The Gaming Thread

[gunsage]

If Bioware's involved, count me in. Now, it's ironic I say that because I didn't have the attention span for games like KOTR 1 & 2 or Morrowind. Yes, I know Morrowind isn't Bioware, but Bethesda, but it kinda reminded me of the same "issues" I have with most PC RPGs. In any case, NWN sounds cool, so I'll be checking it out. And yes, I'm very much interested in Mass Effect, but I'd need a next gen console first, wouldn't I?

Haven't tried any of the Baldur's Gate stuffs either, but yes, I'd like to check that out at some point. And I also personally enjoyed Diablo, finished it, but never quite finished Diablo 2 despite LOVING it. While we're at these kinds of RPGs, anyone tried Bard's Tale? And of course, I mean the most recent (2006?) version, not the old (Forgotten Realms?) version.

By the way, anyone ever try RPG Maker? For a while I was using RPG Maker 2000 because it felt like the games I was creating were sorta like FF6, but then for some reason, the XP version seemed to sort of abolish the side view battles and went back to DQ-like battles. I mean, don't get me wrong, it's not THAT big of a deal and there's quite a bit of the source you can modify so I suppose you could set it back up with a little time and persistence, but I digress.

For a while, I was making a ninja RPG and also trying to model the various environments, story, basic development ideas, etc. I had for Gun Sage. Anymore I don't use it much, but I figured it'd be an interesting topic. And I'm a bit pissed with Rune Factory. Yeah...tornado ripped through my field for two days when I really didn't have anything I could do inside the house, my funds were limited, the feed low, and JUST got access to the summer cave.

Fortunately, I didn't save, but I'm not sure whether it's a random occurrence or a preset one, so I may end up being screwed anyway. I mean, it's no biggie because I'll have plenty of wood after clearing away all the crap, but at the same time, I was constantly trying to make better and better crops with the supplements or whatever they are and THAT gets expensive. It's worth it, but DAMN it's expensive.

Aaaaaaand one more thing, then I'm out. Went to the Game Crazy/Hollywood Video last night in hopes of renting a few movies and buying some cheap games. Yeah...I understand the cashier was a little overwhelmed by how many people were in there, but I know this guy. He was slow since day one and has never really gotten any faster. It's his overall demeanor, really. Further, it seemed like he was the only one working...soooo...yeah, I just got some movies and GTFO.

The sad part is I was in there for 15 minutes browsing and his line didn't move once. I decided NOT to get into line, went to get some movies, and I was out in less than 5. Perhaps some cross-training is necessary? I don't know. I know they have the whole spiel of trying to get you to sign up for warranty, card, etc. I know that often (if not in all circumstances) they have to get the game from behind the counter, put it in the case, etc.

But come on...his line didn't move an inch. He's been there a while, too. I decided I'd probably go back either today or tomorrow and see if it's any better. What I was PLANNING on buying and are hopefully still there (buy 2 get 1 free)...

- Onimusha 2 - PS2. Or what I like to call "Samurai Karaoke." If you've played through the intro, you know.
- Deus Ex: Invisible War - XBox. Or what I like to call "Lagging Even On the PC." Yeah, they described some way you could SLIGHTLY fix it, but personally I think something's screwed in the engine itself.
- Shenmue 2 - XBox. I sold this at Buybacks without having beaten it. Honestly, it feels both better AND worse than the original. The story's okay, there are more fights, but personally, there just aren't enough opportunities for fights in my opinion and you don't exactly get paid for them either. Having to do crappy jobs to earn money is, well...crappy.

Doing the wrestling bouts in the game is fun, but it's still betting. It's not like in God Hand where you enter the arena and if you win you get a prize, but otherwise, no biggie, just try again. Plus, I've always felt they needed more stats for the game to make it a more dedicated RPG hybrid, but that's just me. And yes, I'm highly saddened that the idea of a Shenmue 3 is more or less dead. And Shenmue Online? Great idea, poor follow through...but then, that would NEVER happen with anything else, right?!

[Gravekeeper]

It's a shame, both of the games that Bioware gave to Obsidian (NWN and KOTOR), they ended up rushing and ruining. Both games start out fine, but then they just start feeling like the plot is being skipped... such as at the end of KOTOR 2 right before the last planet (Malachor V), is it just me or does it feel like there is an entire cutscene missing?

Yep. Actually, there was:

http://www.team-gizka.org/

Fan group thats been trying to finish the KOTOR2 by using all the voice recordings, scripts, etc that were unfinished but left in the game's resource files.

Its sad when fans have to finish your game for you. -.-

NWN2 wasn't much better off. The ending is a complete cop out and half the character subplots weren't finished ( There's pieces of them in the game files you can reactive with some creative tinkering, but they arent' done so they end up going no where. )

[Lingering Grin]

Neverwinter Nights 2 is epic failure to be bluntly honest.

My biggest problem with it is that, for some reason, it is WAY TOO HARD.

I have no idea why either... everything was fine, and then WHAM, I couldn't get into a fight without someone dieing. There was a boss fight I couldn't win, even on EASY (I was playing on D&D Hardcore until this point).

Plus, the henchmen characters -sucked-, having to use certain characters at certain points is cool and all, but having to switch them out constantly is annoying. The first NWN series was great. You could go into any situation with any set of characters and be fine. You weren't forced to repeatedly go back and forth between town in order to get a different henchmen because some stupid portal needs that annoying ass Gnome to sing for it...


It's a shame, both of the games that Bioware gave to Obsidian (NWN and KOTOR), they ended up rushing and ruining. Both games start out fine, but then they just start feeling like the plot is being skipped... such as at the end of KOTOR 2 right before the last planet (Malachor V), is it just me or does it feel like there is an entire cutscene missing?

[Gravekeeper]

Neverwinter Nights 2 is epic failure to be bluntly honest. Its not made by Bioware. It was a bug ridden horribly coded mess when it was first released and isn't much better currently. The engine requires far more system resources then it should. Tons of stuff was left unfinished ( This will become painfully obvious when you try to follow character subplots ).

As for the game itself the story is awful, you'll end up wanting to kill half the characters and the ending ( If you can call it an ending. Feels more like the budget ran out. ) will make you want to choke the writers with a pillow case. Its not even an ending. Its like a cruel joke on the players because the writers hate you. ;p

The only upside to the whole game was the stronghold part. Other then that...<wince>

You have been warned.

The entire game is a running joke among my friends. ><

Go find yourself a copy of Baldur's Gate 2 if you want a fantastic rpg ;p

[Shangri-laschild]

Think of NWN as a glorified version of Diablo Well maybe not really.

The single player allows you to get an NPC follower, but only 1. You initially go through a tutorial area at the start that teaches you about combat, and how to buy and sell items etc. The premise is you are at an academy for adventurers. Toward the end of the tutorial all hell breaks lose and you are thrust into a plot as there is an attempt on the lives of everyone at the academy and you find out you (or you and your friends) if you are on multi player were the targets of the attack.

The online play is really not worthwhile because the game takes so damned long to complete. If you have a good friend the multi player online or over a lan is very much worth it, otherwise its geared more toward the single player game.

the nice thing about the second one is that you can have up to 4 other NPC followers.
Edit: but they argue with eachother all the time!

[Chanlin]

Think of NWN as a glorified version of Diablo Well maybe not really.

The single player allows you to get an NPC follower, but only 1. You initially go through a tutorial area at the start that teaches you about combat, and how to buy and sell items etc. The premise is you are at an academy for adventurers. Toward the end of the tutorial all hell breaks lose and you are thrust into a plot as there is an attempt on the lives of everyone at the academy and you find out you (or you and your friends) if you are on multi player were the targets of the attack.

The online play is really not worthwhile because the game takes so damned long to complete. If you have a good friend the multi player online or over a lan is very much worth it, otherwise its geared more toward the single player game.

[gunsage]

My query hath been answered.

[Shangri-laschild]

So, is NWN online only or is it one of those that you really only get something out of it online? I ask because anymore it's either a developer strictly designs a game for single player and multiplayer is an afterthought (F.E.A.R. comes to mind) or it's obviously designed for multiplayer and single player is really only there because...well, I don't know, but it is and it's not all that great (the Halo series DEFINITELY comes to mind).

I only ever play it on my own offline. Never played it online so either it's ofline geared or it's an equal thing. If my friend and I try it online sometime I'll let you know how it is.

[gunsage]

Speaking of D&D, did anyone ever try Dungeons & Dragons Tactics for the PSP? I thought it looked kinda interesting and really enjoyed Metal Gear Acid 1 & 2, but I don't bring the PSP to work right now, so I never bothered grabbing that one. And while we're on the subject of tactics, anybody try the new Advance Wars yet? I've played them all except the new one and it looks awesome. Just wondering.

So, is NWN online only or is it one of those that you really only get something out of it online? I ask because anymore it's either a developer strictly designs a game for single player and multiplayer is an afterthought (F.E.A.R. comes to mind) or it's obviously designed for multiplayer and single player is really only there because...well, I don't know, but it is and it's not all that great (the Halo series DEFINITELY comes to mind).

The point of that little rant is what happened to games like Perfect Dark, Goldeneye, Quake 2, and countless others from the 90s? There were so many games that had such a solid foundation when it came to single player, but offered multiplayer, and both were GREAT. Not anymore, though. And don't get me wrong...games like F.E.A.R. and No One Lives Forever ARE fun to play online, but clearly they weren't designed with multiplayer in mind, therefore, they aren't quite as popular because multiplayer gaming has really caught on.

And really, the only other reason I ask about NWN's take is I'm not a MMORPGer. I'm just not. I mean, I'm even one of the most loyal FF followers you'll find and I really have no desire to try out FF11. dot.Hack is a fun concept, but again, it's a single player game. Yes, it relies on your imagination a tick, but the point is that it's still a single player game monikered as a MMORPG.

I know this might start a debate of standard RPGs vs. MMORPGs and maybe even tabletop will be included, so I'll start with my stance...just in case.

Single player RPGs

I grew up with them. My first was Final Fantasy 1. When I learned we had missed a few of them shortly after FF7 came out, I felt cheated, immediately researched, and got trans'd versions of the "missing" FFs. The bottom line is I'm an RPG addict. I don't often have time to fully complete RPGs, but I enjoy grinding, character development, and often, these games have AWESOME attention catchers for their intros so as to throw you right into it.

Massively multiplayer online RPGs

About the only MMORPG I'm "familiar" with, if you want to call it that, is Asheron's Call, which I saw one of my friends play for about 5 minutes on his 56k AOL connection. Yeah, it sucked. And yes, I know they're a LOT better now, but I can't justify paying that kind of money up front, then monthly, then the expansions, and dedicating that kind of time to it either. Yes, I realize I'd be spending about the same amount buying standard RPGs, but with that, I have SEVERAL RPGs as opposed to just one.

Further, I can get on and talk to my friends online just as easily as I could in a friggin' game. I really see no point to getting into MMORPGs. Yes, the draw is there and clearly they're VERY popular, but sorry, not for me. And yes, I realize I'm biased because I've never really played/got into one. Sorry.

Tabletop RPGs

I only tried one: Warhammer. I just don't have the imagination for it. I really don't. Hey, I can think up games on the spot, write all kinds of intricate details about them, features, etc. And yes, that's another reason I'd like to get into game development. My brother was the DM and he would always get frustrated with me because often instead of just saying "Oh, there's nothing more I can do, I'll just wait," I would respond with things like...

Me: "Well, there's nothing more I can do, so uh, I lick the wall!"
Bro: "...It tastes like a wall."
Me: "Oh, cool!"

Except I started doing that about every round, even when there were monsters until he finally threw up his hands and went "FINE, IT TASTES LIKE POISON AND YOU DIE!"

Me: "Blarg! No...! Such a short...life...gghghhhhhhaarrrrraaabuughhhhh...ugh ..."

Yeah, I more enjoyed painting all the little figurines than playing the actual game. Him and his friends really got into it and good for them because they really bonded over games like that. Me, though...nah.

[Chanlin]

My only rant with the Original NWN, and I'm gonna add D & D online (DDO) sort of separately here is that even with all of the options there are some parts that just did not translate well.

I unfortunately can't put into words what it is that bothers me about NWN so much, but being a hard core tabletop RPG fan I just couldn't really get into NWN.

As for DDO I can be a bit more specific. I have to say they did a very very good job with DDO in terms of areas, traps, etc. What bothered me the most is playing with other people, which eventually becomes needed. What I ran into trying to play a Rogue (my favorite class) is that I was really only needed for my ability to remove traps. I didn't have to search for them because the people I was with had already beaten the quest we were on and knew where all the traps and secret areas were so they did not need my ability to scout ahead or find the traps and secrets. And some of them would even just plow through the traps that weren't so bad and just get healed afterward. In other words my character was useless, and again there was no real D&D feel which boiled the game back to a glorified version of Diablo in my mind. Not to say Diablo is a bad game, but its not what I wanted out of DDO.

I will say I did have a lot of fun playing through the provided story line in NWN with a buddy of mine, it was essentially Diablo, just different story and more in depth character abilities.

[Shangri-laschild]

Dear god amazing. I don't like online games where I have to work with other people because I like to be able to do my own thing more than I can on an online game. It's really good. There are so many options and it's got a great storyline and graffics.

[gunsage]

How is Neverwinter Nights, anyway? I never got on that bandwagon, but I've heard good things.

[Shangri-laschild]

Yay! My best friend just finished my new computer and so I can now play NWN2! Can't tell you how long I've been waiting for a decent enough computer for this.

[gunsage]

Still DQ8ing away. I think I knocked out about 5 hours yesterday. The best part is since it's bright, flashy, and cartoony, my daughter LOVES it. In fact, I think it'd be fun to start a list of games that kids are interested in watching. Now remember, my daughter is less than two, so obviously it's flashy stuff and cartoony stuff that she enjoys. Anything that appears to be "too adult" (too much talking, too much drama, lots of text, etc.), she gets very bored with to the point of being fussy and just wanting to watch her cartoons instead. So far, here's what I've learned I can get away with...

- Okami
- Dragonquest 8
- Pretty much anything for the N64 (most of the games were relatively colorful and same thing applies with GC titles)

Okay so I guess I can't think of that many off the top of my head after all. But hey, it's win win. She normally watches a pretty decent amount of kids' shows anyway (Doodlebops, Foster's Home for Imaginary Friends, Handy Manny, etc.), so I just substitute with something she'll actually watch AND I get to play a game at the same time while also having her in my direct line of sight! And you might say "Ah but you could just let her watch what she wanted and play on the computer."

No, not exactly. Not if I wanted to keep her in my line of sight, anyway. Really, that's the most important thing. There are times where she's being so good I can nap on the couch while she watches TV and there are times where she's energetic enough that I could never get away with that and often have to make up stuff to do with her. It's not that it's not fun, it's just that personally, on my days off, I'd rather chill and relax. Sure, I'd love to go to Gameworks, too, but she's just not old enough for me to not have to push her around in a stroller there. I'm thinking maybe once she's 5 it'll be better for places like that.

Anyway, since we've been talking about more oldschool titles lately, I'd like to recommend a few deliberately obscure ones. Warning...shameless plugs ahead.

- Brandish
- Parasite Eve 1 & 2
- Final Fantasy stuffs
- Front Mission and Gun Hazard
- Monkey Island 1 - 3 ONLY
- Breath of Fire 2 - 4 ONLY

I think that's good enough for now. You get the idea.

[gunsage]

Here we go. I loved 7th Saga, but never got very far in it. If I remember correctly, I maybe got one rune and the world map and that's about it. It was fun, but VERY repetitive. I like the concept of it, though, and the fact that while the plot itself doesn't stray too much per character, the development, friends/enemies, etc. does. Fun stuff. Never tried the first Dual Orb, but did the second. Didn't like it very much because of how ridiculously hard it is.

Tales is awesome, but I was a bit disappointed with the latest ones. I think my favorites are the Destiny ones...simple and done very well. PW is awesome and I'm looking forward to the next one. Can't remember when it's due out, but I'll be waiting in anticipation. If I had to list kill shots, it'd be a little difficult, but I'll certainly try...

- The first time I beat Resident Evil 2. I mean, come on, it's you, him, and whatever you may have salvaged at the end. And if I remember correctly, aren't you also being timed?

- The same thing could be said for any Metroid game, really. You don't often have a save point right before the final boss...and then you typically have a mad dash to the surface, your ship, or whatever and, of course, are timed.

- Castlevania 4. If I remember correctly, you have to fight a few bosses in a row...THEN Dracula. Nice. Fortunately, I believe there are checkpoints between each, but still VERY tough.

- Final Fantasy 1. You know, I can't even remember the ending because it was that crappy and not worth it. However, the entire Chaos Temple and finally leading up to Chaos? The ending could've been a midget licking his own asshole and it wouldn't have mattered because it was just the fact that you FINALLY BEAT IT. And yes, the same could be said for MOST other FFs.

- Beating just about any boss on the new Ninja Gaiden game. Ugh.

Concerning DQ8, I enjoyed the original DQ, never really played/got into 2-4, 5 is okay, 6 is pretty cool, 7 was kinda lame...8 was just badass. Now granted, it can be a bit slow, but that's primarily because of how long it takes to get everywhere, how grinding intensive it is, etc. Again, I think it's more for oldschool fanatics than anything and if you never played any previous DQs, I'm not surprised with the fact that you thought it was slow. The original DQ? Yeah, THAT'S slow.

And further concerning DQ8, I'm at the emo king's place. And yes, this is when I yet again complain about the lack of savepoints (working on getting to wisher's peak at dark). Ugh.