I give up... (VERY long and emotional)

[Jack T. Chance]

As of last night, I have completely given up on my life. Last night, something happened that was the final straw in a long line of defeats, and it has forced me to accept what I've known to be the truth for a long time; I am a failure, and I will never be anything else. By every measure that is important to me, I have failed in this life. No matter what I do, no matter how hard I try, or how good my best is, it is never enough. Every time I manage to take one step forward towards my life goals, life shoves me back 2 steps, makes me fall flat on my face, and then proceeds to kick me while I'm down. And after 37 years, it's finally become too much for me to bear. :(

I've only ever had simple, achievable goals for myself. My version of the American Dream is very plain, nothing too fancy. All I've ever wanted was a good job that I could enjoy going to every day, doing something that made me happy, and paying me well enough to keep my bills paid and to have a little money left over for fun. Outside of work, all I've ever wanted was to find my special someone, someone who could accept me and love me for who I am, so that I could become a husband and maybe, someday, a father. Get married, buy a little house somewhere, and have a good life.

But at every turn, no matter what I do, even when I do nothing wrong, the Powers That Be refuse to allow me even the smallest of successes. Every time I've found a job that is what I'm looking for, a job where I truly belong, where I'm truly successful and living up to my greatest potential, life conspires to take it away from me. I've just had, in the last 3 years, 2 jobs IN A ROW where I truly fit in, they were truly the right job for me… and then the company went bankrupt and went out of business, leaving me unemployed again. And now, with the economy in the crapper, I have no hope of finding such a job again anytime soon. :no:

Outside of work, I've never had enough money to buy that little house I dream about. The cost of living is too high, and the wages in my chosen career field of retail management too low, for me to be able to succeed at even that one little thing.

In social circles, I've always been forced into the role of the loner, the outcast… the pariah. I was never one of the "cool" kids, never got invited to the big parties, never got to develop the social skills that the "cool" kids develop. Sure, I have a few very good friends who are basically the brothers I never had. But while I continually fail at every thing I try to do to achieve the life I want to have, I see them finding great careers, getting married, having children, buying homes… while I am stuck in the role of the third wheel, unable to have that kind of life myself, always the outsider looking in.

And as for finding someone to share this life with… it has recently been proven to me conclusively that there isn't an available woman anywhere in this world that is capable of loving me, there is no one that can accept me for who I am. I am too different, too unique, and the women of the world too weirded out by me, for that to ever happen. They say that there's someone for everyone, people tell me that I'll find someone, but finding someone is only the first step. If that someone is unable to open her heart to you, unable to accept you and to love you, then finding that someone didn't do you any good, did it? They say that there's someone for everyone, but what if there was only ever ONE someone for me, someone that I had, once, long ago, and lost? Someone who gave up on me after 3 years, because even she couldn't fully accept me for who and what I am. :(

The truth that no one wants to hear, that everyone refuses to accept, is that we are emotional beings that have emotional needs, and the most important emotional need we have is to love another and be loved in return. This is simple, psychological truth. To deny it is to deny your existence as a human being. And it is a need that can only be met in one very particular way. The love given to you by your parents can't fulfill that need. It can't be met through the love shared with any siblings you might have, or the love given to you by any children you might have had. The love shared with your closest friends can't meet this need, either. The only way it can be met is to find your soul mate, that special someone that will complete you, become the yin to your yang, whose love will make you a whole person. We aren't MEANT to be solitary beings, we weren't meant to walk through this life alone. We were meant for something more, to have that special someone to share this life with. And yet, this, too, is constantly denied me. In this regard, too, I am a failure. Even when I do everything right, I still end up alone. :(

This week, I celebrated my 37th birthday. 37 years ago I came into this world… was cast down into this HELL. Because that's where I am, I am in HELL. I am cursed. Years ago, I had a frightening moment of clarity, where I could clearly see the path that I am on in this life, and how it ends. I have done everything in my power to turn away from that path, to make a better life for myself, to avoid my fate. But every time I take one step forward, life knocks me back 2 steps, makes me fall flat on my face, and then proceeds to kick me when I'm down.

For years now, the only thing that's kept me going was the one little spark of hope that remained within me. A little spark that was too tenacious, too stubborn to burn out. That little spark gave me reserves of strength that I never knew I had within me, that helped me through the darkest days of my life. But last night, that little spark finally went out. I have no hope left anymore. I've had all I can take, and I have nothing left to give. :(

What do you do when you've been a failure your entire life? What do you do when all your hope is gone? What do you do when life has knocked you down so many times that you don't even know what it's like to stand on your own two feet anymore? How do you pick yourself back up when all your strength is utterly gone? How do you pick yourself back up when you know that life is only going to knock you right back down again? How do you face another day when all you want to do is die?

This is where I am at right now, the questions that are weighing on my mind. I have spent 37 years living in a world that I do not belong in. I have never fit in, and I never will. I'm too unique, too DIFFERENT for this world. And after 37 years of living in this hell, all I want to do is die… but I'm too much of a coward to even end it. I want nothing more right now than to plunge a knife into my chest and end my suffering… but I'm not even enough of a man to be able to do that. Even there, I am a failure.

So, as of this day, as of this moment, I have officially given up on my life. I have reacted in the only way I can. For 37 years, I've had to live with the knowledge that there is terrible darkness inside me, like a black hole, waiting to pull me in and consume me. For decades, I have fought against the darkness, drawing on my friends and family for strength, holding it at bay as long as I could. Last night, it finally became too strong, and I finally became too weak. The darkness has finally consumed me and I have no strength left, no willpower left to fight it anymore. :(

I'm only posting this today because there are a couple people here that I've come to think of as friends, and I know they would wonder what's going on when they notice that I'm not around much, if at all. I know they would wonder what's going on with me, why I'm not posting. And frankly, it's because this life, this world has taken everything from me, and I have nothing left to give anymore. In the face of that knowledge, coming to a message board and chatting with people online just isn't as important right now.

I know that some of you here are very wise, and will probably offer your thoughts and your wisdom. I will be reading what people have to say, but if I don't reply to you, please don't take it personally. It just means that I can't think of anything productive to add to the discussion.

In closing, I'd like to offer some advice of my own. If you are fortunate enough to have found some success in this life, cherish every moment of it. Don't ever take what you have for granted. If you have a job that is truly the right job for you, a job that you love doing, that makes you happy, cherish every moment of it while you can, because you don't know what's right around the corner, especially in this economy.

And if you're fortunate enough to have someone to share this life with, cherish him or her, hold onto them tightly, and never, ever take them for granted. You may fight, you may argue, they may frustrate you at times, at times you may wonder what you saw in them in the first place… but I urge you to remember why you fell in love with them in the first place, and to never take them for granted, because you are blessed, and you have a gift that is rare and precious beyond all measure. Treasure every moment with that person, because there are those of us that aren't as fortunate as you are. Treasure them, and always make sure they know that you love them, always make sure they know how important they are to you, because you don't want to end up where I am now. I wouldn't wish this hell on my worst enemy.

And on that note, I'm going back to bed. I just can't face the world today; the pain of my existence is too much to bear. :(

[CaroPhoenix]

:hug:

Jack - if you need someone to talk to over IMs, just PM me and I'll give you my IM name.

Right now, I'm at a loss on words that will make you feel better without being too trite.

Just know there are people here who care about you.

:hug:

[Der Cute]

Argh.

You sound definitely...sad-angry. Sad that life isn't doing what you expect it to, and angry that you want things and they don't happen....

Been there. Done that.

I recently realized that I find jobs that I like but when theres something about them I dont like, I self-sabotage. Why? I have no idea.

A few years ago, around 32 or so, I was feeling close to what you feel. I wanted a family, a home, (no white picket fence) but something....solid. Stability. Structure. It's taken longer than I expected it to, but it is coming together.

Personally, I think you need to go get some counseling. You're holding yourself to a list of requirements, but forgetting that Earth/Life doesn't run on the same schedule as you. You're saying you're 37, and alone (hugs here, that sucks) and you SHOULD have woman/fam/home stuff. Do Not Should on yourself. That's an expectation of X, when Y or XY may be happening.

Can you go to a doctor's clinic/homeless clinic, and get a physical? Check your thyroid (yes, men get that too) and ask about counseling. You may not get the help quickly (argh) but you need to check physical before delving into the brain realm.

Honey, you're in a spot where it is very bleak. I don't blame you for feeling like that - I have been in the Ditch of Depression, and that fucker has a very steep bank to get out.... You're asking for help. Go to the professionals and start there.

Also purchase a book called "What color is my parachute" and fill it out. You'll learn about yourself in there. (and yeah, at 37, you can still learn)

Hugs and chocolate, and kitty purrs.
Cutenoob

[Peppergirl]

I'm not particularly good at putting emotional things into words, but please don't hesitate to PM me if you need to talk. I'm a good listener and am great at advice (other peoples lives) and open to listening to venting.

Hang in there, please. We care about you!

[Aethian]

I'm here too...we haven't always seen eye to eye on some things but wheres the spice of life to agree with everyone?

I'm up for priviate pm's as well. Could even do a phone call if needed.

[Reyneth]

Honey, you're in a spot where it is very bleak. I don't blame you for feeling like that - I have been in the Ditch of Depression, and that fucker has a very steep bank to get out.... You're asking for help. Go to the professionals and start there.

ITA with this and other things posted.

If your job situation really is dire right now, maybe you can find what *else* you want to do and pursue that. It's not too late, and from what you have written, what do you have to lose?

Other than that.......{{{{{{hugs}}}}}}}}

[Jester]

I have two conflicting instincts here. Well, two different instincts, as I don't think they necessarily are conflicting.

The first is to tell you to get professional counseling. While I am in no way trained as a psychiatrist, psychologist, therapist, or other counselor, I have seen enough clinical depression in my time to recognize it in you. Please, Jack...seek help.

The second is to tell you, fuck you, you selfish little whiney shit. You make it out like you have had the worst life ever, but the fact is, there are millions, yes MILLIONS who have had it worse. Yet you say that because life hasn't turned out the way you want it, it sucks, it is hell You don't have the job you want? Life sucks. You haven't found the girl you want? Life sucks. You aren't where you want to be with all your "simple" goals? Life sucks.

I am currently watching the ESPY's, where they just presented the Arthur Ashe Award for Courage to Nelson Mandela. This man spent twenty-seven years in prison for his beliefs. You know, those silly beliefs that a person should be free to decide their own life and their own government despite what color their skin might be? Yeah, those beliefs. Many of his brethren were beaten, tortured, and killed for the same reason. Did he give up? Did he resign from life because it sucked? Let me think about this. Oh yeah...no, he most certainly did not.

Okay, maybe that example is too esoteric for you. Nelson Mandela is not "average" enough a guy for you, maybe. Hard to argue that.

Let's try a different example. Say, me. Hi there. How ya doin'? I'd like to introduce myself. I am a guy who, in his 39 years, has been dumped, cheated on, and lied to by girlfriends. I have been fired and unemployed. I have been homeless and forced to live with my parents as an adult. I have been unable to pay rent or bills on time. I have had jobs that I hated. I have failed classes and dropped out of college. I was unable to go to my first choice of colleges due to financial reasons, partly due to a trusted relative ripping off my family. I have lost every election in which I have been a candidate. I have watched family and friends die, not just from old age, but from disease, car wrecks, suicide, and at least one possible murder. Included in that was my father, who died when I was 10 and he was 48. He died of a disease that is potentially hereditary, especially to male offspring. I have had my heart broken by women several times. I have never been married, though most of my friends and family have married at least once. I have only asked one girl to marry me, and she left me a year later. And, as I said above, I am 39. Which is two years older than you. I have failed in many things I have tried, attempted, and had ambitions to do, too many to list here.

And yet my girlfriend describes me as obnoxiously positive. She sees a door slamming shut, I see an opportunity to find a new door, or to kick the shut door down. I have been through too much bullshit in my life to let stupid shit and setbacks get me down more than momentarily. I firmly believe in that adage of "that which does not kill you makes you stronger."

The legendary basketball coach lived by a simple mantra given to him by his father as a child: "Don't whine. Don't complain. Don't make excuses." I kinda like that myself.

But the fact is you will probably read all this and say "So what? Who cares? Life sucks." Which tells me my first instinct was right all along: you need to get some professional counseling, because nothing we or anyone else will say will help you at all until you admit that you need help. Not to anyone else, but to yourself.

That being said, you said three things that I wanted to address individually.

In social circles, I've always been forced into the role of the loner, the outcast… the pariah.

No one forced you into that. You chose that. Unless you are a complete clod, you chose to be a pariah, a loner. How can I know this? Because you said you do have friends, so you can't be a complete clod. That and your nihilist attitude tell me that you chose that role for yourself. As you yourself said, you are different, you are unique, the world is not ready for you. That came out of your mouth, you styled yourself that way....not others.

And as for finding someone to share this life with… it has recently been proven to me conclusively that there isn't an available woman anywhere in this world that is capable of loving me, there is no one that can accept me for who I am. I am too different, too unique, and the women of the world too weirded out by me, for that to ever happen.

I have two years on you, and while I am in a relationship now, I don't know if that will last or not. The girl in question is convinced it will fail because every other relationship she has had before this has failed. By failure, of course, she means they all ended. Well, all of my previous relationships ended, too, but I don't consider all of them failures, and I took from them, even the failures, something that I learned, something I did not know before it. So you haven't met anyone yet? So fucking what? Does that mean you won't? And even if you don't, you said yourself you had a 3 year relationship. I have never had a 3 year relationship. I know people who have literally never had a romantic relationship, let alone a 3 year one.

The truth that no one wants to hear, that everyone refuses to accept, is that we are emotional beings that have emotional needs, and the most important emotional need we have is to love another and be loved in return. This is simple, psychological truth. To deny it is to deny your existence as a human being. And it is a need that can only be met in one very particular way. The love given to you by your parents can't fulfill that need. It can't be met through the love shared with any siblings you might have, or the love given to you by any children you might have had. The love shared with your closest friends can't meet this need, either. The only way it can be met is to find your soul mate, that special someone that will complete you, become the yin to your yang, whose love will make you a whole person.

To this I say simply bullshit. And I say that on many levels. There are many people who live satisfied lives without romance. Asexual people, priests, monks, nuns, people who frankly don't care for the company of others, and on the negative side, people who truly are freaks, more so than you ever could be, no matter what you may think.

And frankly, women have come and go, but the love of my friends and family has been one thing that has kept me going, stronger and stronger every day. When the women have failed me, lied to me, used me, cheated on me, manipulated me, dumped me, left me, and left me broken and broken-hearted, my friends and family, those who truly love me, have been there to help me pick up the pieces and move forward. If you really think that this love, this wonderful, selfless, priceless love is so empty, so devoid of meaning that it can never satisfy you, never make you a whole person, the problem is not in your friends or your family, but in you. After all, a man who does not love himself can never allow himself to be truly loved by another, nor can he truly love another himself.

That's a fact, Jack.

Get some help. Now.

Please. For your own good and that of those who love you.

[RootedPhoenix]

*hugs*

Jack, I'm here. There are those that care. Depression has a terrible way of making everything look awful. I'm near that spot myself, and I've been there.

I just wanted to say that I'm here and I care. *hugs again*

[protege]

Depression has a terrible way of making everything look awful.

I've had to deal with depression most of my life. I know *exactly* what it's like. Contrary to what others (and those damn commercials) claim, it's not something you can "snap out of." There's no cure for it. You can *control* it, but you can't get rid of it. With that said, I have to deal with that shit *every* day. It sucks, but I have to deal with it.

[Chazzie]

I pretty much second what the wonderful-advice giver Jester had to say.

That said, I once too thought, in my wonderful teenage years, "I give up". I sat down on the floor.

And about half a second later, I thought "O... Okay... Um... Now what?"

And I couldn't think of what it meant. I didn't want to commit suicide, because it's not like I have any idea what, if anything's, on the other side. It wasn't like I was going to stop eating or sleeping.

And that thought did, and always has, made me happy. Because to me, there's no such thing as "giving up". You physically can't. There's no way to make your problems go away if you 'give up'. You can only procrastinate on dealing with them. You can take time to feel sorry for yourself, but that's only going to get boring after a while, and you just pick yourself up and keep going without realizing it eventually.

[Lvl_9_Gazebo]

I have something to say here, but I don't have time to say it now. If you will read it tomorrow, Jack T. Chance, I'll put it here for you.

[Jack T. Chance]

So, today, my best friend came by my house and made me come out and shoot pool with him so he could keep an eye on me and make sure I didn't do anything "stupid". It didn't help very much, but that's not really his fault.

In the past, when I got severely depressed, it was usually due to just one factor, one problem, and was therefore easier to overcome. This time, there's just too much that has all happened in a relatively short period of time. It feels different this time, deeper than it ever has been in the past... hence my comment about the darkness consuming me. Right now, I honestly have no strength and no willpower left to fight my way back. I honestly don't know if I ever will be able to recover this time. I've just taken one blow too many.

Jester, the tactic you've taken IS a good one, it worked in the past. The last time I got into a severe depression, I had a friend that took that tactic with me, and it worked then. But again, this time is different. It's not working like it did then. :(

I'm mainly posting this tonight to let everyone know I'm still here, haven't gone and done anything "stupid" yet. Those of you that have offered your support and kind words, I just want you to know that I appreciate it, even if it isn't doing much for me right now. Those of you that sent PMs, I'll be replying to them eventually. I'm not very talkative right now, so I'll answer them as the right words come to me. The same goes for individual posts that I want to reply directly to, and just haven't found the right words for.

[Jester]

Right now, I honestly have no strength and no willpower left to fight my way back. I honestly don't know if I ever will be able to recover this time.

You will. I know this. You know how I know? You still give enough of a shit to bother posting here. Which means you have not totally resigned. Whether you realize it or not, you still have hope within you. And that....that is something we can work with.

Jester, the tactic you've taken IS a good one, it worked in the past. The last time I got into a severe depression, I had a friend that took that tactic with me, and it worked then. But again, this time is different. It's not working like it did then.

Not yet. I am not known for giving up all that easily. Don't believe me? I have a stack of restraining orders as Exhibit A, Your Honor!

[Barracuda]

I am in the exact same position, except for age (never married, never even had a serious relationship, very lonely, hate every job I can get, want jobs I never seem to land, financial trouble, never can seem to catch a break....) I am 28. I have managed to start digging myself out of the hole I am in though, and I would like to offer advice as to what has helped ME:
First of all, are you taking an anti depressant? If not, see a doctor. Ask if you are a candidate for one. I know that putting forth the effort right now to see a doctor is very hard (depression makes me tired, listless, and all I want to do is sleep and watch TV or read.) but DON'T GIVE INTO IT. You have to start somewhere. If nothing else, next time you visit the store, pick up some St. John's Wort. Take it every day. It will take a week or two to really kick in, but you should feel a little better about life. Also take L-Tyrosine and Choline & Inositol tablets. Depression causes a chemical imbalance in the brain, these two supplements help correct it. Take a good multivitamin as well; again, can help correct chemical imbalance (if you aren't eating right.) Suffering from anxiety as well? (Social or just in general, do you get nervous or upset doing everyday tasks, do you plan excessively for certain things because you are afraid of them?) If so, take grape seed extract.
Exercise every day can help too; it releases "feel good" hormones that can counteract depression. Take little steps to help yourself every day, and you WILL see a turnaround. Above all, follow other people's advice and seek professional help.

[Lvl_9_Gazebo]

Okay, Jack, here goes.

I know that when you're in a black spot, the last thing you want to hear is someone else's laundry list of what all is wrong with their life. However, hear me out.

First, let me point out that I grew up in poverty. Never went hungry, mind you, but that was only because my mother did. I won't describe the trailer I lived in except to say that to keep the cats out, we had to put my rock collection, which was in a peach basket, over the hole in the floor that they usually used to get in.

Anyway... moving on from that, we get into disease. Both of my parents have diabetes. My father's kidneys no longer work and he's on dialysis because of it. He has also lost both his legs to it. My mother, meanwhile, has gone blind from hers and has lost the hearing in one ear, not to mention her sense of balance because of that. Because of a birth defect, she will probably soon lose the ability to walk at all. Meanwhile, my niece has some weird disease where the immune system attacks the fat layer under the skin. It's disfiguring. I have hiv, which was given to me by my very first boyfriend, who cheated on me, caught it and passed it along. I doubt he knew he had it, but I'm sure that if he did know he would not have cared because he hated me.

That brings me to relationships. That first boyfriend cheated and beat me. Others just cheated. Some just disappeared. In the interval, I've been raped. I forgot to mention also that I was sexually abused as a child. Currently, I've begun to rekindle something with one of my exes and found out that the reason he couldn't handle things then was because he too was viciously sexually abused (by his brother), and that stirred up a entire crock of mental issues. This ex of mine has lupus, by the way, which I guess I should have mentioned in the disease litany.

Meanwhile, I worked in motel hell for about five and a half years until the thought of going to work made me physically ill. Now I work in a factory doing manual labor way below my education.

But anyway... I say all that to convince you that I am quite an authority on despair. I've had 28 years thus far to dwell on it. I have considered killing myself. I know despair.

I also know that things can change. People say that suicide is not the answer, but I can assure that it most definitely is. You'd better be goddamn sure you're asking the right question though, and I don't think you are.

You don't want to be told that you have things to be thankful for, but you do and every day that you get up and go do something, anything, is a day that something interesting can happen. Just because it didn't happen yesterday or today doesn't mean it can't happen tomorrow.

What should you do while you're waiting though? See the sights. This world and all that is in it was not put here for you and someone else. It was put here for you, so go see it. As others have suggested, exercise. It feels good, and it's a good way to meet people. Eat something new and interesting. Food's a gift. Talk to your friends. Hell, take your friends to eat something new and intereting, take them with you to exercise, or take them with you to see the sights. You have people who care about you, obviously, so let them care about you and let them help you.

That's what you can do by yourself. However, as others are pointing out, this may not be something you can do entirely by yourself. There's no shame whatsoever in seeing a professional or taking medication for depression. Hell, it's why all these professionals went to college in the first place and it's why someone took the time to mix all these funny chemicals together into a pill.

I'm starting to get a little loopy from my medication, but I do sincerely hope that helped. PM me if you like. I've been where you are, thought about going where you've thought about going, but yet I'm still here and I'd like for you to stay here with all of us.

[Jack T. Chance]

Uh, hauntedheadnc, that might have been just a little too much info there, bud.

Anyway... having had more time to collect my thoughts, here's a little bit better description of what I'm feeling right now. Over the last couple months, an opportunity had presented itself for me to make some positive changes in my life and get it moving in the right direction again. A big part of that opportunity was that I had met someone online and begun dating her. I finally thought I had found what I've been searching for after all these years. I let myself believe that I might actually get to make a fresh start here, after so many years of failing to do so. I foolishly let myself think that this time would be different, but I suppose I should have known better. It didn't work out, and that piled on top of all the other things going on in my life just proved to be the final straw.

Life has once again sent me the message loud and clear, and it has finally sunk in. I don't get to be like other people, I don't get to be "normal". I don't get to start over, don't get to change my lot in life. I don't get to have the things that other people have and take for granted. It's not allowed. I am cursed, and doomed to suffer my fate, whether I like it or not. So, there's no point in even trying anymore. There's no point in picking myself back up and putting myself back out there when all I ever get for my trouble is more pain. So, lesson learned. I give up. There's no fight left in me anymore. I doubt I'll ever recover from this depression, but if I do, it will take a very long time. And it'll be a cold day in Hell before I ever again trust a woman enough to open my heart to her. No good ever comes of that. :(

[Giggle Goose]

Uh, hauntedheadnc, that might have been just a little too much info there, bud.

I actually thought it was quite touching. He was only trying to help.

And it'll be a cold day in Hell before I ever again trust a woman enough to open my heart to her. No good ever comes of that. :(

What if you meet someone that would actually appreciate and RECIPROCATE that? You might let something really great pass you by. Or you could get shafted again. Who knows? Love is a high-stakes risk in my eyes.

I've been reading this, and I know that you're in a very dark place right now and whatever anyone says isn't going to make it better. That's why I haven't responded yet. Right now, I DO have some of those things that you have mentioned, and while I'm young I do believe I've worked hard for them. I've also loved with my whole heart even after being burned numerous times. I also don't take my blessings for granted, and I realize that they could be taken away from me any second. But why dwell on it? I'm not any better than you because I "get" to have the things you've mentioned. Even after I was used and abused, I knew I HAD to be worth more than how I was being treated. Not to repeat what everyone else is saying, but they're absolutely right: no one will love you until you learn to love yourself.

[Jack T. Chance]

I actually thought it was quite touching. He was only trying to help.I know he was, I was just... surprised that he chose to reveal some of the things he revealed. If I'd been through what he's been through, I don't know that I'd reveal all of that on a public forum. But different strokes for different folks, I guess. :shrug:What if you meet someone that would actually appreciate and RECIPROCATE that? You might let something really great pass you by.I'll cross that bridge IF I come to it. But I have serious doubts that I'll ever be so lucky again. Even if I DO manage to find someone like that, she's going to have to prove herself worthy of my trust, and it's now apparent to me that I've been too trusting, so she'd likely have a tough road ahead of her in that regard. :blink:Or you could get shafted again. Who knows? Love is a high-stakes risk in my eyes.True. And unfortunately for me, some people aren't willing to take that risk. :(I've been reading this, and I know that you're in a very dark place right now and whatever anyone says isn't going to make it better. That's why I haven't responded yet. Right now, I DO have some of those things that you have mentioned, and while I'm young I do believe I've worked hard for them. I've also loved with my whole heart even after being burned numerous times. I also don't take my blessings for granted, and I realize that they could be taken away from me any second. But why dwell on it? I'm not any better than you because I "get" to have the things you've mentioned. Even after I was used and abused, I knew I HAD to be worth more than how I was being treated. Not to repeat what everyone else is saying, but they're absolutely right: no one will love you until you learn to love yourself.And that's the part no one seems to understand, probably because I haven't come out and said it. Until this weekend, I was in a really good place, in spite of losing my job in April in the midst of the worst recession in decades. For the last few years, I HAVE been able to love myself and accept that I was a good person, doing the best he can. I felt good enough about myself this time to do something I've never been able to do in the past: make the first move. In the past, the women I've been involved with always let me know that they were interested before I'd managed to work up enough courage to let them know that I felt the same way. They'd always been the ones to make the first move. This time, I had enough self-confidence to make that first move. And in spite of that fact, I've still failed. So, I honestly don't know what to do anymore. Like I said before, no matter what I do, it's never good enough. I really don't know what else to say. :blink:

[Red_Dazes]

I may not be in the best spot to offer truly valuable advice... I'm not even past my mid twenties yet. But I have lived though some unbelievable bull shit in the last several years, a lot of it I still can't even talk about.

Just three years ago I sat in my bedroom while my mom was out of town, holding the pistol my father left us when he died. With a love letter and apology note sitting on my desk. Things had fallen so far for me I really couldn't see anything getting better. I didn't trust anyone, I had been betrayed and hurt so many times that I didn't think I could ever recover enough to trust or love again. I was an out cast in life and school, my 'friends' and teachers and even my own family alienated me because I was different. I was always sad, every day. Alone and scared. I had been able to lift myself up and out of the darkness up until that day. I just quit, completely gave up, I couldn't even cry anymore, I was just used up.
Then the phone rang... I went to answer it... just in case it was my mom checking up on me. It turned out it was just a telemarketer. But as I was walking back to my room I accidentally knocked an old photo album on the floor. When I picked it up a picture of my father fell out. And I remembered something he used to say to me when I was growing up.

"Life is tough all over. But when you fall down, no mater what, you have to get up. Take your time getting your feet. Brush your self off and try again. It's not about coming out on top Red, or about being happy all the time. It's about finding the little things that make you happy, even once in a while, and never letting go of that feeling in that moment. And never quit trying to find another one."

... I'm still not alright all the time. I still get depressed, I still cry almost every other day. And god knows I still think sometimes that it would have better to give up... But I haven't, even though I've wanted to, because giving up is admitting defeat... and I just can't stand the thought of that.

*sigh* long winded... I guess in the end **HUGS** And know that you aren't the only person who feels this way, you maybe the only one who has the EXACT circumstances, but the feeling... we understand. And while no one can really pull you out of it except you, we are here for you if you need a hand up.

[wagegoth]

Life has once again sent me the message loud and clear, and it has finally sunk in. I don't get to be like other people, I don't get to be "normal".

THERE IS NO NORMAL. That's bullshit. It's the story advertisers use to sell you crap; it's the story the government uses to get you to conform; it's the story the media uses to get you to follow their lead.

My older son and I apparently fall on the autism spectrum, at the higher end. So we have our issues. There's a male coworker who is much more aural than visual, than the average man. We get along great, apparently because we sort of meet in the middle. There is not one person I work with that could be considered normal. They're above average in intelligence, have mental issues that don't fall under normal but they have learned to make work for them, are gifted in some way, have made some good choices, have made some bad choices, etc.

I don't get to start over, don't get to change my lot in life. I don't get to have the things that other people have and take for granted. It's not allowed. I am cursed, and doomed to suffer my fate, whether I like it or not. So, there's no point in even trying anymore. There's no point in picking myself back up and putting myself back out there when all I ever get for my trouble is more pain. So, lesson learned. I give up. There's no fight left in me anymore. I doubt I'll ever recover from this depression, but if I do, it will take a very long time.

Personally, I don't believe the Universe cares that much about us as individuals. It's got much better things to do than curse someone. Now, if you want to believe in fate, get a Chinese life horoscope done. They'll tell you which decades will be your most successful. Then you can curse fate if you want.

I have been diagnosed as chronically depressed. Most of the meds don't work for me, and the one that did caused a serious physical problem that forced me off of it. Some days it really is a fight to do anything. I really do understand how you feel.

As to your job history: you describe yourself as a pariah, but you've successfully held jobs in retail management, which is about as unpariahish as you can get. Retail managers have to be able to handle employees and customers, a truly difficult situation. I've done it and I don't anymore, for good reason. Are you only looking for jobs in retail? Have you tried transferring your experience and skills to another field? Being able to successfully manage people and a business does not limit you to retail. If you've decided you hate retail, then start looking at certificate programs for other fields. I know two people who are working successfully but are studying to be x-ray techs. They both believe that a healthcare position working with patients, but not nursing, is a good fit, and completely different from the work they do now.

And it'll be a cold day in Hell before I ever again trust a woman enough to open my heart to her. No good ever comes of that.

So you've gone out with women and it didn't work. Have you ever analyzed the women you choose to go out with? Are you basically dating the same woman serially, with variations in her appearance? Counseling can help you with that.

My personal suggestion is that you quit actively looking for love. Cutenoob is absolutely right about the DO NOT SHOULD. You can make a schedule of expectations, but that doesn't mean they'll happen on schedule. The girl you're looking to marry is also a human being. She has needs and wants and maybe a schedule of her own. She probably has a job, maybe even a career. Maybe she would be the perfect fit for you, but what if she doesn't want the white picket fence, two kids and a dog dream? What would you do? Would you give up all or part of the dream to be with her? How much are your expectations interfering with you moving forward with your life? How many times have your expectations screwed up friendships and relationships and jobs? Be honest. I'll bet it's a lot.

There's nothing wrong with goals. Goals are good. Goals are important. Expectations, now, they can be killers.


So, get some counseling. I don't know if you have health insurance, which will affect what you can get, but if you are unable to work or look for work because of depression, depending on your state, you may be able to get disability. You should be able to obtain some help through state agencies. Look into medication. Sometimes the right medicine can be like a bolt of lightning.


And talk to the people who offered to chat here. There's an awful lot of good people on this board who would be happy to help.

[Lvl_9_Gazebo]

I know he was, I was just... surprised that he chose to reveal some of the things he revealed. If I'd been through what he's been through, I don't know that I'd reveal all of that on a public forum. But different strokes for different folks, I guess. :shrug:

Fact of the matter is, I've lived an unbelievably brutal life thus far. Probably, the only Americans who have had it worse than me are kids who ended up in foster care. However, the point is, if I can live that kind of life and still end up in a good place, just about anyone can. And, if I think it will help, I will cheerfully whip the cloth off this entire ugly painting that is my life and let you see it. Life's too short for modesty sometimes.

[Rapscallion]

I know he was, I was just... surprised that he chose to reveal some of the things he revealed.

Interestingly enough, I recognised a fair number of the things HauntedHeadnc put in there from previous posts - bits here and there rather than in one post, but a fair amount of that was already in the public domain.

Rapscallion

[Der Cute]

Jack,

1. You have depression. I can hear it from your postings. It doesn't sound like a "blah me day" it sounds like dysthymia, a low level underlying depression. Where the baseline of happiness is lower than general public's.

2. You're feeling sorry for yourself. OK, that's legit. After a day of "woe is me"-ness, get off your ass and do something ELSE! Sweety, because I'm so weird, I piss people off easily. I'm an east-coast personality in the hold-your-hand-wipe-yo-ass temperment area of the NW. I do.NOT.FIT. here. So I lose jobs. A lot. I lose job. I feel crappy for 24 hours (my deal with myself) and then say, FUCK IT, let's go.

3. As I said before: you have a list of achievements you're holding yourself to. With time constraints. THE UNIVERSE HAS A DIFFERENT CLOCK!!!!! You can set goals. That's great. But put a catch in those goals: If something happens to set me back, I will accept it and move on.
Example: I wanted to finish college by 30yrs old. I was doing great. Everything was going according to plan. Something happened and I almost committed suicide - my anti depressant stopped working, and I slid into the ditch. I had to drop a class or 2. Those Classes were not available for 12 more months!! AAAAAARG! I had to say, Fuckit, this it out of my control, and I need to get back on track before I can bitch about missing my grad goal.
Now that I look back at it? Pfeh, a bump in the road. I don't care that I missed it by a whole year! ZOMG I'm running around screaming ZOMG It's a HUUUUUGE DEAL /sarcasm No. Not even close.

I liked a guy. So much I wanted to marry him. He had what I wanted in a man, plus some flaws I could deal with. I loved him so much I waited for 5 years for him. He was overseas, on a different continent. I passed up many men locally because I wanted that guy. I said I'd wait.

Finally, straw came and broke camel's back.

I had a few good cries, a lot of god damn you sob's and what the fuck was I doing sessions. (NOTE TO YOU; THE DEAL IS ONE SELF KICK PER FUCKUP...FOR LIFE)
So I said, you know, it's been a LOOONG time since I've ....ahem..dated. Went to craigslist.

I'm now happy, with my honey, we met there. Been together for 6 mos now, and I can see that he LOVES me. For who/what I am, all my faults and shit.

But did this fall under my own "get married and have family by 35" goal? Nope.
I'm 34, but it won't happen by then.

Is that so bad? Nope.

Honey, go get some counseling. You're not crazy. You're just a bit messed up upstairs. Go find out if your chemicals in your brain are imbalanced. Work with the physical part, THYROID ALSO!! and then once those have been tuned up/tweaked, work on the mental you. It helps. A lot. A lot lot.

PM if you have questions.

Cutenoob

[JoitheArtist]

I haven't chimed in here yet, but I agree with what some of the others are saying.

1. Get checked for depression. I know that when I was looking into getting a diagnosis, I really really REALLY did not want to do it. Depression will do that to you; it's sneaky, it tries to hide, tries to say it's something else. But seriously, if a small pill will help you get a floor under your feet, so to speak, it's worth doing. It helped me enormously.

2. I completely agree with what CuteNoob said about goals. Not that there's anything wrong with having them; everyone does, or should. But know when the goals need to change. Check your bearings. Sometimes, it's enough just to have goals about the kind of person you want to be: not related to jobs, relationships, income, or anything else. I haven't met my original goals for this point of my life, either. I wanted, and wanted SO BADLY, to be married, and to be in a house of my own, with a family of my own. I had to give up that goal: it's never going to happen. And I've made my peace with that. But I *have* been able to move much forward in my goal of becoming a person who doesn't grumble. I saw my parents always grumbling, decided I didn't want to become like that, and try to watch myself. I'm moving towards that goal because it's the one completely under my control. Any goal that relies on something external carries the inherent risk of failure--again, not that that's a bad thing. Risky things are well worth doing. But failure is definitely a risk there. Maybe it's time to set some goals that are more about being than doing, if that makes any sense.

But the main thing I wanted to say is that I really truly hope things go better for you soon, and you'll be in my thoughts.

[sms001]

Life has once again sent me the message loud and clear, and it has finally sunk in. I don't get to be like other people, I don't get to be "normal". I don't get to start over, don't get to change my lot in life. :(

Seconds or thirds or whatever we're up to on seeking some pro advice.

But I like to chime in with two points. I started a new life about nine years ago at the age of thirty-nine. Completely unexpected, unplanned, and nearly a 180 from my previous life.

The second is to address the quote above. I know it seems that way (I've felt it myself) but you simply CAN NOT personify "Life." "It" is not out to get you. It may seem that way when you add up all the bad breaks, but even the most downtrodden, out on his luck, beaten back person in the world (which isn't you, btw.) has not had some mystical force bearing on them. Some of the factors that make it feel that way are our own faults. Some are the fault of the people we involve ourselves with. And some are just random/ bad luck/ coincidence.

Please don't give in or give up Jack. Heck, I just saw today that you are in Maryland, which is where I grew up. I was looking forward to finding out more about it through you over the years on this board.

[Jester]

A comment on "normal."

Normal is BORING. Do you really want to be average, normal, just like everyone else? I know I don't. People remember me, and I LIKE that. And not everyone remembers me in a positive way, either, but I'm okay with that, as I realized a long time ago that no matter what you do, not everyone is going to like you. And I am just fine with that.

I know what you're thinking. "But I want what everyone else has." There is nothing wrong with wanting that part of "normal." Nothing at all. But don't make these goals of yours the be all and end all of your existence.

I don't get to be like other people, I don't get to be "normal". I don't get to start over, don't get to change my lot in life. I don't get to have the things that other people have and take for granted. It's not allowed. I am cursed, and doomed to suffer my fate, whether I like it or not. So, there's no point in even trying anymore. There's no point in picking myself back up and putting myself back out there when all I ever get for my trouble is more pain.

Oh, please! Seriously? Really? You don't "get" to be like other people? You don't "get" to do this or that? You are "not allowed"?

My ass.

Dude, you "get" to do what you decide to do. There is no mystical force holding you back, deciding, "Hey, let's fuck with Jack T. Chance, let's keep him from achieving that which he wants, let's make his life miserable." There is no such force preventing you from achieving your goals or aspirations (unless, of course, you are the Buffalo Bills--but that's another story). The only entity preventing such a thing is....YOU.

I know, you didn't bankrupt your company, you didn't dump yourself, etc., etc. I get that. But this whole "I don't get to be normal" bitchfest is just utterly ridiculous. And don't get me wrong, we've all been there at some point...but we've all also realized after a bit of it that, okay, enough crying, time to get up off my ass and make things happen.

You cannot win a race if you are sitting in the bleachers crying about how you never win a race, so why bother running? The majority of great achievers in history went through a lot of great failure first.

Now I understand that in all likelihood you are suffering from clinical depression, and it is not simply a matter of "dude, snap out of it." I get that, and I get (and have said) that you need to get professional help. But that does not lessen or mitigate the ridiculousness of the above pity party you are throwing yourself.

I repeat: the only person you can allow or disallow you from achieving your goals is YOU.

And it'll be a cold day in Hell before I ever again trust a woman enough to open my heart to her. No good ever comes of that.

Bullshit. Bullshit, bullshit, bullshit. And furthermore, bullshit.

Look, I have had a few relationships in my time. And I have had some serious dry spells. Entire calendar years of dry spells, thank you very much! And I have been burnt by women. Not just burn in the sense of being dumped or cheated on, mind you, but burnt as in manipulated by a con artist user who was not only the worst girlfriend I ever had and one of the worst people I ever met, but who ended up as a convicted felon for some of her more under-handed manipulations. And I have often said that I am happy that I got involved with her in my 30s rather than earlier in life, because had she been one of my earlier experiences, I very well could have become horribly jaded towards women in general.

So, did I whine and cry and stamp my feet? You bet your ass I did. But after a bit of that and more than a few beers, I moved the fuck on. I had fun. I enjoyed life, even without a woman to share it with, although if you talk to anyone who knows me at all, they will tell you that I am a romantic and I definitely want a woman in my life, someone to share my life with, a companion, etc, etc.

And so now I have one. I have a girlfriend. Yes, she's a girlfriend that happens to live 2600 miles away, in my home town that I want to move to but, due to financial issues, can't yet, and probably can't for another year. And yes, she's a girlfriend that comes with baggage, not just children, but emotional issues. And yes, there are times when both of us question the wisdom of being involved with someone almost an entire continent away. But I still view it as a positive, a positive that I hope will continue once I finally do find my way home. A positive that never would have happened if I had just shut down and given up because I was sick of getting burnt.

So you made a play and got jacked. As Nazareth sang, "love hurts." But pick yourself up, dust yourself off, and move the fuck on.

Seriously.

[protege]

Normal is BORING. Do you really want to be average, normal, just like everyone else? I know I don't. People remember me, and I LIKE that. And not everyone remembers me in a positive way, either, but I'm okay with that, as I realized a long time ago that no matter what you do, not everyone is going to like you. And I am just fine with that.

I second that. Pardon my French, but "normal" fucking sucks. "Normal" people are the most boring on the planet. Screw that, I'd rather be "naturally goofy." I'm not afraid to be who I am. Can't handle it, or don't like it? Tough shit, and fuck you. I'm not changing who/what I am for anyone. Deal with it, or go away.

Sorry if I'm a bit blunt. But, I did take plenty of shit for it...and just wanted it to go away. Then I realized that attempting to be "normal" was even worse, and simply not worth it.

I also realized that most of the "normal" people...were actually similar to sheep. That is, they looked pretty much the same, wore the same styles of clothes, etc. I don't know about the rest of you, but I'm not a damn sheep. I have my own style and can think for myself ;)

As such, I tend to stand out a bit, and quite a few times, people seem to be drawn to me. Ironic, since when I attempted to be "normal," I got the opposite reaction...

[Geek King]

I'm with Jester on this one.

Jack, life ain't fair. You probably know this, but you don't understand it. Sure, you may have some clinical depression, but you let your mindset multiply it. Get off your dufus and go for a run--not a damn jog, RUN DAMMIT!! I'll wait til you get back.

...

If you actually did it, you should be feeling a bit better. All those lovely chemicals exercise produces help offset those nasty depression chemicals. Go running or find a punchingbag to to some heavy cardio exercise on. It will help raise your spirits. Many psychologists believe emotional depression is a reflection of anger. Work it out on something less destructive than yourself.

Next, you're going to stop dwelling on this "1-step-forward-2-steps-back" crap. You think you've got it tough? I went to school for computer programming. PASCAL and C were my tools. I worked my ass off to get through in four years, and all the loans were in my name. Six months before I graduated, the entire world of programming jumped on to Object-Oriented programming languages like Visual Basic and C++. Pop! I graduate with obsolete knowledge and big loan debt. I was right fucked.

So I go looking and get a job as a program tester. While doing that, I work my ass off nights earning a real MCSE certification and finally transfer to the server support group. I was making 35k/yr, and happy with my work. Then some ass up the corperate ladder fucks up his half of the company, and I'm laid off by virtue of being the newest guy in the department. Right in the middle of the dot-bomb era. Well fuck.

Two months later, 9/11 happens. Job fairs now start to state specifically that no computer-related jobs will be offered, don't bother coming. Double Fuck.

I get tired staring at the apartment walls not even getting hits on my resume, so I get a job at Odd Lots. Minimum wage and really hard work. Then I move on to an eyeglass factory for a buck more an hour. Then back to the amusement park I worked as a kid. Then to the print factory where I worked for three gruelling years loading paper and cleaning presses on 12-hour shifts. Each step I made a little more money, got some more good references, and beat the hell out of a gym punching bag.

Finally, after five years out of my chosen profession, a fellow named Mark took a chance and hired me into an IT position. I was rusty, but worked hard to impress the hell out of him (He still e-mails me now and then to see how things are going). It was rotten pay for the work (about 18k/year. A pitance for what I was doing compared to the going rate), but I needed that experience. Then the company got bought out and they turfed all the IT staff. I say thee fuck, and fuck again!

I put out all kinds of resumes this time. Interviews came and went, and I finally landed the job I have now. I will just say it is a good job, for good pay, and unlikely to go away anytime soon.

Relationship-wise, I've not had anything serious, and that kind of sucks sometimes, but I keep looking. I have built up a cadre of good friends and, while we don't always agree on things, we can argue and walk away friends. You've got to decide if you're the loner because you're afraid of losing your friends, or because your friends suck. Invite some over for to watch movies and MSTK3000 that parts that deserve it. Laugh. Sure you're still laid off tomarrow. But you're still alive, and can try again. Part of the onus of friendship is on you too. Reach out and join the group. You might find out they're fun to be around.


Now you kids get off my lawn!! Uphill! Both ways!

<\aging crank off>

Seriously Jack, you are so certain of failure that you give up without trying. Get out there and do something. You may have to move to someplace where the market is better. DO it. Start working your ass off without sabotaging yourself. Yeah, it isn't always appreciated, but you can always look for something better while you put up with a lousy job. Nobody owes you anything. Not your bosses, not the government, and not some higher force. You have to prove yourself. Sometimes Everyday.

You get knocked down. That's life, no biggie. Get up, dust yourself off, and laugh like a madman while daring someone to knock you down again. You may not always win, but you make damn sure everyone knows you won't be beaten.

[seigus]

Jack, I have a friend who could have written your post about ten years ago; it sounded like I was listening to him all over again. Same concerns, same problems, same feelings about it all. EXACTLY. Why am I telling you this? To show you that you are not the unique being you think you are, crushed by an unfeeling universe. My friend is now doing a job he loves and is very successful at it. He was in the SAME BOAT. I'm not trying to discount what you're going through, just trying to point out that it's not unique. It happens to people all the time. But let's look at a couple of things.
You use the example of the companies you've worked for going bankrupt as proof the universe has it out for you - what about the people working for and owning those companies? Do you not see they were affected just as much as you were? The fact that you only see it in terms of how it affected YOU demonstrates to me part of your problem. You see the world in terms of yourself, and nothing more. No wonder you're depressed. The fact is, we're all on this ship, my friend. We're all caught in the web of trouble.
Have you asked your friends for advice on what social niceities you lack or need work on? Have you sought frank information on where you might be going wrong from people who know you? You need to work on self improvement - the world will not change for you. The change has to come from inside, and that's all there is to it. What to feel better? Want to feel like you matter? Go work in a soup kitchen. Go work with disadvantaged kids. Visit the elderly. Stop focusing on yourself and give the world some good, no matter what you think it's done to you. Take the reins, Jack. Help others, and watch yourself transform.

[sms001]

Good evening Jack!
What's up?

[Jack T. Chance]

Good evening Jack!
What's up?Well, since you asked...

Last night, I went to Arundel Mills Mall, where I used to work a few years back, to hit-up the FYE for a CD I was looking for. Found the CD, and more importantly, I ran into someone I never expected to see again. While walking by the shoe store I used to work in up until about 3 years ago, I did a double-take, because one of my former co-workers was back at the store. Hadn't seen her in over 3 years, because she and her boyfriend at the time had moved to North Carolina. She's just recently moved back to Maryland, so I caught up with her a little bit, then went on my way.

Then, I went back up there today to look for a couple things, and as I was walking by the new T-Mobile corporate-owned kiosk that just opened in the mall, I spotted a former co-worker from when I worked for Rockaway Bedding (the job I had right after I left the shoe store) working at the kiosk. Spent quite awhile talking to him, getting caught up. So, apparently this is my week to run into former co-workers from my past jobs! Wonder who I'll run into over the weekend? :confused:

Other than that, I hung out with my best friend today, shot some pool, played some Rock Band, that's about it. I was going to reply to a post that I thought someone had made to this thread, but now I don't see the post that my brain thought it saw, so maybe I imagined it, or dreamt it? Maybe it was something someone said in a Private Message instead? I have no frakkin' idea, all I know for sure is I wanted to reply to a particular comment, and now I can't find that comment. :headscratch:

[RootedPhoenix]

*hugs*

Depression has a terrible way of making everything look awful.

I've had to deal with depression most of my life. I know *exactly* what it's like. Contrary to what others (and those damn commercials) claim, it's not something you can "snap out of."

As do I. I'm 29 now and have been wrestling with this since I was 11, possibly younger. I've gotten real close to suicide several times. My comments were meant as an insight to what depression does to my mind, and not as a statement of "Hey you can just snap out of this". That's not how depression works. No matter how it got there, it isn't just some "blue mood". Telling another to "snap out of it" when they can't adds guilt to an already crushing burden.

Jack, shoulds are lethal things. Don't let people should on you. Fantastic advice, but nearly impossible to take.

People will offer any number of things that they think will work. Choose what works best for you. Sometimes what didn't work last week will work again this week.

Hope is a hard thing to keep a hold of, so hold tight to the things that give you hope. It's the only thing that's ever gotten me through.

*offers hugs*

[seigus]

Hey, Jack, looks like you may be feeling better. Run with it.

[sms001]

Well, since you asked...
Last night, I went to Arundel Mills Mall, where I used to work a few years back,



Know exactly where it is - used to live down Rt. 1 in Beltsville. (Although I guess you'd say down 95 these days....)


was back at the store. Hadn't seen her in over 3 years, because she ....I spotted a former co-worker from when I worked for Rockaway Bedding Wonder who I'll run into over the weekend?


Yeah, those seem to come in three just like celebrity deaths. Hasn't happened to me in a while, 'cause I live somewhere in between Civilization and Nunavut, but it has happened quite a few times over the years. So who was the third?




Other than that, I hung out with my best friend today, shot some pool, played some Rock Band, that's about it.


Decent day. Things seem a little easier on you from the writing tone, but I hope you'll follow up on a couple of the approaches to combating this melancholy mentioned in this thread. I would imagine that being proactive about the next onset is a LOT easier to do with a clear head than it is in the middle of a bout.

[BusBus]

Okay, I hope that I can contribute something of use for you JTC...


~I have depression, so I know where you are coming from. My advice? Seek a counselor for guidance and find a doctor to discuss medication. One is not as effective without the other! Together, they can help you get back on your feet and take whatever life throws at you! I waited until I had a breakdown at work before I sought treatment, even know I damn well knew that I had this problem.

~You have it worse than a lot of people. You also have it better than a lot of people.


~Relationships/friendships can suck ass. Been there, done that...not going to take up space writing about the woes of failed relationships pass. Don't let stupid people from the past ruin your future! Don't let that "one girl" ruin potential relationships for you. Try and go out. I know that it is *realllllly* hard when you are in the depths of depression, but the effort may pay off! Check out local newspapers or Craigslist for events (especially in the summertime!). Check out dating sites (Match, Lavalife, eHarmony) if you are ready to look for someone again (even just to go out on a date....and try to go for the real dating sites, where you know that the girls on there are looking for something similar).

~As for work, I cannot give too much advice there as I don't know what field you work in, what kind of credentials you have etc etc..... But when you are ready, you may want to re-evaluate what you are doing. Maybe try a new job? Get some extra credentials from a local college?

~I don't know if your landlord would permit it, but have you considered getting a pet? I have cats that provided me with companionship and love during my darkest times.


I hope that you will take the advice of some of the ppl here. Pls give us an update!!

[Jack T. Chance]

Hey, Jack, looks like you may be feeling better. Run with it.If by "feeling better" you mean that I can actually manage to get out of bed, get dressed, and go out of the house for awhile and tolerate being around other people, then yes, I suppose I'm "feeling better". If by "feeling better" you mean that I'm able to post in topics other than this one again, then yes, I guess I'm "feeling better".

But if by "feeling better" you mean "content with my life and full of renewed hope" then NO, I'm not. Frankly, I've lost what little faith I had left (and I'm a devout Agnostic, so I didn't have much faith to begin with.) That's not liable to change anytime soon. :no:Know exactly where it is - used to live down Rt. 1 in Beltsville. (Although I guess you'd say down 95 these days....)Either one works... when I go to Beltsville for anything (for instance, visiting the MVA branch there) I always take Route 1... from where I live, that's just the fastest way to get there. :yes:Yeah, those seem to come in three just like celebrity deaths... So who was the third?No one yet. We'll see what happens. :shrug:Decent day. Things seem a little easier on you from the writing toneAgain, see my reply to seigus. http://i42.tinypic.com/jfydfs.jpg

Current mood is still http://i39.tinypic.com/2zhqud1.jpg*




*The Green Lantern fans will get it, especially the ones reading "Blackest Night". ;)

[Geek King]

Other than that, I hung out with my best friend today, shot some pool, played some Rock Band, that's about it.

This is good. I know you don't think its much, but your writing style over the last couple of posts has changed. You got out and did things with friends, or at least people you're friendly with, even is some of those were accidental meeting. It gives me some hope that you will get past this.

Keep getting out of the house. I noticed when I was unemployed that I had a tendency to sit and brood at home. Sometimes I wouldn't leave the house for days at a time. When I got out of the house, even if it was just to walk to the store for groceries, I felt better, and could stomach another round of sending off resumes.

Also, a couple of places to look that you might not have thought about:

usajobs.com --government jobs you can search by zip code.

local government websites -- many times, local government will post jobs on their websites that never get printed anywhere else.

[sms001]

Again, see my reply to seigus. http://i42.tinypic.com/jfydfs.jpg

Yeah, that's why I said a "little easier..." I'm sure it's not try out for the pep squad time so quickly.


Current mood is still http://i39.tinypic.com/2zhqud1.jpg*


I'm glad you threw the two Lantern references into this post - it reminded me of something you said in a book thread a while back:


It takes place in world where heroes glide through the sky on lightning bolts and fire. Flamboyant villains attempt daring daylight robberies. God-like alien creatures clash in epic battles over the nighttime sky.


And I've been meaning to ask if you ever read any of the Wild Cards (http://www.wildcardsbooks.com/) series edited by George R.R. Martin? Interesting shared universe premise. I've only read the first ten or so, but they are generally short stories and move quickly.

Edit: iGoogle has a Blackest Night theme now.

[Jester]

I was going to reply to a post that I thought someone had made to this thread, but now I don't see the post that my brain thought it saw, so maybe I imagined it, or dreamt it? Maybe it was something someone said in a Private Message instead? I have no frakkin' idea, all I know for sure is I wanted to reply to a particular comment, and now I can't find that comment.

So? So you can't find the comment. If you know what it was about, you can still respond to it, simply by stating what the comment was ("Someone said something about X, and I just wanted to say this about that...."). Seems simple enough to me.

If by "feeling better" you mean that I can actually manage to get out of bed, get dressed, and go out of the house for awhile and tolerate being around other people, then yes, I suppose I'm "feeling better". If by "feeling better" you mean that I'm able to post in topics other than this one again, then yes, I guess I'm "feeling better".

But if by "feeling better" you mean "content with my life and full of renewed hope" then NO, I'm not.

What you may not realize is that this is a start. It's a small step, but it is the first step of many. And every journey has to start with the first step.

[Der Cute]

Jack, this lightening of your perception, is why I call depression episodes a Ditch...

Something happens. Your brain chems are wonky. You are feeling dark. You are sending off dark signals to humans (imagine a little skull & crossbones aura for everyone to see). You see no hope. You see no desire.....you're fully in the ditch.

Something else small happens which helps you see the light. You feel a hair bit better, but the skull and crossbones are there (just less frequently). You get out to General Public. You feel a hair bit better....

You're not so stuck in the ditch ,but you could fall back in easily.

Keep at it, please, and get that doctor's long term care. It's needed.

Cutenoob

[Jack T. Chance]

Hey everyone, I know it's been several days since I posted in here... had other things on my mind the last few days. First off, I'll just apologize because there's most likely still a couple PMs I haven't returned... keep forgetting to do it, but I'll try to get back to everyone this week. :o

Anyway, my mood has been slowly improving day-by-day, with a lot of help from my friends, both online and in real life. Ironically, this week, one of my friends has been dealing with a serious depression, and in giving them a hand back up out of the darkness, I've found my own mood improving, as well.

Something I'm going to say, just in case I haven't yet (and if I did, I'm saying it again! :p) is that my depression has ALWAYS felt situational to me. It has ALWAYS been triggered by events in my life, events where it's normal to feel depressed.

Something else I can't remember if I said is that I have Attention Deficit Hyperactivity Disorder. I've known ever since I was a child that I've had it, I was diagnosed probably in first or second grade (back when it was simply called "hyperactivity".) I went through many years of treatment for it as a child, learning how to cope with it, how to control it on my own, without drugs (the drugs that were available at the time were too unpredictable when I took them, too unreliable in controlling my ADHD.) It took a long time, and I ended up feeling like I had to go through Hell and back to get to where I eventually ended up, which is as someone that controls my ADHD, more than I let it control me. In the process, I believe I became a much stronger person, emotionally and mentally, and over the last several years, at times, I've genuinely surprised myself with just how strong I've become, how strong I can be when it really matters.

In reading about ADHD over the years, I stumbled upon a discussion of it on another messageboard I go to. Someone in that topic (a topic that's long-gone now, unfortunately) had said that they read or heard somewhere that people with ADHD experience emotions MUCH more deeply and intensely than individuals that don't have our condition. It's apparently part & parcel of ADHD.

This may have a LOT to do with how severe my depression gets at times. I've always had a big heart, and always felt like I was the odd man out, because I could never understand how other people could seemingly turn their emotions on and off like a switch, while I could not. I used to wonder why people seemed less affected by life's major events, both good and bad, than I was. I always wondered how people could be so cold compared to me. But I don't wonder about that anymore. Now I know why I am the way I am. It's because of my ADHD, apparently.

It's as much a blessing, as it is a curse. Those of us with ADHD will, apparently, experience depths of emotion that others can never experience, and therefore, can never truly understand. If a "normal" person's emotional experience is like a black & white film with a mono soundtrack, we get the full TECHNICOLOR, THX SURROUND SOUND experience! We are able to experience love, and joy, and happiness, and all of the other "good" emotions in life, much more deeply and richly than "normal" people. The downside is that the same holds true for the darker emotions... anger, envy, feelings of inadequacy, depression... those are all deepened, as well. But I suppose you have to take the bad with the good in this case, just like everything else in this life.

Yes, I have my bad days, my days when the darker emotions become so strong that it's really hard to push them away. This time was the worst bout of depression in years, there's no doubt about that. But I also have my good days, and for the most part in my life, the good greatly outweigh the bad. As a general rule, when I'm the usual Jack that you've all come to know, the logical, rational part of my brain holds sway, and I'm able to control my darker emotions, keep them in check. It's only once in a great while that I lose control as badly as I did this time, and I'm sorry you all had to see it. I had hoped things would never get that bad again.

Thank you for being here for me everyone. I appreciate all the helping hands that have been extended to me over the last couple weeks. I will still give serious consideration to everything you've advised. Just today, I was pointed in the right direction to see about getting mental health care for low cost while I'm unemployed. I may go ahead and take advantage of that, if it looks like I qualify.

It's looking like I'll be fully back to my "normal" self soon. Current mood = http://i39.tinypic.com/ay6j4w.jpg (Hopeful)

[Lvl_9_Gazebo]

Depression is an up and down sort of thing. We're all happy that you're going up, but please remember that should you come down again, we're all still here for you.

[Jack T. Chance]

A final coda to this thread...

over the last few weeks, I've been doing my best to try and help a friend through their own bouts of suicidal depression. These bouts are apparently brought on by my friend's Bipolar Disorder, which appears to be of the Rapid Cycling variety, which is very probably the worst kind of Bipolar to have.

So, I'm still thinking a lot about depression and thoughts of suicide and the way they affect our lives. And it's made me remember a song that helped me in the past, several years ago... but it took some time to do so. The first time I heard it, I was in the midst of a bout of depression, and I actually took offense at the song. I thought it was overly preachy and got very annoyed by it and thus refused to listen to it for awhile. Then, one day, once my mood had stabilized, I took a listen to it with fresh ears and an open mind... and ever since, I've understood the wisdom it presents, and it has since helped me get through some dark days in my life.

The song was written as a response to a real incident. A teenager, a fan of the metal band Staind, committed suicide while listening to a song by Staind. The teen's mother actually approached the band's members after a show, desperately seeking answers that they didn't have any more than she did. This song was the result:"Waste" by Staind (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KT33KXLQgZE)

Your mother came up to me
She wanted answers only she should know,
only she should know
It wasn't easy to deal
with the tears that rolled down her face
I had no answers, 'cause
I didn't even know you

But these words,
they can't replace
the life you,
the life you waste

How could you paint this picture?
Was life as bad as it should seem
that there were no more options for you?
I can't explain how I feel
I've been there many times before
I've tasted the cold steel of
my life crashing down before me

But these words,
they can't replace
the life you,
the life you waste

Did Daddy not love you?
Or did he love you just too much?
Did he control you?
Did he live through you at your cost?
Did he leave no questions
for you to answer on your own?

Well fuck them!
And fuck her!
And fuck him!
And fuck you
for not having the strength in your heart to pull through!
I've had doubts, I've had fears
I've fucked up, I've had plans
Doesn't mean I should take my life with my own hands!

But these words,
they can't replace
the life you,
the life you waste

But these words,
they don't replace
the life you,
the life you wasteThere can be no doubt that this song's message is one of tough love. I'm sure Jester would approve. ;)

And that's probably why I didn't like it the first time I heard it. Sometimes, the truth can be VERY hard to hear, especially when you're in the midst of a severe depression. But the truth can save your life, and sometimes that's the most important thing.

It is my hope that someday, someone will stumble upon this thread in a time of need and it will help them turn their life around for the better. If my experiences in this life, the darkness I have had to fight my way through, can help even 1 person, then it will all have been worth it.

[Jester]

I've been doing my best to try and help a friend through their own bouts of suicidal depression. These bouts are apparently brought on by my friend's Bipolar Disorder...

There can be no doubt that this song's message is one of tough love. I'm sure Jester would approve.

This is funny for so many reasons. For example, Nurse Betty, my girlfriend that I have written much about in here, is herself bipolar, and has been struggling with that of late. Also, she is a huge Staind fan, having sent me a couple songs to listen to that have defined her feelings at the time, usually about us.

As for me approving of tough love? Yeah....you got me on that one. It's not always the way to go, but so often, it really is.

[Pimento]

HEy man i dont know if anyone went and told you (too lazy to read every post) but i am where you are now.

Due to several ex gf stealing over 20gs worth of money i had saved up, my lawyer bills for my ex and everything im on the verge of bankruptcy.

Read a little book called The Secret, its saved me from being depressed about everything and should help you to start turning your life around, alot of people think its a bunch of cult BS. But my sales manager believews fully in the power of positive thinking and its totally proven to work, in my life and the lives of others.

[ditchdj]

You know Jack,
There are quite a few things in life that I want to be happy that have eluded me too. My main things are not having enough money to travel before I get too old, and finding a good-paying job.

However, I was pretty much in the same boat as you about ten years ago when I was in my mid-20's. New Years of Y2K I got good and drunk in a nightclub by my lonely old self.

But I decided to finally just take control of my life and destiny and go out there and work toward what I wanted. Sometimes things you work for won't go through. But sometimes they will. If I was you first thing I'd do is think about leaving town and going out in this huge world that will be a good fit for you. Do this before you get old when it'll really be time to throw in the towel.

[Keiara]

I'm glad your feeling better. I've dealt with bouts of depression ever since I was around 12.


Things to keep in mind :)

1) Trying to be normal is stupid. No one is normal. We are unique and special in our own ways. Embrace it.

2) A lot of people just suck. They're judgemental, stupid, demanding,etc... They don't like you for who you are? Fuck them. Life is to short to be worried about such things. Surround yourself with family and friends. They care and love you.

3) Women. If you close yourself off you will never meet the one for you. It look me a long time embrace the idea that there is someone out there for everyone. She'll come. Just be patient.

4) We're here for you. Some of us have a different approach. Many of us have been in your situation and we understand

I leave you with this quote. "When you can't run, you crawl. And when you can't crawl, when you can't do that...you find someone to carry you." :)

[Jack T. Chance]

Latest update: I started a new job last month. Things are going okay there, but it's going to be another couple months before I qualify for health care benefits. So, another couple months before I can get treatment for my ADHD and my depression. And that's a real problem right now. I keep screwing up all the other areas of my life. Tonight I seem to have permanently lost the most important friend I've had in recent years, someone that has accepted me when no one else would, someone that was giving me the guidance I need to straighten myself out and become the man I need to be. I fucked up and said all the wrong things tonight. I said mean and hurtful things I shouldn't have said and it's cost me dearly. I don't know what I'm going to do without her. :(

I'm most likely going to just be lurking for awhile. I don't really feel like talking about my problems here anymore. No one here can actually give me the help I need. I'm just going to have to try my best to muddle through until I can get professional help in a few months. And on that note, I'm gonna go be depressed elsewhere. :blink:

[Der Cute]

Latest update:
I'm most likely going to just be lurking for awhile. I don't really feel like talking about my problems here anymore. No one here can actually give me the help I need. I'm just going to have to try my best to muddle through until I can get professional help in a few months. And on that note, I'm gonna go be depressed elsewhere. :blink:

That's because we aren't trained professionals. We can/do hand out advice to people who are showing CLASSIC signs - because many of us here recognize it, have lived it or know people with it. But we can't FIX you, because that work is something YOU have to DO YOURSELF.

Really. We can tell you You Show Signs of Sillyness, but we can't make you go to a doctor who treats Sillyness. And we can't advocate for you with doctors who do treat Sillyness. Because we're not there.

It's not easy being depressed, because well, the glue holds your ass to the chair and you don't feel like doing anything about it because you just don't. It takes effort, desire and discipline to seek out assistance for the issues. And bulldogged style relentlessness.

In my county, there are a HUGE number of homeless people. Most homeless people = mental illness or drug addict (the oldschool ones, not the people who lost their house last week). So there are lots of non profits around here who work on sliding scales and/or freebies to help those people. But I wouldn't have known WHERE to ask unless I STARTED asking for help. And KEPT asking. I don't back down easily - I ask, they say No We Don't, I ask So Who Does?

That's the kind of stuff to do. Having a job is great. Having a job with a mental illness is OK. Having a job with an untreated mental illness = TROUBLE. BTDT. Be careful, and I'll be thinking about you.

Cutenoob

[Jester]

Tonight I seem to have permanently lost the most important friend I've had in recent years...

I don't know what I'm going to do...

What you should do, and what you're going to do if you value this person as highly as you claim, is apologize. In person if possible. No drawn out stories, no excuses, no drama. Just a simple, straightforward, heartfelt, sincere apology for whatever it is you said or did that has put you in her bad graces. And then you should tell her that while you understand she may be mad at you, you hope she can forgive you and that you two can move on in life, due to how much you value her friendship.

If she is as amazing as you imply, that might be enough, though she may be mad at you for a while longer.

If she is as important to you as you say, to do anything less would be disingenuous on your part.

Remember, friends will help you move, great friends will help you move bodies, and the best of friends will help you move Heaven, Hell, and Earth.

Really. We can tell you You Show Signs of Sillyness, but we can't make you go to a doctor who treats Sillyness. And we can't advocate for you with doctors who do treat Sillyness.

I have had Sillyness for my entire life. While many have tried to cure me of it, I stubbornly refuse to get the treatment that is deemed necessary to cure it. Yes, Sillyness has caused issues in my life and has caused people to Look at Me Funny, and has even created some painfully awkward moments for me, both personally and professionally. But to me, the cure is far scarier than the disease. Sillyness is a part of me, for better or worse. And it seems that I am a bit contagious. Don't say you haven't been warned.



(Sorry, had to inject some levity in here.)

[SorryIsGoodEnough]

If she is as amazing as you imply, that might be enough, though she may be mad at you for a while longer.


Jester, I'm curious if you have any advice for Jack for how he could get over it in case she doesn't want to accept an apology, and if they cannot reconcile.

That might be more helpful.

[Jack T. Chance]

What you should do, and what you're going to do if you value this person as highly as you claim, is apologize. In person if possible. No drawn out stories, no excuses, no drama. Just a simple, straightforward, heartfelt, sincere apology for whatever it is you said or did that has put you in her bad graces. And then you should tell her that while you understand she may be mad at you, you hope she can forgive you and that you two can move on in life, due to how much you value her friendship.

If she is as amazing as you imply, that might be enough, though she may be mad at you for a while longer.

If she is as important to you as you say, to do anything less would be disingenuous on your part.

Remember, friends will help you move, great friends will help you move bodies, and the best of friends will help you move Heaven, Hell, and Earth.
I apologized but she wouldn't accept it. She's too far away, geographically, for me to go see her in person right now. And if I did, she'd probably call the cops on me, anyway. Our last conversation was not good at all. I think I really have lost her forever. :(

I am my own worst enemy. My behavior is self-destructive, and I've tried my hardest to change, but I haven't changed enough and I don't know if I'll ever be able to, even with professional help. I hate myself so much. Right now, there's a very loud voice in my head telling me that I should just kill myself and get it over with. But there's an equally loud, very stubborn voice that won't let me give up like that, that keeps telling me I need to think of my friends and family and how much they need me. I think I'm only still here because of my friends as it is. I wanted to kill myself years ago, and didn't because of them. Sadly, even with good friends, I haven't been able to become the man I need to be. I'm pathetic. :blink:

It's a good thing I don't drink, 'cuz if I did, I'd probably be drunk right now and I'd probably get fired for showing up to work drunk or something. :blink:

[RootedPhoenix]

I know I'm not there, but, *offers hugs and chocolate anyway*.
I wish things were going better for you. :(

[Jester]

Jester, I'm curious if you have any advice for Jack for how he could get over it in case she doesn't want to accept an apology, and if they cannot reconcile.

That might be more helpful.

I was going for the more positive approach, as I feel it's better to try for the apology first, and then deal with the situation if she refuses to accept it.

Which, according to Jack, is what happened.

For that, my advice to Jack would be to cry/vent/grieve the loss, get it out of his system, and learn from whatever mistake he made that caused this, and move on.

But Jack's other comments strongly reinforce my belief that Jack absolutely needs professional help. I am a decent counselor, but I am just a dude without training, and it is painfully obvious that Jack needs the help of someone who is trained for this. Despite his belief that he is "beyond help," he desperately needs professional help. The sooner the better.

Jack, you say you are just too far gone for even a pro to help you, but that is the insidious side of clinical depression, which you may well have (I am not qualified to make an actual diagnosis, of course).

Jack, get help. Get help as soon as you can. Nothing that we say here can help you nearly as much as professional counseling and therapy. I cannot stress this enough. Your self-described suicidal feelings and self-destructive behavior cry out for help, and should be addressed as soon as possible. Tomorrow if it's realistic. Hell, today if it's possible.

Please, Jack. Get professional help. Now, if not sooner.

[Jack T. Chance]

I was going for the more positive approach, as I feel it's better to try for the apology first, and then deal with the situation if she refuses to accept it.

Which, according to Jack, is what happened.

For that, my advice to Jack would be to cry/vent/grieve the loss, get it out of his system, and learn from whatever mistake he made that caused this, and move on.
I have some very good reasons as to why it would be very hard for me to move on, but I won't go into all of that here. If you want to know more, I can PM you later, after I get home from work.But Jack's other comments strongly reinforce my belief that Jack absolutely needs professional help. I am a decent counselor, but I am just a dude without training, and it is painfully obvious that Jack needs the help of someone who is trained for this. Despite his belief that he is "beyond help," he desperately needs professional help. The sooner the better.

Jack, you say you are just too far gone for even a pro to help you, but that is the insidious side of clinical depression, which you may well have (I am not qualified to make an actual diagnosis, of course).

Jack, get help. Get help as soon as you can. Nothing that we say here can help you nearly as much as professional counseling and therapy. I cannot stress this enough. Your self-described suicidal feelings and self-destructive behavior cry out for help, and should be addressed as soon as possible. Tomorrow if it's realistic. Hell, today if it's possible.

Please, Jack. Get professional help. Now, if not sooner.
The problem right now is that I'm still in my first 90 days of my new job, so I don't have my health care benefits yet. Back in the fall, I looked into Maryland's PAC program, which provides free or low-cost health care (including mental health care) to MD residents with a sufficiently low income. I didn't qualify, even though I was collecting Unemployment at the time, because even on Unemployment, I made too much money. PAC will only be provided to you if you make LESS THAN $1,000 a month, and I was getting $405 a week on Unemployment, which is about $1,620 a month. So even though I was unemployed and getting my only income from Unemployment, I wasn't poor enough to qualify. :blink:

I have to work today, but I'm off the next 3 days. I had taken off to go to a wedding that I no longer feel like attending, so tomorrow, I'll start trying to find other options for free or really low-cost mental health care. I know I need help, it's the only hope I have left for turning my life around and breaking the cycle of self-destructive behavior I've become stuck in. :blink:

[SorryIsGoodEnough]

You need to go to that wedding, Jack. It would be good for you to be around your family and celebrate the happiness of someone else instead of wallowing in your own misery.

Seriously. Go to the damn wedding.

[Rapscallion]

Jester, I'm curious if you have any advice for Jack for how he could get over it in case she doesn't want to accept an apology, and if they cannot reconcile.

That might be more helpful.

Being somewhat of an observer, I'd say that both people involved need to get a room and lots of booze.

It's worked for others.

Rapscallion

[ditchdj]

You know,
Over the past few months I've noticed several people on here that pretty much have the same theme where they're just fed up with life and ready to just throw in the towel. But look at how young you all are. I admit at that age I've kinda felt like that many times, but I took a serious inventory in myself. I took a serious look at what I want out of life and decided to make good on those thing the best I could. The number one thing to do is think outside your town. Look at how huge this planet, this world is. The world's a much bigger place than you think. It's like the best tool in your box to have. And it's FREE. It don't cost you a dime. Use it. That's what I'm doing. I started by leaving my hometown and simply following my goals in life and just letting it take me wherever I go. It's not perfect. Sometimes it's good. Sometime's it's bad. You just learn to take the good with the bad. To me it's even fun at times just letting fate and destiny take me to wherever I may go. ;)

Bottom line: Just get out there in that world and just work hard to get what you want out of life. And if there are people that are in your way then cut them loose and dont look back and move on.

[bookworm]

The problem right now is that I'm still in my first 90 days of my new job, so I don't have my health care benefits yet.

Jack, a very good friend of ours is self-employed and doesn't have insurance at all. He was having issues with depression and anger, so my husband paid for him to go to a clinic and see a doctor. It cost us about $70. and he found out that he has high blood pressure and got on medication for that but the doctor also told him about some mental health clinics/doctors that he could go to at a reduced rate. If you can at all afford to do the same thing, I really recommend it. Just because you don't qualify for PAC, which I assume is the same as our DHS here, doesn't mean that you don't qualify for some type of help through other programs.

I really hope that things get better for you.

[Jack T. Chance]

Being somewhat of an observer, I'd say that both people involved need to get a room and lots of booze.

It's worked for others.

RapscallionI'm not a drinker, but she is, and she'd probably like that idea. I have no idea if the option will ever be there, though. :shrug:

I'm still at work, so I'll reply to the other posts when I get home and have more time.

EDIT: Feeling tired, I'll reply to the other posts sometime tomorrow.

[Jester]

I have some very good reasons as to why it would be very hard for me to move on, but I won't go into all of that here. If you want to know more, I can PM you later, after I get home from work.

I never said it would be easy to move on. I simply said you needed to do whatever it is you need to do TO move on.

And if you want to PM me, feel free. I'll leave that up to you.

The problem right now is that I'm still in my first 90 days of my new job, so I don't have my health care benefits yet.

No situation is perfect. I would say either find some way to get help now or, at the worst, wait until your health benefits do kick in, and get health then.

I have to work today, but I'm off the next 3 days. I had taken off to go to a wedding that I no longer feel like attending, so tomorrow, I'll start trying to find other options for free or really low-cost mental health care.

I think it might be a good idea for you to attend that wedding, not only for your own sake, but because if these are good friends and they are expecting you, it might upset them if you pulled a no show. Do you really want to burn more social bridges?

Of course, only you can decide what is best for you, and I do like the fact that hyou plan on using some of your time off to find some help. Personally, I think you can do both: attend the wedding and find low cost mental health care.

The number one thing to do is think outside your town. Look at how huge this planet, this world is. The world's a much bigger place than you think.

This is an excellent point, and a great example of this is Haiti. As you may be aware, they had a devastating earthquake there this week. While it may seem far away to you, it is not so far away to me. Not only because I am geographically closer, but because there are so many Haitians in Key West. Many kitchens are staffed with Haitians, including The Bar. Which means a lot of my coworkers are still waiting to hear from their loved ones, and as of yesterday, none of them had heard anything.

So while you may have it bad, Jack, and I'm not belittling your situation, you might want to step out of yourself for a moment and look around you, and realize that a lot of people in the world have it much, much, much worse.

[Jack T. Chance]

You need to go to that wedding, Jack. It would be good for you to be around your family and celebrate the happiness of someone else instead of wallowing in your own misery.

Seriously. Go to the damn wedding.I think it might be a good idea for you to attend that wedding, not only for your own sake, but because if these are good friends and they are expecting you, it might upset them if you pulled a no show. Do you really want to burn more social bridges?It's my niece that's getting married (my sister's a good bit older than I am, and I've been "Uncle Dan" since I was 12 years old) and my sister and her family will most likely ask me about how things are going. And I really don't feel like letting them know that I've let myself turn into someone I despise. :blink:I never said it would be easy to move on. I simply said you needed to do whatever it is you need to do TO move on.

And if you want to PM me, feel free. I'll leave that up to you.Yeah, I'll PM you later. Maybe you'll have some helpful advice for me once you know more of the story.No situation is perfect. I would say either find some way to get help now or, at the worst, wait until your health benefits do kick in, and get health then.

Of course, only you can decide what is best for you, and I do like the fact that you plan on using some of your time off to find some help. Personally, I think you can do both: attend the wedding and find low cost mental health care.I might go, I haven't entirely made up my mind. I just feel like all I do is ruin the lives of the people I care about, and I keep thinking that my niece's special day will be worse if I'm there. :blink:This is an excellent point, and a great example of this is Haiti. As you may be aware, they had a devastating earthquake there this week. While it may seem far away to you, it is not so far away to me. Not only because I am geographically closer, but because there are so many Haitians in Key West. Many kitchens are staffed with Haitians, including The Bar. Which means a lot of my coworkers are still waiting to hear from their loved ones, and as of yesterday, none of them had heard anything.

So while you may have it bad, Jack, and I'm not belittling your situation, you might want to step out of yourself for a moment and look around you, and realize that a lot of people in the world have it much, much, much worse.Yes, I know all this. It doesn't change the fact that I've made the wrong choices in my life, and have hurt someone I never wanted to hurt as a result. It doesn't change the fact that I've let myself become a horrible, thoroughly dysfunctional person. And all the mental health care in the world can't erase the past, it can't change what I've already done. And that's where it all falls apart. :blink:

[Der Cute]

That's because we aren't trained professionals. We can/do hand out advice to people who are showing CLASSIC signs - because many of us here recognize it, have lived it or know people with it. But we can't FIX you, because that work is something YOU have to DO YOURSELF.

It's not easy being depressed, because well, the glue holds your ass to the chair and you don't feel like doing anything about it because you just don't. It takes effort, desire and discipline to seek out assistance for the issues. And bulldogged style relentlessness.

So there are lots of non profits around here who work on sliding scales and/or freebies to help those people. But I wouldn't have known WHERE to ask unless I STARTED asking for help. And KEPT asking. I don't back down easily - I ask, they say No We Don't, I ask So Who Does?

That's the kind of stuff to do. Having a job is great. Having a job with a mental illness is OK. Having a job with an untreated mental illness = TROUBLE. BTDT. Be careful, and I'll be thinking about you.

Cutenoob

Jack, re read my post here.

Currently you're feeling like shit. OK.
But do you want to STAY feeling like shit? Yes or No.
Yes? Then don't do anything at all.

No? START WORKING ON GETTING YOURSELF BETTER. First step is always hard, yes. Usually it's a "We don't fix you". "We're booked til Doomsday." YOU HAVE TO ASK WHO ELSE TO ASK. You have to have the bulldogged relentless chutzpah to say I need teh help. I need it now. I feel like shit now. I need it now. And repeat until you GET THE HELP OR GET THE BALL ROLLING. You know you're on the right track when you've got Le Spark Of Hope starting to fire up. Are you there???

If you want to get better and not feel like shit, you have to do something about it. We cannot reach through the Internet Tubes and pull your ass off the chair! We can send hugs and care, but we cannot do the legwork needed to get you better.

You are at the first step of fixing yourself. I'm about 1/4 in, I have a plan, deadlines/timelines, pinpointed what I need to work on.....I'm further ahead. BUT IT'S NOT A RACE. IT'S A GET YOUR ASS BETTER.

Jack, I've been in your shoes. I've been dejected, dark, low level energy, evil depression, felt like the 10000 Ton thing was sitting on me......but I decided to do something. Because, well, I have a kid coming. I can't be like that ^ and have a munchkin depending on me. I have a life change event coming. I need, and CHOOSE to be better. I have the Spark Of Hope. Do you?

Cutenoob

[Jester]

I just feel like all I do is ruin the lives of the people I care about, and I keep thinking that my niece's special day will be worse if I'm there.

Objectively you know the first part is not true, even if emotionally you feel like it is. As for the second part, don't you think she might be just a tad bit UPSET if her Uncle Dan doesn't show up to her WEDDING? It's not even like your RSVPing that you can't be there....from what you said, the wedding is any day, and I assume they expect you there. Pulling a no show is going to be okay with her? Don't you think that's a bit, oh, I don't know, selfish on your part? Even if you don't feel like being there for whatever reasons, make yourself go, and if you can't enjoy yourself, fake it for the sake of your niece.

And I really don't feel like letting them know that I've let myself turn into someone I despise.

And you think they won't know something is wrong when you stand your niece and her groom up? Shit, if you have to, LIE to them when they ask you how things are. "Oh, things are fine." What, you've never told a white lie? You've never told someone you were fine when you weren't, just so you wouldn't have to deal with the situation or the person?

I and many others have been sitting here trying to help you and make you see that you are not the shitbag you seem to think you are. But ya know what? If you blow off your niece's wedding, that is a shitbag move. You might just prove yourself right.

So seriously, at least for that one day, pull your head out of your ass, fake a smile, be a fucking man, and go to the wedding. And have an open mind....you might just enjoy it.

Yeah, I'll PM you later. Maybe you'll have some helpful advice for me once you know more of the story.

It's possible. PM me. And keep in mind, if you don't hear right back from me, it's not because I have decided that you aren't worth my time since you are so worthless (as you seem to believe), but that I am a busy guy, I work a lot, I have a lot going on, and frankly, it might take me some thinking time to answer you. I don't always just spew this advice out my asshole unchecked.

Usually. But not always.

Yes, I know all this. It doesn't change the fact that I've made the wrong choices in my life, and have hurt someone I never wanted to hurt as a result. It doesn't change the fact that I've let myself become a horrible, thoroughly dysfunctional person. And all the mental health care in the world can't erase the past, it can't change what I've already done. And that's where it all falls apart. :blink:

Let's say for the sake of argument that you're right about not being able to rectify the past. I personally don't think you are, but just for now, let's say that is the case. So in that sense, you are correct that mental health care won't do a thing about that.

However, don't you think it just might help you to NOT make the same wrong choices in the future, so that you can stop doing such horrible things?

Look, I can't take back the relationship I had with The Worst Girlfriend Ever. What happened happened, and she totally conned me, used me, manipulated me, etc. You get the point. And nothing I ever do can change that. But ya know what? I learned from that vile woman, and it is going to be that much tougher for another manipulative hobag to pull anything similar with me again. I used the negative situation as a positive learning experience. Rather than worrying about fixing what happened, I focused on the future and how I could improve on things, including the choices I make in choosing women.

By the way, dropping the whole "sake of argument" thing, I would like to point out that, more often than you think, we really CAN rectify our past mistakes.

[Jack T. Chance]

Okay, okay, I give in... I'll go to the damn wedding.

As for my thoughts on the other comments... they'll have to keep 'til later. Gotta go to bed now so I can get up early enough in the morning to be able to go to the wedding.

[JuniorMintz]

Okay, okay, I give in... I'll go to the damn wedding.

As for my thoughts on the other comments... they'll have to keep 'til later. Gotta go to bed now so I can get up early enough in the morning to be able to go to the wedding.

When I got married, I was deeply hurt and frustrated when members of my extended family couldn't put their petty bullshit feuds aside for ONE day to come support my husband and I on the biggest day of our lives.

I'm glad you decided to go. Please try to be pleasant when you get there, even if you don't feel like it. You'll have plenty of time to take care of yourself afterwards.

[Jester]

I don't think anyone here was trying to pressure you into going to the wedding, only that we wanted you to understand that your niece would likely be very hurt if you didn't go.

Example from my own life: I have spoken many times on here about my older sister and what an unpleasant person she is. A perfect example of this is years ago, I got engaged. Now, my fiance and I had not even set a date for our wedding, other than thinking it would be about a year and a half from that time. My dear, darling, lovely older sister told me she didn't think that she and her then-husband would be able to attend, as they had travel plans. Not actual tickets or travel commitments or anything booked, mind you. Just that they vaguely planned to go to Ireland or some such in about the time period that I was thinking of getting married. "Let me see if I have this straight," I asked her. "You're not going to go to your only brother's wedding because it's inconvenient for you?" "Yes." "Fuck you." And I hung up on her, and didn't speak to her again for months. Pretty much the most any single person has ever offended me, and this was my sister. The same sister whose wedding I had made sure that, no matter what, I would be there for. The same sister for whose wedding I went into the store that they were registered, and rather buying a gift or two, wiped out an entire category. The same sister for whose wedding I wanted to give a toast, but was told I couldn't, since the best man was not giving one, and they didn't want him to feel bad. I not only went along with that, since it was her wedding, I also kept her mother-in-law occupied so she wouldn't bother anyone else, as she was somewhat nuts. This same sister had vague undefined travel plans for the time period I was thinking of getting married, but she had already decided that those plans were more important than making any effort to get to my wedding.

I am sure you can detect the anger and disdain and contempt in my words when it comes to this lovely woman that happens to share a few chromosomes with me. Think your niece might feel the same about you if you had decided to just blow off her wedding? I do.

[Eireann]

I have an idea that won't cost you anything but time.

There's a method called EFT, which consists of the person tapping on himself/herself at various points, while stating certain affirmation sentences. A guy named Brad Yates has several tapping videos on YouTube, and you can just tap along with him and repeat what he says. There are videos for various different life problems, and you can choose which ones you want to try.

[Jack T. Chance]

So, I had an okay time at the wedding. But over the last couple days, after reading & re-reading this thread, I've realized that I've already received enough advice from the posts so far, or at least enough that I feel like I know what I have to do. So Jester, thanks for the advice you've already given me in the thread, it's given me some good food for thought.

Eireann, I'll look at those Youtube videos when I get a chance, sounds like interesting stuff.

Question: Have any of you ever tried either yoga or meditation as a method for making positive changes in your life? I've always been interested in looking into those techniques, but I don't know anyone that's tried them.

[AnqeiicDemise]

So, I had an okay time at the wedding. But over the last couple days, after reading & re-reading this thread, I've realized that I've already received enough advice from the posts so far, or at least enough that I feel like I know what I have to do. So Jester, thanks for the advice you've already given me in the thread, it's given me some good food for thought.

Eireann, I'll look at those Youtube videos when I get a chance, sounds like interesting stuff.

Question: Have any of you ever tried either yoga or meditation as a method for making positive changes in your life? I've always been interested in looking into those techniques, but I don't know anyone that's tried them.

I am a mercurial beast. My emotions flare up and die down rather quickly and if I'm not careful, these emotions take complete and utter control of me.

I can't do yoga. I'm not fit enough and with my endowment, I'd choke myself in some positions (And yes, I do speak from experience. I got stuck once and..well.. I was smothering myself. XD).

Since I met hubby, he's gotten me into doing some meditating. It helps a lot, though I have a hard time doing his method. He likes to sit and clear his mind... mine just wonders endlessly.

So I paint. I paint nothing in particular and it isn't very pretty but it helps. I just pop in an instrumental cd on the compy or zune and paint away. I like to let my mind wonder with the swirls of the paint brush and that works wonders.

[Evil Queen]

Hi Jack. We don't talk very often but I just wanted to see how you were doing.

Personally, I never found Yoga to be helpful for me but it is for a lot of posters here. I've preferred going out and climbing one of the nearby mountains or going to the canyon and free-climbing there. It allows you to concentrate and once you get to the top, you tend to feel like you've accomplished something. Enjoy the view and take a sandwich because climbing is hard work.

Meditation worked for a little while but after that, I couldn't get the peace. So when I'm upset I just drive around town for a little bit, take roads I've never been down, basically go sight seeing in my own town.

I'm having a pretty rough go of things myself; I've neglected some friends and others are starting to ignore me, my dating life is in the toilet and I'm afraid I'll be looking for another roommate soon.
We won't get started on my parents.
Have a hug. We all could use one right about now. *hugs*

[Jester]

Jester, thanks for the advice you've already given me in the thread, it's given me some good food for thought.

Glad you went to the wedding. Even gladder you somewhat enjoyed yourself. And that much gladder that something this silly jester said may have helped.

Feel free to pester my PM box any time if you feel the need.

[Cat]

Personally, I never found Yoga to be helpful for me but it is for a lot of posters here. I've preferred going out and climbing one of the nearby mountains or going to the canyon and free-climbing there. It allows you to concentrate and once you get to the top, you tend to feel like you've accomplished something. Enjoy the view and take a sandwich because climbing is hard work.




Just logged on to second this statement. I've found nothing more healing than climbing/hiking. And def take the sandwich :)

[AnqeiicDemise]

Just logged on to second this statement. I've found nothing more healing than climbing/hiking. And def take the sandwich :)

And if you're not physically able to do either of these things 'cause you're out of shape like me... you can always drive to a secluded area. I used to go off to the Santa Anita mountains and pull off at random turn out and just relax and watch the city light up at night.

The local rangers didn't mind as long as I wasn't drinking, smoking or going over the railing.

[JoitheArtist]

Anything that can completely occupy your mind for a little while is good, really. I frequently do something artistic to that end: drawing, painting, spinning wool, etc. It's a good idea to pick something hard enough that you have to devote your attention to it, but simple enough that you don't really have to think about anything while you're doing it.