I think I've asked before, but...college question...

[mjr]

Ok, I've worked hard to get to where I am today. I went from food service to Software Engineering.

I don't have a degree. My wife has a degree in Economics. Almost everything I've learned about Software Development and Software Engineering has either been on the job, or on my own. Though I did take one of those Vo-Tech "crash course" things to get started.

That said, a couple of years ago I started taking college courses again. The problem is, with everything else I have going on (family, work, etc.), I'm really only able to take 1 per semester, and paying for it all myself. Did I also mention I'm pushing 40 (I'll be 39 this year)?

I think I almost have enough credits to be considered a Sophomore (2nd year student). I'll have to check.

Anyway, I'm wondering about a couple of things.

I know for sure I want to pursue the undergraduate in Computer Science.

If I finish that, I'm wondering if I should go for a Masters Degree. I don't know how much actual utility I'd get from it, other than "Masters Degree" appearing on my resume.

That, and there's no guarantee a graduate school would accept me. But it would probably take me another couple of years to get that, too.

I've also read opinions that at this point in my career a degree doesn't matter, because I've been doing this for a decade and a half.

Opinions?

[Sapphire Silk]

It depends on what you want from your career. Your field is one where a Master's degree or higher isn't considered entry level, or even necessary.

My brother has a Master's in Computer Science. He works for Red Hat, on web server software and is considered an expert in Apache. He told me the Master's focused more on administration types of issues rather on higher level computer programming. He didn't think it helped him very much, since he doesn't plan to become a manager or to start his own company (he does consulting and side jobs on the side but he didn't need an advanced degree for that).

My suggestion would be to finish your degree. Get the best grades you can to make yourself competitive in case you do want to go on with more education. Work for awhile, and talk to people in your field about how or whether it might advance things for you.

If you do decide to go on for more school, research the program and find out what exactly you will be taught and what it is meant to be used for. Does it match your ambitions for your future? If yes, then good. If no, then keep looking or wait.

It is never too late to go back to school. You have plenty of time.

[Yfandes]

My husband has quite a good job in the IT field, without ever graduating college, so there's that.

However I don't think an undergraduate degree is ever wasted, with the proviso that I personally have problems with using significant student loans to get them. I worked through my degrees.

Masters degrees make a real difference in some fields, and it others they do not. You need to do some research. I have a masters degree, yet when I check out job offers in my field the wording is something like "bachelors degree required, masters degree or X years experience". I have one friend who paid over $60k to get a degree in a field that starts at $30K per year - SO not worth it IMHO.

I guess my take is that learning is never wasted, however money can be

[mjr]

Thanks for the replies!

Something that also recently occurred to me, as it ties into how I've learned most of the software engineering stuff anyway.

Why couldn't I just look at syllabi for those the classes, find the book for those classes, and buy it myself?

I mean, I know instruction is helpful, but there are plenty of resources and books out there. For instance, I'm currently taking a Calculus II course. In theory, I could simply buy the book and learn the material on my own, couldn't I?

Also, I don't know if it's like this for other classes (say, Junior or Senior level college classes), but I've noticed that there's stuff that you learn (and/or use) in the real world that you DON'T learn in class. One example is "design patterns", and "unit testing". I actually bought books on both of those topics.

I could do the same for History, Math, economics, and so forth.

Here's another example: My wife still has some books from when she was in college. What's to say I couldn't read those as a primer, and then get one of my own economics books, and learn the information?

So in theory, I could get the equivalent of a college degree education, without actually having the college degree. And it's possible that it could take less time.

And Yfandes, I do plan on footing the bill for this myself. No student loans. That's part of the reason why I'm doing it 1 class at a time.

[NecessaryCatharsis]

I have no idea if this would work in the software engineering field, but I know of other college programs (mostly trades that never used to require a degree and now do) that offer 'life skills credits'. They go over your work experience, and craft an entrance exam based on courses they think you already know the material on, and make you start earning credits at courses of a higher level than the ones you passed the exams on.

This puts some people in the second or third year of a four year program right from the start. If it's possible it should save you some time and money.

[mjr]

I have no idea if this would work in the software engineering field, but I know of other college programs (mostly trades that never used to require a degree and now do) that offer 'life skills credits'. They go over your work experience, and craft an entrance exam based on courses they think you already know the material on, and make you start earning credits at courses of a higher level than the ones you passed the exams on.

This puts some people in the second or third year of a four year program right from the start. If it's possible it should save you some time and money.

I've actually looked into this. Based on what I've found so far, schools either don't do this any more, or never have. I'll keep looking into it, though. I've heard that the ones that do actually will only let you get a very limited number of credits (something like 30, maybe a year's worth if you're taking a "full load") applied.

I think I checked into it at one university, and they actually wanted me to apply (I believe) before I actually sent them my resume and current transcript.

I mean, I've been doing software engineering for something like 15 or 16 years, so I'd say I have a decent amount of experience. I'd probably still have to take classes like Chemistry, Physics, history, and such, but that would drastically cut down time.

For instance, there are three "programming fundamentals" classes that I need to take, according to the curriculum at a school I've been looking at. Right now, I'm taking classes online through a local community college.

Anyway, Not only can I Google if I get stuck, I probably have enough experience to actually DO most of the work in the book...

As an example, I actually had an assignment to write a small app that would check for primes. I didn't need much guidance beyond the requirements, since I'd been writing software for a while.

I'll have to look into it at the University I plan to transfer credits to, and see what they tell me.

[Sapphire Silk]

You're lucky enough to work in a field where, if you can produce, a degree doesn't matter as much as other fields.

You could potentially educate yourself. As long as a college degree isn't a barrier to the kind of jobs or pay you want, that's fine. The difference is you won't get the degree and you won't have access to resources if you get stuck.

You can still CLEP some courses, but generally not the upper division ones. You have to pay full tuition to get the credit for the hours, and you still have to have a minimum number of hours "in residence", usually 30 hours or so, to qualify for a degree.

It may sound sucky, but in fact is keeps schools from becoming diploma mills.

[wolfie]

I mean, I've been doing software engineering for something like 15 or 16 years,

For instance, there are three "programming fundamentals" classes that I need to take, according to the curriculum at a school I've been looking at.

I see you've run into the same joke I did. When I was looking for a change from programming, one program (switched to machine shop after the first year of a 2 year program) had an "introduction to computers" (using basic functions of Windows, Word, and Excel - course was a "self-directed" one with programmed tests - only marks I lost were because I used keyboard shortcuts instead of dragging down the menus) course as part of the curriculum. Some of my classmates who had worked in offices were able to get an exemption from that course, but according to the college administration I "didn't know enough about computers" to get an exemption. The computers in the college library (where the tests were administered) were running production code (display driver) that I had written.

[mjr]

Yesterday I did send an email to one of the universities I'm considering transferring credits to. I explained the situation to them. Hopefully, I will hear back from them soon. Because honestly, if all I need is the 30 hours of "in resident" schooling like Sapphire Silk mentions, then heck I could knock that out in a couple of years or so. Especially considering I've already taken close to 15 or so hours anyway...