Lawyer SUCK (long)

[cleorose]

Okay so hubby and I are in the midst of a bankruptcy. And I have worked so very hard to do everything they ask in a timely fashion. Except our lawyer and his staff seem to be more than a little incompetent.

We filed in May. They told us as long as we provided a list of where we spent our tax check that we got in April, we wouldn't have to worry. Yeah but see they LOST the paper and supporting evidence I gave them and then of course the trustee thought we were still sitting on 6k. So I had to redo everything a 2nd time. Flubs happen I get it.

Then we have to do this financial re-education course. Its a four hour course. We did that before our meeting with the creditors PER the lawyers instructions. Supposedly the certificates are sent automatically from the site to the lawyer. Except once again our lawyer has "lost" said certificates. Of course we get a letter from our trustee saying we have 10 days to get it done or they will cancel our bankruptcy. This is a week ago. We did this back in June. SO I have to dig thru my paperwork to find it and luckily I did. But now I am a little irritated. Took them two months to figure out that they had lost important documents.

Earlier this month, we finally got our VA settlement. And our car picked that moment to take a dump. So after speaking to our lawyer, who said since we had only one, very old and beat up car we could get approved for financing NO PROBLEM.

So we spent some time going around and finding what we like. We aren't in a hurry but at the same time our car is on its last legs. Whatever we have to put into it to keep it running, takes away from how much our down payment can be.

The first dealership ended up being kinda skitchy. Bait and switch with their prices and snarky sales people.

We finally settled on the Dodge Caravan 2014 model. Spacious, Had the seats, and it has that stow and go. I did not like the 600 dollar car payment but you know bad credit thats the breaks. And its not like we can't afford it. Hubby Makes 2200 every two weeks from work plus another 2500 a month from the VA. I make spare dough from the home, I coupon, do sweepstakes etc. Needless to say we are now gonna be bringing home over 6k a month. Our expenses are roughly 2500 a month.

I turned in the paperwork two weeks ago today. They called us into the office and said we needed to do an AMENDED budget to show that we could afford it to the trustee. Yeah that sucks but I do get it. So we go in that Friday. They said okay it will be about 5-10 days with the trustee and you will get approved.

So the lawyer kept saying the dealership gets the paperwork from the trustee. Everytime I called the lawyer and it was a few times, they always said they were just waiting on the trustee.

Except today I finally got the damn trustee to pick up her phone. And guess what? She has 0 of our paperwork. No budget or nothing.

So now I am more than a little mad. I call the lawyer back and yes my SC attitude was out but not full force. And believe me I can do SC like a pro. I get the lawyer instead of his crappy cunt secretary (more on her in a second), and we talk.

CL: Crappy Lawyer
Me: As my self


ME: I need to know why the budget was not submitted. I have called the dealership everyday waiting for that paperwork. I have called your office only to be told the trustee had it. I finally speak to the trustee today and find out the last email between you is the one of them asking for the budget.
CL: Well we have some issues with your budget. You are asking for a $600 car payment and you only have $300 available.
ME: No you did the budget with the car payment I sat there and watched you. You specifically said we could not have more than 500 left over at the end of the month. So you inflated numbers.
CL: Well your kids were here and were distracting.
ME: Two weeks ago, I might have believed you. But your secretaries have spent the last TWO weeks lying to my face. You didn't even know this problem existed until now. That's bullshit. And a damned lie to cover your ass. (Yes I got nasty ). We had a one hour appointment and we were here less than 15 minutes. My kids were in the main room playing with balloons. If you had an issue you had 45 minutes and 2 weeks to call and tell us there was an issue. Had this been an isolated issue, I might have overlooked it, but you and your staff are nothing short of incompetent when it comes to our paperwork. This is your fault. Not ours. We did everything EVERYTHING . We were supposed to do. When we were supposed to do it. (Told him about the above two incidents)
CL: Well we can do this by mail so that nothing else gets lost.
ME: Except everything has gotten lost was PHYSICAL paper. Stuff I handed directly to you or your staff. I doubt you would do better with mail. I will come pick it up. And then I will have you sign a note that says you received it. I will treat you like my 6th grader if I have to.
CL: I am sorry that you think we have messed up we will try to make this right. We can make an appointment to do the amended budget. (AGAIN) and then submit it all to the trustee.
Me: I will be up there TOMORROW morning. I am not waiting on some stupid appointment when we have been made to wait for you to get up and push a button.



I also had a long conversation with his cunt secretary who came right out and said she could show me the emails to the trustee. Yes I know you emailed the trustee TWO WEEKS ago. You didnt email the budget. Her: Well that was because you didn't do it . I said yes we did. We came in on the one woman's birthday because she had an office full of balloons and each of my kids got a birthday balloon that we took home. I have a video of our puppy popping said balloon.

I told her flat out. You have lied to my face for 2 weeks. You had time to rectify this and own up. But you chose not to. Even now when you are caught with your pants down you want to lie and shift blame. I don't play like that. I will be the most fucking annoying person you know. I will call and email every 30 minutes just so you remember to do your job when it comes to me. (And yes I would and I have done that to plenty of people ). You want to flake out, do it on someone else's dime.
Her:Well you can if you choose, go to another lawyer and choose to have them represent you if you feel that we can not be trusted.

Me: Your lawyers. I NEVER expected to trust you. I expect you to be able to send a email or fax a document though. I mean really what is 10 whole buttons you have to press? Maybe 5? If you can't manage that, then maybe I do need to look elsewhere for representation. I will at least be sure to ask if their secretaries can manage sending emails and faxes. Cause you know thats a tough job.

Her: Well we need the quote sheet from the dealer. And once we have that we will print off a new budget, you can sign it and we can submit it to the trustee.

I said fine. But expect me to be standing in that fucking room to ensure you have no trouble or confusion pressing the send button on the fax or email.

After that I hung up. If hubby had been home it would have been worse.

Tomorrow lawyers be damned we are going to go and get the car. Our car has a weak alternator, we can no longer shift out of first. The ball bearings and brakes are done. I mean we have no more time to goof around.

We just replaced a timing belt, fan belt, thermometer thing, two tires. a battery. Still needs the window motors replaced, the ac compressor replaced, a new alternator, we need to replace our spare, and to fix the bearings and rotors and brakes cause all of it is done.

I told hubby we will get it, submit it the lawyer and write a note to the trustee which I will mail from home explaining the situation. If they choose to dismiss the bankruptcy we can refile in a month or so with a different less shitty lawyer. If not then we can work on switching lawyers anyway.


Sorry for how long this but holy shit I hate lawyers and their stupid assistants.

[bainsidhe]

I'm sure it varies from state to state, but you might inquire with your local bar association on how to file a complaint. I'm not saying to torpedo your case, but complaining to the right people might get things moving better.

A number of years ago my parents filed for bankruptcy. Everything stalled when their lawyer stopped answering calls and providing updates. Finally my mom had enough and complained further up the food chain. Suddenly the lawyer couldn't help my folks fast enough and asked why they didn't come to him first.

[Kittish]

It sounds for all the world like this asshat is jerking you around, trying to squeeze as much money as he can out of you. After all, lawyers bill by the hour, and time spent fixing their mistakes is billable time...as is the time they spend MAKING those mistakes...

You've got documentation of your end of things having been done in a timely manner (pretty much all of the documentation you've got should have dates on it for when it was originally completed). I'd go to your state's bar association and find out how to file a complaint on this guy.

[Teefies2]

I am sorry you have found an incompetent law firm

That being said, and I certainly DON'T mean to offend, but I don't understand filing bankruptcy when you're bringing in that kind of money every 2 weeks. Were there medical expenses or something? I make about $900 a month and am paying my stupid husband's credit card bills - to the tune of over $15,000, but I was told I didn't qualify for bankruptcy (or food stamps, for that matter). Again, I don't mean to offend, I'm just trying to understand.

One of the above posters is right though. Lawyers get paid by the hour, so it's in their best interest to drag your case out as long as possible. I will also say that, having been in the legal profession at one time, bankruptcy and repossession lawyers seem to always be the bottom of the barrel .... not ALL, of course, but it seems that there is a larger majority of them that are less than stellar

[EricKei]

$900 a month gross wages should be well under the maximum salary limit for FS/EBT in any state in the US for even ONE person, let alone two (it's based on total household income, theoretically minus certain bills and plus a certain percentage of liquid assets). See if you can get an appointment to get the decision appealed, or at least explained.

[Sapphire Silk]

Every bankruptcy is different. The most common reasons for bankruptcy these days is either ungodly medical debt (I very nearly drowned in medical debt about 10 years ago, and I actually should have declared bankruptcy) or ungodly student loan debt (the one debt that usually can't be discharged in bankruptcy).

Even people with very good incomes can end up living like paupers or go bankrupt when they have debt like this.

[taxguykarl]

I would show the docs to the lawyer as well as a diary of that nonsene and treaten to file a complaint at the next screwup.
It is worth noting that BK lawyer fees have to be approved by the court--a complaint to the judge about the repeated submittals and the time involved.

[UncleImpy]

I am sorry you have found an incompetent law firm

That being said, and I certainly DON'T mean to offend, but I don't understand filing bankruptcy when you're bringing in that kind of money every 2 weeks. Were there medical expenses or something? I make about $900 a month and am paying my stupid husband's credit card bills - to the tune of over $15,000, but I was told I didn't qualify for bankruptcy (or food stamps, for that matter). Again, I don't mean to offend, I'm just trying to understand.

Sometimes Bankruptcy is a defensive measure to stop your creditors from gouging the CRAP out of you. At the time I filed Chapter 13 four years ago, I was making approximately $4000 a month. However, due to my wife's cancer and several bills she did not tell me about that went past due, we were getting hit with over $3000 a month in late fees, interest charges, etc. I carried on the fight for a year, carefully tracking balances and budgets and realized that, with all the fees we were getting charged (and the creditors unwillingness to 'call off the dogs' so to speak, without making a huge payment that we simply could not afford at the time), in one year I had made a 5% dent in our total debt.

So I filed Chapter 13 (Debt Repayment) - The moment that happens, all your creditors must stop taking action against you. Late fees and interest freeze instantly. Over the course of the five year plan (which ends next year), I will actually have paid 100% of what I owe to all our creditors...and thanks to the ACA, my wife's Stage 4 Invasive Ductile Carcinoma and its $35k a month in medical bills, that won't be a problem anymore. But as a comparison, I went from paying $3200 a month, to paying $900 a month, and yet now I'll be completely paid off in 5 years instead of 20.

Granted, it destroys your credit rating, and I'll live with that. But I'm still paying off everyone I owe money to - they just can't gouge me with late fees anymore.

[wagegoth]

UncleImpy, you might check, since you're paying off 100% of the debt, with the creditors after the bankruptcy to see about having the entries removed from your credit report. I don't know about the laws on this, but it doesn't hurt to ask. You might also call your attorney and find out if this is possible in your state.

[EricKei]

To the best of my understanding -- getting stuff removed from a credit report CAN be a hassle, and it's best to start with sending all 3 credit bureaus typed letters, mailed via signature confirmation. Better yet, see if the bankruptcy attorney's office can help with this, as they'd likely have a good idea what can and cannot be disputed.

[cleorose]

It continues.

We filed bankruptcy because of a house loan. BOA or PIMA (pain in my ass) bought the company that owned our home loan. When they did that they jacked our house payment up. ALOT. From 723 to 1109 then to 1215. We were active duty military and we could not afford that. They told the insurance company the value on our home was around 350k which is what the insurance insured it for. Except we paid 95k for our home. And even that was higher than the county appraisal which sat at 82k. Where BOA got 350k I do not know. When I lost my job in 2009 we fell behind. In late 2010 they showed up with a sheriff and a notice to evict. We had just sent in $3500 which we had borrowed from family to refinance the house at a lower payment. They cashed the check, lost the paperwork and put it towards the amount we were behind instead of allowing us to refinance. We didn't know then what they did was illegal. Jag kinda shrugged their shoulders at us. So we left. I had two kids and it was winter. I was not about to be homeless a month before christmas. In january we got papers saying they were getting ready to sell the house in february and that was the last time we heard anything from BOA for a long time. Until this year. The house is still not foreclosed or sold. And at this point its not worth anything. Since we left the house has been vandalized. The piping stripped. The appliances are gone. The fence was removed. Broken windows, smashed doors and an ungodly amount of mold in the basement probably from the broken windows and moisture in summer months. We tried to get BOA to do Deed in Lieu or a Short sale but they couldn't seem to get their act together to do either all they had to do was send the paperwork and we would have signed. We now live over 120 miles away from that house. There is no way we could move back with hubby's job.

We also have a sizable amount of medical bills from when our son was born premature. I spent a month in the hospital, the baby spent 7 weeks in NICU. Not as much as it could be, but still in 20k range after insurance. Hubby has a repossession on HIS credit from when we were separated. All told we have around 200k in debt.

We also have a past landlord who was getting ready to garnish wages because he was angry we left. the house we were in the furnace went out in October. And by late December we were STILL relying on electric heaters to try to keep the house warm enough for our kids. We quit paying rent in november and december because our electric bill was over 2k.

When we filed for bankruptcy we were bringing in maybe 2k every two weeks. For a family of 5 thats below the threshold.

The idea was we had certain bills we have to be able to pay. It wasn't about throwing up our hands and saying no more. It was about saying give us a chance to pay some of this back while being able to dismiss anything that was total nonsense. The house for example. But the medical bills, we will probably still have to pay those cause well kids need to see a dr at least once a year.


__________________________________________

We went today to the lawyer with the dealership paperwork. This time I stood over them and did it again. But today he was like take your son out of our office into the hall. So hubby could not be there. Which he was being a total jerk anyway. Then he said as we were leaving that we could not bring our son to his office anymore. He did not break anything. There was just him and his shitty paralegal. So he wasn't bothering anyone. He was just being a 2 year old and running in the nice wide open space and saying race you!

So we found a different lawyer. Gonna go in tomorrow and fight the nut job. And hopefully get this car before the old one completely dies.

[Shalom]

They told the insurance company the value on our home was around 350k which is what the insurance insured it for. Except we paid 95k for our home. And even that was higher than the county appraisal which sat at 82k. Where BOA got 350k I do not know.

I had something like that with an insurance company.

When I bought this house, I took over the previous owner's policy with Chubb, who were the only ones who would insure it at all, due to wiring not up to code (well it was up to code a hundred years ago when they built it, but codes change and knob-and-tube wiring isn't legal anymore). I had one claim with them, due to one of the boilers cracking (ran dry, low water cutoff didn't, tenant added water without letting it cool first), and the next year they raised my rate from $1500 to $2700. This means that in three years, they would have made back the cost of what they laid out for the boiler, and then would have been rooking me in perpetuity.

So I had an electrician go through the basement and rip out and replace the substandard wiring, then went looking for a new insurance company. The quotes I was getting from them were also outlandish. I asked them why, and they said they were insuring for a replacement value of $897,000. I asked them where on earth they came up with a ridiculous figure like that, and he said "Well for a house that's 33x115 feet, that's what the computer comes up with."

I said wait, back the truck up a moment. The lot is 33'x115', the house is only 25'x50'! He said hold on a minute. Then he came back and said, "Did you know you've been overinsured all these years?"

So you might be able to fight that valuation, if it's based on incorrect information. It's probably not worth that now in any case, even if it once was.

[cleorose]

Valuation

We tried. That was one of the things that jacked our payment. Instead of 1200 a year in house insurance it would be almost triple.

We had a 3 bedroom 2 bath craftsman that had been built in 1930. Still mostly plaster and lathe. One finished room in the basement. And a detached 3 car garage. The car needed some updates cosmetically but it was functional and spacious and I have a thing for built ins and this house had a lot of custom woodwork in the house and garage. No upstairs. It was nothing fancy and believe me when I say at 350k around here you can get a veritable mansion. 6-7 bedrooms and 5-6 baths with all the bells and whistles.

I submitted the county appraiser report but they didn't care about that. Only the bank appraisers valuation. And I submitted 3-4 times with the different refinance paperwork.

In order to change insurance providers we had to pay a FULL year upfront which was upwards of 1200. Which if you know about active duty military, That was nearly half of hubby's income for a month. And even they were upfront and said if the house is valued by the bank at 350k as the rebuild value thats what the insurance costs would reflect. so while our quote would be for 1200 for a year, they would inflate it because of some idiot bank appraiser.

At this point the house isn't worth half what we owe on it. You might be able to get 30- 40k on it at the very most. Because of their illegal actions I don't care what happens to it anymore. BOA had plenty of opportunities for us to fix this. But they have been shitty the whole route. Even the VA and the bankruptcy lawyers are like FKKK BOA. Those fkers are terrible to work with. IN fact I just got paperwork from them and they have filed against the bankruptcy that we owe them nearly 250k. Monthly appraisals since we bought the house from 2007 to 2014 at 300 a pop. Lawn care from 2007 to 2014. Except we lived there from 2007 to 2010. Never saw any appraisers. And no one mowed our lawn for us. I fcking wish. I got heat exhaustion twice from doing it.

The listed bogus repairs that they have SUPPOSEDLY done. We were there less than a month ago after we got the repair bill. And took pictures of their "repairs". Not sure how they claim to get in since we have the only working key. But those windows they replaced. Still broken. Mold still in basement. That hasnt been fixed. They also claimed to have paid our insurance company since 2007 for house insurance. We still have that insurance company actually. Not house insurance but we have renter's and car insurance. And we have had no house insurance since 2010 when we called USAA and cancelled it. And even then USAA told us we were behind because BOA hadn't paid them because well we were behind on our payments. So no money in escrow = no insurance.

According to our lawyer thats actually something they do in chapter 13 because if you get a winfall or a huge bump in income. They get more money.

But the Joke is on them. WE took hubby's disabilty settlement today and shifted the 13 to a 7.

Since we fired the crappy asshat lawyer yesterday and hired a new lawyer today. He says to expect our attorney to try to bill us for all kinds of nonsense. I said let him try I got documentation to prove how incompetent he was. Emails. voice mails etc. Got to love the digital age. I got a nasty letter saying we were told to complete a debtor course in a timely fashion and its been 5 months blah blah blah. And I have the certificate of completion dated less than 30 days after we filed.

All kinds of crazy around here.