I thought being able to keep a job was a *good* thing....

[mjr]

because there is nobody else in the place who does what I do, there is a bit of pride in that fact as well.

Funny you should mention this.

Another story of mine from King of Burgers.

One night one of the managers was talking about how "nobody here is irreplaceable" (in other words, fast food workers are a dime a dozen, and easy to replace).

At the time I'd been working at the same store for about 3.5-4 years. I knew every station at that store, and I was GOOD at it.

I told her, "Ok. Find someone right now who knows as much about this store as I do. Find someone who can run any and all of the stations in this restaurant, and do it well. Find someone who knows more about the traffic patterns and busy periods in this restaurant than I do. Then I'll believe you."

She shut up.

Another separate, but related story:

One morning, I'm the opening manager. So I get there at my usual time (5:15-ish and the restaurant opened at 6) to do my morning paperwork, register setups, etc.

Well, I notice about 20 minutes later, that my kitchen person hasn't arrived yet, so I start setting things up in the kitchen (prepping biscuits, making sure everything is getting up to temp, etc.). Then, about 5 minutes before we open, I notice my front/drive thru person isn't there, either.

So 6 AM rolls around, and I go ahead and open the store.

It went something like this:

Take an order, run back to the kitchen, wash my hands, make the food, take the money, hand out the food, repeat.

For two and a half hours.

Thankfully, it wasn't that slammed, but when you're one person trying to do that all by yourself, a couple of people in the drive thru and a couple up front can really make it hectic.

Anyway, the mid-shift manager (who was also the store manager) arrived for her shift around 8:30 that morning. Her first question to me was, "Where is everybody??" So I told her "I'm it. Nobody else showed up."

So she says, "Why didn't you call me??" to which I replied "I didn't have the time."

So she goes to the kitchen, washes her hands, and takes over back there so I can handle the front, until others come in.

Hectic day, it was.

[mjr]

Woe betide anyone who says something like "why don't you get a real job?!" to a retail worker around me. I HATE that attitude. When I finally got my IT job, Mom was so happy that I'd "finally found a real job." I immediately told her in no uncertain terms that just because someone doesn't sit behind a desk all day doesn't mean that they don't have a "real job" and if the job pays in real money, then it's a "real job." She very meekly apologized about it and made sure to warn Dad not to use that same phrase about my retail work around me.

I think part of the problem, and this is isn't a problem with everyone, but it's somewhat of a societal problem, is this:

"low" wage (whatever you define that to be) = low skills = low ambition = not a "real" job.

I think part of the bigger problem is the ones who work in retail/service who are ambivalent or "don't care", and just want the pay check. I've seen this a lot, or at least gotten the vibe from people.

Though I am of the opinion that people should work to better themselves. If you LIKE being a cashier, work hard to be the best damn cashier you can be. Fastest, most accurate, most friendly, whatever.

If you're a cashier and DON'T want to be, work hard and figure out how to get where you DO want to be. If it's manager, do what you have to in order to make an impression on your superiors to get that promotion.

[Sulhythal]

I think part of the problem, and this is isn't a problem with everyone, but it's somewhat of a societal problem, is this:

"low" wage (whatever you define that to be) = low skills = low ambition = not a "real" job.

I think part of the bigger problem is the ones who work in retail/service who are ambivalent or "don't care", and just want the pay check. I've seen this a lot, or at least gotten the vibe from people.

Though I am of the opinion that people should work to better themselves. If you LIKE being a cashier, work hard to be the best damn cashier you can be. Fastest, most accurate, most friendly, whatever.

If you're a cashier and DON'T want to be, work hard and figure out how to get where you DO want to be. If it's manager, do what you have to in order to make an impression on your superiors to get that promotion.

This might be a Chicken and Egg sort of question, but I'm curious whether the retail/service jobs get the ambivalent and apathetic BECAUSE it's seen as not being a "real" job(wow, I'm so glad I'm doing all this imaginary work...) or it's not seen as a "real" job because so many people in it are ambivalent/apathetic?

Or are both of them because of a third perception problem?

Either way, it's probably a vicious cycle of some type or another

[Food Lady]

Take an order, run back to the kitchen, wash my hands, make the food, take the money, hand out the food, repeat.

For two and a half hours.

You just described all my shifts in our cafe, and if you're closing, you have to get everything cleaned and put away by the time you leave, but stay open until you leave.

[PatchO'Black]

Ah, wouldn't it be nice if, when someone pipes up with the old "real job" comments, that we could go "Okay, you don't think this is a real job? Then we'll stop doing it." and have all the workers stop doing anything for that person...

[mjr]

You just described all my shifts in our cafe, and if you're closing, you have to get everything cleaned and put away by the time you leave, but stay open until you leave.

In that case, I'm surprised you ever get to go home...

[mjr]

This might be a Chicken and Egg sort of question, but I'm curious whether the retail/service jobs get the ambivalent and apathetic BECAUSE it's seen as not being a "real" job(wow, I'm so glad I'm doing all this imaginary work...) or it's not seen as a "real" job because so many people in it are ambivalent/apathetic?

Or are both of them because of a third perception problem?

Either way, it's probably a vicious cycle of some type or another

That's a good question. I don't know. I think that it's probably a perception problem.

Part of it, I think, is how certain jobs are portrayed in the "media". A lot of retail/service jobs have been labeled (fairly or not) as "dead-end". People in general don't like that. Service/Retail jobs have also been given the reputation (again, fair or not) of being "paper hat", where you may have to wear some sort of ridiculous outfit (think the "banana suit") and do things that are "beneath" you, thus humiliating or embarrassing you.

One other thing I think is that people may have the idea that the jobs are either for teenagers, older individuals (like a door greeter, maybe), or those who can't get a different job (usually stereotyped as lower-intelligence).

There are absolutely people who are enthusiastic about the retail/service jobs that they have. They enjoy them immensely. But then again, there are others who are just there (and sometimes don't actually want to be there) to draw a pay check.

Then, what I think happens is that they complain that after working 40 hours a week that they only made $300 before taxes, and they think to themselves, "This sucks" and start to get apathetic and have poor attitudes. Now, they'd rather be hanging out with their friends than working, and so the apathy grows. Sort of a vicious circle, in a way.

I think some don't think it's a real job because they believe that the workers don't make over some arbitrary dollar figure, or are working at some Big Box retailer ("Bullseye", perhaps), or whatever.

I would LOVE to see the day when someone working in a retail establishment has the authority to school a SC questioning them.

[protege]

But then again, there are others who are just there (and sometimes don't actually want to be there) to draw a pay check.

Then, what I think happens is that they complain that after working 40 hours a week that they only made $300 before taxes, and they think to themselves, "This sucks" and start to get apathetic and have poor attitudes. Now, they'd rather be hanging out with their friends than working, and so the apathy grows. Sort of a vicious circle, in a way.

I saw plenty of that when I worked at Hechinger's. Most of the store management (except for the store manager--he was cool. Clueless, but cool.) had a massive chip on their shoulder, and seemed to resent high school or even college-age kids coming to work in the store. Some of those people had been there since the store opened in '85, and were extremely bitter about it. Like it was *our* fault that they got raises in 5-cent increments

The only manager in that place that didn't have a flagpole up their ass, was Dave. He was the night warehouse manager, who was only working at the store for something to do. He had retired, but was bored at home. Driving forklifts and moving things around in the back kept him busy. He was a good guy, and liked what he did.

Most of us got the hell out and went to school and bigger and better things. When I went back to pick up some lumber for a project in '97 (not long before the chain went bankrupt), my bitchy manager (Diane) was still there. I didn't bother to tell her that as a part-time tutor/computer lab assistant...I was making more than she was..and she was a department manager

Oh, and desk jobs aren't all they're cracked up to be. I work for a financial services company...and it sucks. Pay is OK, but the monotony of the job sometimes gets to me. 15 years on, it's not challenging. Rather boring at times. But,it pays the bills. It's allowed me to pay off the school loans, car loans, and has allowed me to do what I want.

[SourRobot]

I haven't worked in retail as long as some of you guys, but I have been in it for a little over five years. I do hate answering the question "How long have you been working here?" that customers tend to ask sometimes. I even rang up one girl who looked familiar, and somewhere in the middle of it she said, "I remember you! Man, you're still here?"

I wasn't in particularly in a terrific mood before that, but I certainly felt like crap afterwards. It does suck when other people in my department don't last long because they find other (sometimes better) jobs and I'm still stuck here, despite still trying to get out.

[EricKei]

SR - Just look them dead in the eye, and with a perfectly straight face and voice, say, "I don't know. I don't remember a time when I was not enslaved to the Corporation...*look around furtively* Run! Run while you still can, before they get you, too!"

[Food Lady]

Oh, and desk jobs aren't all they're cracked up to be. I work for a financial services company...and it sucks. Pay is OK, but the monotony of the job sometimes gets to me. 15 years on, it's not challenging. Rather boring at times. But,it pays the bills. It's allowed me to pay off the school loans, car loans, and has allowed me to do what I want.

See, this is all I want, really. I want enough money to pay off my debts and allow me to not have roommates (well, I don't now, but I struggle to eat sometimes). Yeah, yeah, I'm intelligent and creative, blah blah blah. I don't care if any of that gets used in my job. A job is just the thing that allows me to exist in the physical world, which takes money. My real life is outside of that.