light on a finer point of GSD conformation that baffles me. I have seen European/German bred GSDs with everything from extremely roached backs to backs flat as tables, and almost every American bred GSD I see is built so uphill that there is little difference in angle between sitting and walking. Okay, maybe I'm exaggerating, but you know the conformation I'm talking about, right?

Anyway, I have seen a few different analyses of where each different conformation type originated and its original function for performance or show, but I have never seen someone go into details about what degree of slope to the back is optimal for back and hip health. I see your bitch is imported and has A Normal Hips and Elbows listed on her page- is that separate conformationally from the slope of the back, or does that slope affect hip angle as greatly as photos would appear to show in many cases? Which back type in a GSD produces the most healthy hips, shoulders, and back?

I love GSDs (anything with a herding background makes me swoon, and then their faces... so gorgeous!) and have always wondered, if I ever go looking for one, which of the many structural types I should seek out simply for a healthy pet that can go play agility or SH or flyball a couple times a week.

[draggar]

Easy, Americans generally don't breed German shepherds, in fact, some have requested that they no longer be called German shepherds due to issues that you've mentioned along with many other reasons (conficence, intelligence, drive, etc..).

I agree with you, I've referred to American bred German Shepherds (I've started to call them American Shepherds) as very "triangular" since the hind legs are so short. Could you imagine one of those dogs spending a day herding? They wouldn't last and their hips will wear out in no time.

If you want to read out real German Shepherds, there is a book by Fred Lanting, "The Total German Shepherd" (http://www.fredlanting.org). (Do not go to nor purchase the book from FredLanting.com, it is an illegal copy and an illegal site). Fred used to be an AKC judge but got fired for "questionable judging pratices" (he gave breed to a puppy who didn't shy away from him but all of the other dogs did, even though the AKC standard states "must show confidence"). Do a Google Search for Fred Lanting, he has many articles on that site (the .org) and on http://www.siriusdog.com (another site that Fred works with). Also look up Seiger standards (the true German Shepherd standard) and if working is your thing, look up DVG (Schutzhund).

Look at Kiri's pedigree, you can trace it all the way back to the first German shepherd:
http://www.pedigreedatabase.com/gsd/...ee/494196.html

You won't see any American dogs here.

(And if people think American bred dogs are so superior, why does out military and most police departments import their dogs (German Shepherds and Malinois) from Germany, Belgium, and France?).

Here is a picture of a real German Shepherd, during WWII:



Notice the straight back, defined head and chest and confident expression. You would have seen this in the US until the late 70s early 80s until one GSD was bred and rebred then his offspring was bred and rebred and it completely killed the breed into the cowardly triangles we see today.

If you see a GSD from 1927 (when the breed was still very young):


This is more or less a "continental shepherd" (which became the Belgian Malinois).

If you really want to take a trip into the past, Horwan was the first official German Shepherd ever registered.


Of course, I should also include the single dog credited for ruining the breed in America, I give you lance of Fran-Joe!
(note the severe slope in the back)

[Saydrah]

Oooh now that WWII dog... NICE! I'll take two! *grabs the REAL GSD and runs*

Excellent explanation, thank you! I have wondered about this for a while. I suspected that the more functional, sounder dogs are the flatter backed ones, but then again I am not an expert, so I was not sure, and I've heard that there is more power in the hind end in a more sloped dog, which is the only argument I've been able to extract from anyone (besides "It's just how they are") for the functionality of the back structure that looks sort of like a cross between a gazelle and a bullfrog.

Congrats on the upcoming breeding! I am not a very educated pair of eyes when it comes to confo (except with rats and horses) but Kiri is gorgeous, as is the dog she's to be bred to. We can count on puppy pictures riiiiiight??

[draggar]

Nope. No puppy pictures. Not at all. Um, we're raising them Amish, yeah, that's it, and they will think we took their spirit away if we take their pictures.

Yeah, that's it.

(Fameous movie quote:

"Can I take your picture?"

"Nah"

"Oh, I'm sorry, are you afraid it will take your spirit away?"

"Nah, you've got the lens cap on"

[Saydrah]

Oh-oh.


No puppy pictures?




All right CSers, get the pitchforks and torches, we're taking our own!

[draggar]

All right CSers, get the pitchforks and torches, we're taking our own!

Fine, I guess I can post ONE picture.

or two, or three, or four, or five, or six, or ten....

[myswtghst]

Fine, I guess I can post ONE picture.

or two, or three, or four, or five, or six, or ten....

Darn right. After all the angst and drama, we need us some cuteness.

Congratulations and best of luck with the breeding!

[draggar]

Update:

Kiri is offically in heat (has ben foor over a week now), she should be receptive sometime mid week but she is big time flirting with the boys. She's most likely going to be bred mid week and we should have the puppies by late September.

[Supermarket Slave Girl]

Good luck draggar, Kiris' puppies will be gorgeous.

[Saydrah]

Good luck, Draggar and Kiri! WE WANT PREGNANT MOMMY AND PUPPY PHOTOS!

[draggar]

Don't worry, i will try to post pictures.

But, on a sadder note, her father, Winner Vom Assaut, died from bloat (gastric contortion) last week. He wass only 4 and was a favorite to rank very high at this year's Seiger world show in Germany. Apparently his owner / handler / breeder is completely devistated (and rightfully so).

We're hoping to have a Winner clone in our litter.



Edit: Kiri looks exactly like her dad except what the XX chromozone causes.

[Bradester]

Good luck! I'm excited to see photos.

A question for you, off topic. I've had a few people tell me that white shepherds tend to be more nervous and snappish. I'm definitely no GSD expert, but my experience working in a kennel gave the theory some credence. What do you think?

It's terrible what overbreeding has done to the German Shepherd (and the cocker spaniel, and the Labrador, and the golden retriever, etc., etc.). I'm so happy you realize the importance of proper breeding.

[BookstoreEscapee]

Saydrah was asking a question about dogs???

Ooh Doggies!!! They are purty. Can't wait to see babies