We're closed! Get out!

[Daphne]

Why didn't the idiot just go to Kinko's or something? Can't you print stuff out there too? And to my understanding, most if not all of them, are open 24 hours.

Because that would make sense, Katie

[Jack T. Chance]

My $2.00 worth ('cause 2¢ just wasn't enough!)

Okay, so these weren't my customers. FYI: we close at 9 PM. We begin to make closing announcements at 8:30 PM. Management and security cannot leave until ALL customers are gone.

-=SNIP!=-

The time was 9:50.

Oh my god! What the hell is wrong with people?! I don't even know what took them so long upstairs. They bought a TV. The salesguy seemed a little shellshocked when he came downstairs, so I suppose it wasn't a happy, pretty sale.

I'm sorry, but no sale is worth that! They would've been forcibly ejected from the store by security if they were still there 10 minutes after closing if I was the Store Manager!

I have taken to at times having the "automatic timer" turn off the lights. 1 set about 10 minutes after close the next about 5 minutes later and then the last set about 5 minutes after that. I figure they'll either get the point or shop in the dark. You' would be amazed at he number (ok I forgot the SC mentality we're dealing with for a second, maybe you wouldn't) of people that want to stay a bit longer.

That's a brilliant idea, and not much amazes me anymore. I've had people stay in my mattress store until 10 or 10:30, when it closed at 9, and STILL not buy anything!

That's the one downside to working a job where you work by yourself at least 90% of the time... no big, strong security guards to come to your aid and throw the customer out! :-(

At five minutes before closing, I flip a switch on our automatic doors that lets the door open for someone leaving but not for someone attempting to come in. Does a great job at keeping those last minute people out.

Until the day you get one of those asshats that's so determined to get into the store, that he'll wait around until another customer is exiting, then run in the out door while it's still open!

Of course, some ass clown occasionally stands at the door (I tell my employees not to make eye contact with them) saying something to the effect of, "But it's only 9:57!" when of course we close at 10pm and the store has been open for 14 hours. Sorry, my watch says 10--no sympathy from me.

Now, that's the right way to do it! Once the door is locked and my shingle in the window says "CLOSED", that door is NOT reopening for you, Mr. Iman Asshat!

I'd like to be able to believe people when they say they only need "one thing," but as usual, it's the assholes who say that then stay inside for 10 or 15 minutes that ruin it for everyone else that genuinely would only need one thing.

Yep, it is those people that ruin it for everyone else. But luckily, I don't usually have that problem... in the furniture industry, the average transaction takes anywhere from 30-60 minutes from start to finish, what with having the customers try the different mattresses (or whatever you're selling), ask their questions, get their answers, talk it over with their spouse... at length, of course... then haggle over the price, then writing the order up... so, 30-60 mins. is the AVERAGE, but that means that some customers take a LOT longer. So, if you ain't in my store by 10-15 mins. before the stated closing time, TOUGH SHIT! 'Cause I lock the door 5-10 mins. before the stated closing time, to keep out those last minute customers! By the time closing time rolls around, we've been open for 10-11 hours! If you didn't get here early enough, that's YOUR fault, not mine! You should've been here sooner, Mrs. Ima Fucktard!

There are a couple of regular customers that walk through the doors at 9:25 whenever they shop. We close at 9:30 Mon-Sat and they KNOW it. They do it on purpose. There is this one lady that usually has a return to do and while you are doing a price check for her return she wanders away to shop some more. We usually can't get her out of the store until 10:00

There is another lady that also has some complex return and asks to use our bathroom before she leaves and that takes her another 5-10 minutes

Everytime we see these ladies walk in the store it ruins our chances of getting out of the store at a decent time. I can't start any closing procedures until all customers are out of the store.

And THAT'S why I lock the doors 5-10 mins. BEFORE the stated closing time! If they ALWAYS come in at 9:25, then you need to ALWAYS lock the doors at 9:20! And you can also have someone keep an eye out for their car pulling into the lot, in case they try to sneak in a few minutes earlier, so you can lock the doors before they get up to them! Problem --> solution! ;-)

Its really easy for the CEO to sit in his cushy office chair and write letters, isn't it?

Yep. I think it should be an absolute requirement, BY LAW, that everyone that works at District Manager level and above MUST have spent YEARS working "in the trenches", at the store level, so they know what it's like! And even if they're CEO, they should be required to regularly work in the store(s), side-by-side with their frontline employees, to make sure they never FORGET what it's like! That would solve so many workplace problems, it's not funny! But, that would make sense. And as we all know, if it makes sense, it's not allowed!

Because he's not the one who's standing around waiting for a couple of rude customers to leave. He's not the one who told their kids that they'd be home in time to read them a bedtime story and now can't keep that promise, or the one who has worked 10 hours on their feet and is so exhausted by closing time that they can barely stand up.

I think your head office is right to care about customer service, and if someone can't or won't provide good service during their scheduled hours, they are in the wrong line of work. But where do we draw the line? When did good customer service become the equivalent to "Do whatever the customer wants, no matter how rude or obnoxious, and regardless of obvious safety concerns."

Again, you hit the nail right on the head. Another part of the problem is that to these asshats in middle management and higher, the customer is GOLD, while the employees are considered to be fully expendable. The customer can get away with bloody MURDER, and their ass will STILL be kissed! But the employee will be FIRED for inconveniencing them, because customers are irreplaceable, but they can always hire another warm body to work for slave wages!

I think that retail/service establishments need to start doing what I've seen some places that serve food doing. Their closing times are listed as:

Kitchen closes at X:00.
Dining room closes X:30.

-=SNIP=-

It's a lot more realistic, and it also provides head office and management with a built-in allowance for customer dallying for scheduling. Not to mention giving customers a firmer idea of the fact that 'closed' means the cashiers are closed, not just the sales floor.

Management (and head office) need to learn to manage customer expectations, not just to manage their staff. Tell the customers what you expect of THEM: they don't just magically know it.

The worst part I've found is when places have policies like that, but DON'T make the customers aware of them. But that falls under the last bit. Management needs to take control of the customers, not the other way around. There's a REASON your store has BUSINESS HOURS. LET your employees ENFORCE THEM!

There's one grocery store near me that has 2 entrances/exits, one at either end...after a certain time, they lock both doors at one end, near the pharmacy (which is already closed) and they lock the entrance doors at the other end as well. The exit at that end is kept open, so you can only go in through the one exit. (And that is the exit closest to the express registers where there are likely to be more people.) Think they're trying to make a point? :-)

Boozy, I totally agree...corporate should care about customer service, but they should care equally about the well-being of their employees. And routinely being made to stay late because they won't allow you to "inconvenience" the customer by actually enforcing the store hours is not conducive to employee well-being.

Again, that's a sign that the middle and upper management is incompetent. They need an attitude adjustment, STAT!

This thread reminded me of one "customer" I had while at Claires.

The gate was closed. Most of the lights were off, the music was off (THANK GODS!!!), and the cash register (very visble from the gate) was covered in paper, with a till peeping out from the mess.

This lady comes rushing up to the gate. I ignored her.

She started shaking the gate.

"I'm sorry, we're closed."

"But, I have a RETURN!!" Like that's going to make a difference.

If I was in a bad mood, I'd say something like "Like I CARE! PISS OFF!!!"

If I was in a flippant/humorous/happy mood, I'd say something like "Well, I have a hot date tonight! I WIN!!!"

This reminds me of the gates we used at the young lady's store at the mall.

When we'd close, we'd shut the gate, but it never failed that someone would try to sneak under or be waiting to be let in or beg to be let in.

Every time I've worked at a store that had a drop-down gate, I'd pull the gate halfway down 5-10 minutes before closing, which would put the gate 4-5 feet above the ground. And it would never fail... some asshat would do "the limbo" to get under the gate and come in anyway, forcing me to have to change tactics, and pull the gate ¾ths of the way closed every night after that, to make sure they'd get the point... which would then cause security to get on my case for "closing early".

Ree has a great suggestion. Find out where they work, especially if they are a lawyer or doctor or something, and go bother them at their job, especially on like their lunch break. Muahahahaha!

I want to make myself a "client" at their office/cubicle job, and come in 5-10 mins. before they get off work, with a RUSH JOB that MUST be completed THAT DAY, and they'd be given only 2 choices:

1. Work the mandatory overtime and get the job done.
2. Be FIRED!

And see how THEY like it!

These customers in my first post did in fact make a large purchase and I think had tons of questions for the salesguy. I heard they were upset that they couldn't take their TV home with them that day. Since it was 9:30 when the sale was finalized, the pick up guys had already gone home for the day.

The lights were already off. They turn off five minutes after closing.

I suppose the reason I didn't say anything to them was because I was sort of in awe of their rudeness...The security guy and I just stood there and watched them. You would think they would have gotten the idea!

No, sucky customers like that will NEVER get a clue, that's part of the problem!

SCs don't get a clue from anything less subtle than a train wreck. And even then it's iffy.

That's why you have to engineer the train wreck in such a way that the SCs that are in need of a clue will be amongst the people KILLED in the wreck! Maybe they'll get a clue when they reach the afterlife!

"Why is this train not moving? I have a very important meeting and I can't be late! And where's the damn drink cart? I need a drink! This is ridiculous!"

See my thoughts just above for how I'd avoid that problem! ;-)

Because that would make sense, Katie :-)

And as we all know... if it makes sense, it's not allowed!

[aurelemsrealm]

Well, while I see your point, I think that's rude.

As I said above...

Anyhoo. I sincerely hope that I don't ever come to your place of employment. I fear that your customer service "skills" would turn me into an SC.

And no, I'm not trying to start anything. I'm just expressing my opinions. (If it causes too much trouble, I apologize in advance.)

I've been busy tending to some other matters, and finally had a chance to catch up on reading here. Becky, I'm not offended by your opinions you've stated in response to my previous posts there. We all have opinions, and I'll be the first to admit that I can be rude to people if I feel they are stepping on my toes. I mean, I try to be diplomatic at first, but so many SC types, as we all know, just don't give a crap. Those are the types I won't cut any slack. I'm generally more apt to relent if people play nice. I firmly believe that SC types deserve to be treated like crap and given the bum's rush since they're so eager to dish out the misery to the rest of humanity. There's really no good way to say it. The point is that the jerk-idiot SC types are the only ones who get to experience my mean streak. Otherwise, I leave well enough alone.

[Jack T. Chance]

Sad, but true...

Here's an awesome installment of the comic strip Retail that fits in perfectly with this discussion:

CLICK HERE!

File that under sad, but true.

[Becks]

That's why you have to engineer the train wreck in such a way that the SCs that are in need of a clue will be amongst the people KILLED in the wreck! Maybe they'll get a clue when they reach the afterlife!

Reading that brought to mind the parts in Beetlejuice...you know, with the afterlife coordinator and the football team.

[Bank Lady]

... in the furniture industry, the average transaction takes anywhere from 30-60 minutes from start to finish, what with having the customers try the different mattresses (or whatever you're selling), ask their questions, get their answers, talk it over with their spouse... at length, of course... then haggle over the price, then writing the order up... so, 30-60 mins. is the AVERAGE, but that means that some customers take a LOT longer. So, if you ain't in my store by 10-15 mins. before the stated closing time, TOUGH SHIT! 'Cause I lock the door 5-10 mins. before the stated closing time, to keep out those last minute customers!

My dad has worked in furniture for 15 years now. He had a classic response to anyone that came in 5-10 minutes before close.

"Well, you must know exactly what you want. Let's go get that rung up right now." (then leads them directly to the service desk)

He said it was pretty successful. Some people really did know exactly what they wanted because they had been in on another occassion and had finally made up their minds. Others were so flustered by not being allowed to wander around the store for the next hour that they left.

[Jack T. Chance]

Sweet!

My dad has worked in furniture for 15 years now. He had a classic response to anyone that came in 5-10 minutes before close.

"Well, you must know exactly what you want. Let's go get that rung up right now." (then leads them directly to the service desk)

He said it was pretty successful. Some people really did know exactly what they wanted because they had been in on another occassion and had finally made up their minds. Others were so flustered by not being allowed to wander around the store for the next hour that they left.

Awesome! I'll have to try that one!

[XCashier]

Here's an awesome installment of the comic strip Retail that fits in perfectly with this discussion:

CLICK HERE!

File that under sad, but true.

Here's a few more (had to dig back into the archives, but it was worth it):
http://seattlepi.nwsource.com/fun/re...?date=20060119
http://seattlepi.nwsource.com/fun/re...?date=20060206
http://seattlepi.nwsource.com/fun/re...?date=20060604
http://seattlepi.nwsource.com/fun/re...?date=20061105

[TerranRich]

Hah, Home Depot had a great solution (albeit unintentional and mostly on the part of the sales associates)... The sales associates were always scheduled until closing, no later. So we'd take that literally and just leave right at closing. Any stray customers soon found themselves without any help, and were pretty much forced to either leave or find it themselves.

But we'd still have the SCs who would ask management for help. Any poor soul who hadn't punched out already would be forced to stay extra to help said SCs.

Once we closed, I would take off my orange apron and walk around in plain clothes, finishing whatever tasks I had left. Half of the customers would see me as another SC and would just pass on by. But I've had the occasional few who didn't get the hint and still asked for help. After closing, however, I lost my plastered-on fake smile and cheery attitude. I'd treat them - SUBTLY - as a nuisance, as someone in the way, and just point in the general direction of whatever it was they needed.

I remember one time I had thought the store was cleared out, so I was in plain clothes, finishing up something really late. About an hour and 15 minutes after closing, I was on my way out the door...and I saw a family with a carriage, CASUALLY strolling the store...the last few people left. I was in shock, but I just shook my head and continued walking out.

[Jack T. Chance]

Here's a few more (had to dig back into the archives, but it was worth it):
http://seattlepi.nwsource.com/fun/re...?date=20060119
http://seattlepi.nwsource.com/fun/re...?date=20060206
http://seattlepi.nwsource.com/fun/re...?date=20060604
http://seattlepi.nwsource.com/fun/re...?date=20061105

Those are great!

But in the case of the one with the "atomic watch", it would be ME telling the SC that "my watch is accurate to the second!"

[draftermatt]

Anyone ever had a retail associate try to keep you late? Just me?

My wife & I were in the furniture store the other day, it was like 90 minutes before closing. We were browsing, and speaking to the sales lady, who wanted us to try this out, and that out, and fill out the credit app, and tell us about this and that, we ended up leaving 15 minutes before close, mainly because I wanted to leave because I hadn't made a decision yet and wasn't going to in the next 15 minutes.

Maybe because it's commission sales they don't mind staying late, but who knows.

[Brightglaive]

I hate to say it but I've been on the receiving side of this. To be truly fair there are 2 customer issues here and 1 service issue.

Customer issues:
1.) Customers coming late and wanting in after the closing hours
2.) Customers coming inside just before closing hours and taking FOREVER to leave after the store is closed.

Service issues:
1.) Closing the store early.

The customer issues have been well discussed on this thred but the service issue has not been addressed.

Let me tell you the service issues are just as HEINOUS as the customer issues. If you aren't staying open until your closing time then you are being a sucky service person. You are in customer SERVICE, not Dis-SERVICE.

The key to the whole problem is to have a comprehensive way of handling the customer. If the order takes 30 minutes write up you can tell customers coming in that any orders after 8:30pm will be processed and handled the next day. Good communication is KEY to handling the customers. Another is what Bank lady said..

My dad has worked in furniture for 15 years now. He had a classic response to anyone that came in 5-10 minutes before close.

"Well, you must know exactly what you want. Let's go get that rung up right now." (then leads them directly to the service desk)

He said it was pretty successful. Some people really did know exactly what they wanted because they had been in on another occassion and had finally made up their minds. Others were so flustered by not being allowed to wander around the store for the next hour that they left.

If they know what they want or need let's be direct and get exactly what they need. No browsing, no loitering.

Have the department employees "clean" the customers out. If the customer is there a few minutes before closing have the employees ask the customer if they need help and get confirmation that the customer understands that the store is closing in X minutes. Ater closing, approach the customer and tell them the store is now closed and they need to move to the registers and exits now. Make appropriate closing announcements over the paging system in addition to the "cleaning". If need be, have security escort them from the building.

Understand that SERVICE sometimes entails a little (NOT BIG) sacrifice of your precious time once in a while. If the customer is 1 minute late and knows precisely what they need and it will take less than 5minutes to get it... fine. If they are just showing up and saying, "are you closed? I was looking to get some lawn tools" at 10 after... sorry we're closed. or if they need to do something that will take longer than 20 minutes (e.g. "I need to unpack this HUGE moving van to my indoor storage unit" at 5 minutes to closing), no way. But it requires a little probing to determine which customer knows exactly what they need and who doesn't. I know some salesmen that will take a few extra minutes of their time to help someone if it means an extra sale, even if the customer can't get the item until the next day.


so in a short list:

1. Communicate with the Customer.
2. Set their expectation
3. Be direct and specific on what they intend to buy and don't allow loitering or browsing.
4. Have employees "clean" the customers out of their departments.
5. Make little sacrifices every once in a while for the person that is 1-3 minutes late but knows precisely what they need and it will take 5 minutes or less to get it or do it.
6. Don't close early and don't open late.

If you do this the store will close on time and and you won't be open longer than you absolutely have to be. Then you will be providing great service and controlling the effect SCs have on the store's closing times.

[Andara Bledin]

If you do this the store will close on time and and you won't be open longer than you absolutely have to be. Then you will be providing great service and controlling the effect SCs have on the store's closing times.

Well, see, that's all assuming that the clerks are actually allowed to do all that.

There have been posts by different people where some managers won't even let the clerks page that the store is closed for fear of offending alleged customers.

^-.-^

[Broomjockey]

1. Communicate with the Customer.
2. Set their expectation
3. Be direct and specific on what they intend to buy and don't allow loitering or browsing.
4. Have employees "clean" the customers out of their departments.
5. Make little sacrifices every once in a while for the person that is 1-3 minutes late but knows precisely what they need and it will take 5 minutes or less to get it or do it.
6. Don't close early and don't open late.

Nice sentiments, but in my personal experience, the real world issues associated with your list:
1. Communcation is good, until you get someone who keeps cutting you off saying "I'm fine, thanks. Just looking." Then pointedly ignores you.
2. Customers pretty much always come in with their own set of expectations, and tend to be not happy when they're not met, causing a scene, delaying lots.
3. My managers get more than a little miffed at rushing customers, as they feel that a rushed customer would rather get nothing to save themselves the hassle of being rushed. And it's hard to tell when someone's browsing/loitering vs. contemplating which to buy sometimes.
4. This one I can't see many issues with as long as management's reasonable
5. Are people really going to say "I've no clue what I want and will wander around for an hour looking! Let me in!"? Everyone is going to say they'll just be 5 minutes. So, how are we supposed to choose who's telling the truth?
6. Often a matter of staffing hours, unexpected situations arising, and things like that. If one person's scheduled to open the store, but the closing people didn't get through their duties, then the opener is going to take longer to do things, causing being late. By the same token, closers are often given a set amount of time after close, and some times to get everything done you have to start early. It's a balancing act.

[Lace Neil Singer]

Plus, in my experience, a lot of the people who arrive just before closing time are the "wanderers"; ie, they don't want to buy squat, just wander around looking at everything before finally pissing off 20 minutes later. -.- There's nothing we can do about those people; they ignore closing announcements, and cuz they're not buying anything, do they really deserve the same consideration as paying customers do? The garden centre had a few of those, and we managed to spike their guns by not letting anyone in at 5 minutes to closing time. Yeah I know, there could be a sale, but you try ending up being over 30 minutes late home and your parents going frantic cuz they think something happened to you. This was in the BM (before mobiles) era, too.