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  • That Bulls**t!

    For those who don't know, I work in insurance (home,car and contents).

    I receive a file from my colleague asking if we can decline this claim.

    I review the file, what she's given us, and the investigators reports. This customer has a high theft target vehicle, so she has to have a 5 star alarm installed or she gets a huge bump in her excess.

    I listen to the first phone call - she originally tells us she took the alarm out after it stopped working, then when told about the excess suddenly tells us that it was installed and working when the car was stolen. Well well, that warrented the appointment of the investigator (telling us two different things in one call tends to start us down this path).

    We then send her out a form she has to complete. This form is a statutory declation, and making a false statement on this form could be punished as purjury. She signs this declaration, telling us that the vehicle had a 5 star alarm and that it was in perfect mechanical condition.

    Investigator then meets with her, and challenges her about the alarm. She admits that there was no alarm, that she had removed it prior to the theft. We also check with her mechanic and the vehicle was in a poor state - the horn and lights didn't work, the bumper was held on with tape, and the chassis was bent.

    So she lied to try and get a lower excess, lied again to try and get a better settlement value. I call her up and tell her that the claim was declined (not mentioning that I've also referred it for a potential police complaint). She tells me 'this is bullshit'!.

    I bit my tongue from replying 'no what you told us was bullshit, thats why your claim is declined '
    How ever do they manage to breathe for themselves without having to call tech support? - Argabarga

  • #2
    "actually Ma'm, it's REALITY, and depending on your next move, it may become a FELONY"
    - They say nothing good happens at 2AM, they're right, I happen at 2AM.

    Comment


    • #3
      Quoth TimmyHate View Post
      She admits that there was no alarm, that she had removed it prior to the theft. We also check with her mechanic and the vehicle was in a poor state - the horn and lights didn't work, the bumper was held on with tape, and the chassis was bent.
      Could even have been the "theft" was less than unexpected. Which, if so, would make her lying about the alarm system a double-fail. Triple, considering without that red flag your investigators might never even have spoken to the mechanic.

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      • #4
        A vehicle in that poor condition, and it is still considered a high-theft vehicle? Which is truthful, because her crappy car got stolen. Yikes.
        A lion however, will only devour your corpse, whereas an SC is not sated until they have destroyed your soul. (Quote per infinitemonkies)

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        • #5
          Quoth TheSHAD0W View Post
          Could even have been the "theft" was less than unexpected. Which, if so, would make her lying about the alarm system a double-fail. Triple, considering without that red flag your investigators might never even have spoken to the mechanic.
          Thats the thing - we're actually satisfied that her car was taken. Or at least as satisifed as we can be.

          I dont get why people lie to us . We find out. We always find out.

          Because of my role I deal with the majority of our fraudulent claims. Currently I have 6 on my 'wall of shame' where I am reccomending police action.

          I really should post about the lawyer (actual Lawyer not 'I AM LAWYER' SC) who is currently having charges laid against her....

          Quoth bainsidhe View Post
          A vehicle in that poor condition, and it is still considered a high-theft vehicle? Which is truthful, because her crappy car got stolen. Yikes.
          Yup. There are a few vehicles that are high theft regardless of their condition. Mostly the ones that either go fast or look like they go fast, but are older. So your Subaru Imprezzas and your Nissan Skylines. Seeing the extra premium plus extra excess talked me out of buying one of those faster than my parents ever could...
          Last edited by EricKei; 03-10-2014, 06:12 PM. Reason: merged consecutive posts
          How ever do they manage to breathe for themselves without having to call tech support? - Argabarga

          Comment


          • #6
            When I was shopping for my first car, I went to my insurance broker (from home insurance) looking for a "ballpark" figure of what to expect to pay for insurance, using a Honda Civic as a baseline. I was thinking "Well-known small car, has been around in some form or another for years" - didn't know about "tuner culture".

            Eventually I bought a Hyundai Excel - and the premium was significantly lower than the "ballpark" due to it being considered a lower-risk car.

            As to OP, I'd say this claim is begging to be declined. Having a working 5 star (what exactly does that mean in terms of alarms?) alarm was a condition of the premium she was paying. To go from "alarm removed when it stopped working" to "alarm is installed and working" when she found out what the lack of alarm would do to her premiums sounds like she was falsifying critical information on which the policy was based. If someone were to "shoehorn" a 500 HP Series 60 Detroit into a 4th generation Golf as a replacement for the stock 90 HP TDI, and claim that it had a stock powertrain (since a modified powertrain boosts insurance premiums), their claim in the event of a wreck should be denied.

            Note that if the client had been involved in a wreck, rather than her car being stolen, the issue of whether or not the proper alarm was installed and working should have had no effect on the claim, since an alarm (or lack thereof) doesn't affect the risk of collision.
            Any fool can piss on the floor. It takes a talented SC to shit on the ceiling.

            Comment


            • #7
              Quoth wolfie View Post
              Note that if the client had been involved in a wreck, rather than her car being stolen, the issue of whether or not the proper alarm was installed and working should have had no effect on the claim, since an alarm (or lack thereof) doesn't affect the risk of collision.
              Spot on. In New Zealand (where I operate) this is enshrined in law (Section 11 of the Insurance Law Reform Act 1977 - ). This applies to all exclusions - if it wasn't causative, we can't rely on it to decline.

              In this case, the client had a condition that stated (Nothing in this wording is unique to the customer in question)

              The excess for burglary or theft claims is with the selected $2000.00 However in the event of such a loss if You can prove to Our satisfaction that a five star alarm/immobiliser was fitted to the vehicle at the time of the loss, the excess is $1000.00

              A five star alarm/immobiliser is defined as:
              1. an immobiliser that is certified to AS/NZS 4601 standards, and a security alarm system that is certified to AS/NZS3749 2003 Class A,
              or
              2. a vehicle security system that is rated by the New Zealand Security Association as 5 star or better.

              The systems must be fitted by an NZSA registered installer.
              So for the sake of $1000.00 difference in excess she has had a claim of between 4000 and 7000 declined, her insurances cancelled and (possibly) a fraud convicton.
              How ever do they manage to breathe for themselves without having to call tech support? - Argabarga

              Comment


              • #8
                Quoth bainsidhe View Post
                A vehicle in that poor condition, and it is still considered a high-theft vehicle? Which is truthful, because her crappy car got stolen. Yikes.
                My 1999 Honda Civic, in fair to poor condition (body) and fair condition (mechanical parts) is still considered high theft. Granted, not as much as it used to be, but far higher risk than other makes/models from that model year.

                As for the OP, I can't believe I'm still surprised at some of the shit SC's try to pull.
                At the conclusion of an Irish wedding, the priest said "Everybody please hug the person who has made your life worth living. The bartender was nearly crushed to death.

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                • #9
                  Quoth TimmyHate View Post
                  So for the sake of $1000.00 difference in excess she has had a claim of between 4000 and 7000 declined, her insurances cancelled and (possibly) a fraud convicton.
                  You sir, Rock. My last job was in your world- similar company, different country. Do you have the same rule in NZ as the UK, that if you cancel her insurance, she has to declare that cancellation every time she tries to take out insurance for the next 5 years? I loved that rule. Cancellation letters are worth 5 years of Bad Day Vouchers.. It's really expensive to get insurance after being cancelled.

                  Comment


                  • #10
                    I wonder if that's why my Impreza (not the WRX ) came standard with an Immobilizer (which unfortunately makes the keys expensive..). I guess that's why we have shows like World's Dumbest Criminal -- some of them are dumb enough to confuse a base Impreza with a WRX!
                    Supporting the idiots charged with protecting your personal information.

                    Comment


                    • #11
                      Quoth wolfie View Post
                      If someone were to "shoehorn" a 500 HP Series 60 Detroit into a 4th generation Golf ...


                      I would love to see someone do that, although the motor alone may break the frame. I love my Detroit 60 in my FL Century.
                      You call, I haul. You bitch, I unhitch!

                      Comment


                      • #12
                        Quoth TimmyHate
                        Yup. There are a few vehicles that are high theft regardless of their condition.
                        Like my ex-neighbor's Rolls Royce. Couldn't run (engine was totally shot) but it looked great otherwise. He just parked it in his driveway to impress his neighbors and friends...

                        Comment


                        • #13
                          What else is a Rolls-Royce for...? And hey, it's much cheaper to maintain that way! Just gotta keep it shiney and make sure the tires don't get dry rotted ^_^
                          "For a musician, the SNES sound engine is like using Crayola Crayons. Nobuo Uematsu used Crayola Crayons to paint the Sistine Chapel." - Jeremy Jahns (re: "Dancing Mad")
                          "The difference between an amateur and a master is that the master has failed way more times." - JoCat
                          "Thinking is difficult, therefore let the herd pronounce judgment!" ~ Carl Jung
                          "There's burning bridges, and then there's the lake just to fill it with gasoline." - Wiccy, reddit
                          "Retail is a cruel master, and could very well be the most educational time of many people's lives, in its own twisted way." - me
                          "Love keeps her in the air when she oughta fall down...tell you she's hurtin' 'fore she keens...makes her a home." - Capt. Malcolm Reynolds, "Serenity" (2005)
                          Acts of Gord – Read it, Learn it, Love it!
                          "Our psychic powers only work if the customer has a mind to read." - me

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                          • #14
                            Quoth TimmyHate View Post
                            Yup. There are a few vehicles that are high theft regardless of their condition. Mostly the ones that either go fast or look like they go fast, but are older. So your Subaru Imprezzas and your Nissan Skylines. Seeing the extra premium plus extra excess talked me out of buying one of those faster than my parents ever could...
                            Mr. Bells' '95 Acura Integra is one of those. So it was good the previous owner had installed a Lojack, because it got stolen right out of an allegedly patrolled, secure lot.

                            Comment


                            • #15
                              Quoth EricKei View Post
                              What else is a Rolls-Royce for...? And hey, it's much cheaper to maintain that way! Just gotta keep it shiney and make sure the tires don't get dry rotted ^_^
                              It's my understanding that Rolls Royces are very cheap to maintain, as they don't break down. According to one tale I heard, where Rolls flew a tech to the U.S. to repair one, and as he was leaving the owner asked how much he owed. The tech turned around, said "Rolls Royces don't break down" and left.

                              Of course, this could be urban legend, but if BMW can do it why not Rolls?
                              I will not be pushed, stamped, filed, indexed, briefed, debriefed, or numbered. My life is my own. --#6

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