I'm Too Broken to Function

[Der Cute]

Heh. Usually I give out advice, but here I am asking for some.

Background: I have had over ..uhm..20? jobs since my start of work when I was 18. I'm now 35. 17 years, average work span is 6 months or so. The longest span has been 2 years, shortest has been 3 weeks.

What happens: I get a job by getting through the interview fine. I have skills/education in IT and computer work. As soon as I'm put into an office area, I fuck up. I am unable to detect body language/facial cues and put that together with the words people speak.
I'll go to a desk, and say, "Hey, if you've got time later around lunch, can you grab me? I need to do some more tweaking/changing on the machine here, and we can set up other things you need too." Person says "Oh sure no problem" I get there, start doing the work, and I think I'm doing great. I get reports later that I'm perceived as "rude" "abrupt" "pushy" and such.

I have not been able to identify yet exactly what 'm doing wrong. I have been banging a head aganst a wall for years, trying to see HOW my behavior is so bad.

Shit, I was hired about 3 weeks ago for a job. I started working. I liked it. I felt like it was a good place for me; they were doing both hands on and some reading training, shadowing and reading KB's. I started helping some people recently in that job, and I get fired yesterday. 3 weeks 2 days. I am told that "People percieve you as rude/impolite/unprofessional. You've offended a CEO." I'm thinking wtf, how the hell ...... I'm not getting any feed back from the boss, I was LOOKIGN for facial expressions of GRR and ARGH and YAAARGH . I didn't see that.


I am veryvery frustrated, tired of this, broken inside. I cannot hold a job for long, I cannot interact correctly with people in an office setting. I cannot function in society.

A counselor and I sat down w/ the DSM IV book on psych, and I do not fit the criteria for Aspergers or Autism. I'm just weird.

Someone has told me to go to etiquette class; I went to one when I was 13, and it entailed holding books on my head, drinking with my pinky sticking out and wearing heels on stairs. Are there classes on What This Face Means and What To Do Next?

I also get flustered when I'm working. If I am focused on project/subject and am really thinking in my head, and am disturbed by a person asking more questions, I snap/jump and am not smooth. I have not been able to find a way to put a 3 second pause in the transition from thinkthinkdoing...1.2.3...Hello, did You need something? it goes thinkthinkdoing..whaddayaneed?

Psych professionals are stumped with me, as I can articulate my issues, have done a lot of self help work and know a lot of the general issues, but as of yet we have to get anything really fixed.

It's worse, because I'll have a job, get insurance, start counseling, lose job, lose insurance, stop the counseling.....I'ts an endless loop.

Guys, gals.. what can I do? I'm really really hopeless right now. Post Partum Depression/Anxiety along with this blow of losing a job I liked makes me a very sad Cutenoob. Sad as in "I'm thinking of the ER" (those places dont' help me).

I need directions.

Cutenoob

[Aethian]

Become your own boss. Find something you like to do and find a niche in that market.

Other then that I really don't know, I wish I could help but...I don't see when you've been rude. *args and just snugs hard*

[Magpie]

Ok, I know that you say that you don't have Asperger's, but that's not reason not to proceed as if you did. They're behaviour based diagnoses, and the treatment is behavioural. If you're exhibiting one symptom, treat it!

I did social coaching for a while, and it really helped. We'd discuss things that I screwed up in interacting with people, and reasons why I might have been perceived negatively, and we'd do role play. We worked on me becoming more aware. I don't know what you have in the way of coverage, but there ARE actually classes like what you're looking for.

One other suggestion is to try to find jobs where you can get away with this sort of thing. I know, more Autistic spectrum advice, but it's all I can think of. You're in a field where, frankly, they really oughtn't be expecting a lot in the way of social skills, at least based on the people I know in that field. So a little bit of improvement should go a long way. See if you can find a friend who will be honest with you who's able to see what might be a problem. A lot of fixes are crude, but if you just appear odd you can probably get away with it.

Another suggestion that I'm scared to try myself, but depending on how good your skills are, you might try taking conflict resolution courses. They have a lot of information on what comes across as aggressive/pushy so that you can avoid it.

[Mishi]

I don't see where you've been rude either, but I've been referred to as an odd mixture of diplomacy and bluntness. :hug: Sorry, I have no suggestions other than listen to Magpie, Aethien and Seshat (if/when she comments) because they give really good advice. Also :hug: for dealing with PPD/PPA, you're a very brave mum.

[Solumina]

There are business etiquette classes which may benefit you more than a typical “southern” style etiquette class, which it sounds like you had. It is pretty darn hard to see what the problem is without direct observation so I’m not really sure what else to say.

[Seshat]

Sorry, I have no suggestions other than listen to Magpie, Aethien and Seshat (if/when she comments) because they give really good advice.

:o

Actually, I was going to say that I have the same problem. I've apparently partly overcome it, though I have no real idea how: the stuff I have in my sig is what I used consciously when I was working on changing it.

Other things I did:
Studied (and I mean STUDIED) Animal Planet and National Geographic specials on monkeys, and especially apes. Watched behaviour and interaction there, and listened to the narrator interpreting it. Hominid behaviour is human behaviour, just written more primitively and clearly.

Learned about microexpressions (http://www.ehow.com/how_5311172_detect-micro-expressions.html) and did some work on recognising them.

Learned about the facial action coding system (http://www.face-and-emotion.com/dataface/facs/description.jsp) and the related affect interpretation dictionary

Studied body language in general.


Once you have those basic tools, you can then spend time sitting in a public place with a cup of coffee, watching people and trying to interpret their body language and behaviour towards each other, trying to predict what each cluster of people will do next and how they like/dislike each other.

[Der Cute]

2. If you're consistently getting results you don't want, change what you do.

This is great - I am trying to change the stuff. Problem I can see is that this behavior is so entrenched in me, it's like trying to pull my stomach out through my nose.

I am afraid that I'll not be able to use my computer degree. The entry level work is desktop support/helpdesk, which is direct customer contact. I can't do this. Even if I changed my IT training to, lets say, DBA, I would still have to work with people, and that would still result in the same problem.
When corresponding or communicating via email or phone, I do pretty good. I have the time to think the speech through, to 'try to see consequences' of a sentence, and on the phone I know to keep mouth smiling and calm.
But when around humans....I fuck up.

I will try what Seshat suggested, and work with my therapist and see what we can do.

I just feel despondent and ubersad that my degree is shite.

Cutenoob

[Pony_Boy]

Question: Does this only happen in an office/professional setting?

How are you in other social situations, like meeting new people, making small talk etc? If it just happens at work, or more often then not at work, could it be the professional atmosphere that triggers something in you and not some all encompassing mental condition?

Just a thought i had...

[Seshat]

2. If you're consistently getting results you don't want, change what you do.

This is great - I am trying to change the stuff. Problem I can see is that this behavior is so entrenched in me, it's like trying to pull my stomach out through my nose.

I will try what Seshat suggested, and work with my therapist and see what we can do.

Cutenoob, two things:

1. I know. BELIEVE ME I KNOW. It took me twenty years to get from constantly stuffing up social interactions to now. The good side is that it takes much less than twenty years to show enough improvement to hold down a job. :)

2. Go to a Linux user group meeting or ten, and talk to the sysadmins. You may well find a senior sysadmin who needs a junior to train, and is happy to ignore ADHD/'classic geek' behaviours in his juniors so long as the junior is trying.

Ignore the showoffs and wannabes. You're looking for the geeks of quiet confidence, who are most likely off in one corner discussing something hopelessly esoteric; and who are studying from each other. As in, one of them studies network trafficking algorithms and passes that knowledge on this week. Another studies current best practice spam filtering and passes that on next week, the third studies...

These are the people who know that there's too much in their field for everyone to reinvent the wheel, and they want to give their employers good service and do their jobs right, so they cooperate with their so-called 'competition'.

They also pass on jobs to each other, and seek to train up the next generation of high quality sysadmins. And THESE are the geeks you want to know. When you find them - and they'll probably be at the linux users group meeting, but they might be somewhere else - talk with them, and tell them your problem and your goal, and ask their help.

Heck, show them a printout of this suggestion. :)

Note that they'll probably expect you to train up to being a senior sysadmin yourself. Since this is your goal, that's not a problem! However, part of being senior sysadmin is being the shield between management and your juniors. So expect to be taught office politics and human interaction.

But you'll be being taught either by a geek, or by someone accustomed to working with geeks. It'll be a HELL of a lot easier than being taught by someone expecting you to be a neurotypical.


Good luck.

If you're able to move to southern Australia, I can hook you into that geek network. But probably you'll have to find them yourself. :(

[Der Cute]

Pony Boy is right, though.

It DOES happen in office/professional settings.

Last year, I worked as a field tech, leading up to 6 ppl per day, in a repetitive but problem solving situation. Had to do a rollout for hardware. Every building was different, every person was different; but being LEAD was better for me, I was able to direct, make choices, be responsible for things and achieve ....I liked this, no, I loved it.

The job I just lost, I was told it was field tech, but turns out it's more desktop support.

Offices are very very hard for me. Politics are ebil; facial recognition and being able to come up with an answer in short time (or else they think i'm stupid/weird/cant' do it) is hard.



Seshat; I don't think I'd be a good Linux admin :) I love Windows more. I would like to be more admin than direct cust contact, but I have not found a job that lets you in like that.

Cutenoob

[Whiskey]

I have issues verbalizing my problems when I'm in a room with my psych. I started, throughout the week, writing down random issues I had. Everything from the trivial to the end of the world stuff. Then I take that to my doc, go down the list, and see what happens. Some of it is irrelevant, some of it isnt. Sometimes the irrelevant stuff ties into the relevant stuff as a pattern of behavior.

I've dealt with the whole "pushy" "rude" labels. A lot of it (for me) has to do with body language. I stand very defensively and when I'm focusing on what someone says, I tend to scowl. So where I'm listening intently and taking in what someone says so I can better myself, I look like I'm being dismissive and angry.

[Seshat]

Seshat; I don't think I'd be a good Linux admin :) I love Windows more. I would like to be more admin than direct cust contact, but I have not found a job that lets you in like that.

Look for the equivalent people in Windows system administration? :)

I know they exist in POSIX-based systems because I know them (and am married to one). I presume they're also in the Windows world.



Oooh, Whiskey. Me too. Or at least, until I started forcing myself to either do otherwise, or explain myself. And if I explain myself, it's very brief. "Don't mind me, I'm just concentrating. You were talking about X - please go on." Very briefly implying that my scowly-face is concentration, and reflecting their words back to them to prove that I'm listening.

It doesn't work all the time, but often I get people finishing their piece, then asking what it is with the face. I briefly mention that "I think I'm an undiagnosed Aspie. The 'geek' thing, you've heard of it? Yeah. My brain doesn't do social instinctively like most peoples', so when I'm concentrating on what you're saying and not how I look, I ... well, I look like whatever I did just then."

It often makes people a bit happier about me being a bit 'weird', as long as I make an effort to seem 'normal' most of the time. They're a bit more cool with my 'weird' expressions when I'm focussed and concentrating, 'cause hey, I'm clearly working - I'm not paying attention to my face!

[Magpie]

A couple of more things I thought of.

Is there anything consistent about the jobs you've held longest? It might be that there's a field that you're so good in that they'll ignore any other oddities. Also, it might be a field where they're used to people being "rude" and "pushy".

And some concrete tips for behaviour: make sure that you're paying attention to the other person. It's hard to describe what I'm trying to say here, but instead of looking at conversations as a way to communicate information, try to see them as relationship builders. Even at work. (Unless you get really really good at this very quickly :p). Based on what happens to me, which I fully acknowledge might be completely different from what happens to you, I wonder if your problem is that you're going up to co-workers (to use your example) with the intention of telling them to drop by when they have time. That is your only purpose, and when you get to there you say it as soon as possible. Once you've said it, you're done, and you need to get back to work ASAP.

What I found helped with the above difficulty was to focus on the person, not on what they're saying. I know it's subtle, but for me, when I focus on what the person is saying, it's about the information. And I no longer have the patience to hear them out once I know what they're going to say, or once it's just being social (which is important in its own way even at work). The other trick, although it's harder to remember to do, is to make sure that you take your time, and give the other person time to say something. I'm going to parse your example, but I had to take it fairly literally, you might already be doing this.

Rather than walking up to them and saying "Hey, if you've got time later around lunch, can you grab me? I need to do some more tweaking/changing on the machine here, and we can set up other things you need too.", split it up.

"Hey"
(wait, at the least, for them to look up, give them a chance to say something. At many work places a small amount of social conversation 2-3 exchanges is called for here)
"I'm doing a bit of teaking/changing on the machine here."
(optional pause, but whether or not you take it, watch for cues that they want to say something, and give them a chance to)
"If you've got time later around lunch could you grab me? We can work on that and maybe set up other things you need"
(closing social amenities)

The difference here is that instead of you going and just sending them a message, you've given them a chance to give input, and you're relating to them. Please don't take the above too literally. While my Asperger's means I'm aware of this stuff at a more conscious level, it also means I have odd views of how things work occasionally.

And I apologise if this isn't at all a problem you have, it's just my only take on things. And sometimes it won't work - it's a lot harder to fake normal social functioning in difficult situations. I can interact just fine with people who have good social functioning. I can handle normal situations better than a lot of other people can. I just break down really really fast when it gets outside of what I know, or if the other person is acting oddly. The above is to illustrate how coping mechanisms are only good for so much.

[Der Cute]

Rather than walking up to them and saying "Hey, if you've got time later around lunch, can you grab me? I need to do some more tweaking/changing on the machine here, and we can set up other things you need too.", split it up.

"Hey"
(wait, at the least, for them to look up, give them a chance to say something. At many work places a small amount of social conversation 2-3 exchanges is called for here)
"I'm doing a bit of teaking/changing on the machine here."
(optional pause, but whether or not you take it, watch for cues that they want to say something, and give them a chance to)
"If you've got time later around lunch could you grab me? We can work on that and maybe set up other things you need"
(closing social amenities)

The difference here is that instead of you going and just sending them a message, you've given them a chance to give input, and you're relating to them.

Mag, this is exactly what I'm needing. I need a breakdown of whats bad when I do it, and a better way to do it in future. People telling me "don't be pushy" doesn't do diddly, since I need a better example.

I think (am not sure) that my anxiety, and fear of fucking up magnifies when around people, and that I start talkingreallyquicklyandtrytogetitoutinonebreath.
Instead of Inhale, speak, them speak, inhale me speak...

Now that you've outlined the right steps for the dance, I can practice this.

When I talk to someone I know and trust, the anx goes away and I can be calm/collected/flow back and forth. But if I'm around new people, the trust in me doesn't work, and therefore I start goingwaytoofastand such.

Thanks. More input?


It's hard to keep eye contact. I keep ducking and looking away/breaking it. I'm uncomfortable, but is that sending a "I think you suck" sign? Or is it "I don't like you"

C

[Solumina]

You don't need to look right into someones eyes but if you don't look at them at all it can send the wrong message. A quick glance is generally all that you need as long as there is a friendly facial expression to go with it, which gives the message that you are paying attention to them but that you need to focus on other things too, if you just glance up and then right back to work with no smile or anything then it gives the impression that you don't think they are important enough for you to pay attention to. Also if you do want to give the impression of actually looking someone in the eye but don't feel comfortable then look right between their eyebrows, to them it will look the same but it should be much easier for you.

[TheSHAD0W]

You say you've sat down with a counselor, but I suspect he was not a certified psychologist, and you may need to see one.

[Seshat]

It can help to think of it as a protocol, in which each stage must be acknowledged.
Sort of like:
* HELO
* ACK

.. and so forth.

(Non-geeks: that's the first step of an email transfer.)

Or to think of the social chatter as header text. :)


In looking at people, and in handling the social chatter, another way to think of it is as acknowledging the humanity of your conversation partner. Give them an opportunity to be human at you, while you listen. Then reflect what they said, just a fragment of it, to let them know you actually listened.

An example:

You walk up to a co-worker, perhaps with some paper or a couple of tools in hand.

"Hi" (translation: HELO)
"Oh, hello" (translation: ACK)
"How's things?" (Got anything important to tell me?)
"Oh, you know, about the same. You?" (Not really. You?)
"Can't complain." (Not me either; other than the reason I came.)
"What can I do for you?" (Why did you come by?)
"I'm doing a bit of tweaking (etc)" (message payload)

<snip message>

"Cool, that's no problem." (Message received.)
"Hey, thanks." (Receipt acknowledged.)


There may be further footer, but it usually ends up being a new conversation:

"Oh, hey, while you're here?" (HELO)
"Yes?" (ACK)
"Did you know Jill's machine is causing problems?" (message payload)

.... etc etc etc.






Another thing is the purely social 'small talk' thing. It's hard for me - probably for you as well. I practiced on people I'd be unlikely to meet often, like cashiers at stores I don't frequent. ;)
The header is much the same as above, I'll add the translations once it changes. Oh, and in this case, the 'me' is buying chrysanthemums. For some reason.

"Hello"
"Heya"
"How's things?"
"Pretty good. You?"
"Doing fine. These chrysanthemums are lovely."
(I acknowledge you're human and invite social interaction.)
"They are, aren't they? And they're on sale."
(Acknowledgement and invitation accepted. Hey, thanks.)
"I know. I couldn't resist buying them."
(Continued interaction to provide a boost to our 'social' attribute)
"I'm picking some up on payday. $4.25 please."
(Suits me. Mutual benefit. Oh, and here's some message payload.)
"$4.25, there you go. You'll really enjoy them."
(Message payload. And final acknowledgement of your humanity.)
"I know. See you next time!"
(Thanks! I look forward to future interactions with you.)
"Bye!"
(Final acknowledgement)



The purpose of 'small talk' is well defined in the 'The Sims' series of games. It ups relationship scores and social attribute bars: neurotypical humans have a stronger need for social contact than the typical aspie does.

The payload is actually the fact of contact. The overt topic can be anything - preferably something of at least some interest to both participants.


Does this help?

[ArcticChicken]

Seshat just said what I was going to say, but she did it much more elegantly.

You also might look into find a counselor who works on a sliding scale, and explain your situation. You might be able to find someone who can adjust their rates when you're out of a job. I just started with a sliding scale service, and the lowest they can go is $25 a session.

[Seshat]

Seshat just said what I was going to say, but she did it much more elegantly.

(bows)

Thank you!

[Magpie]

Now that you've outlined the right steps for the dance, I can practice this.

...

It's hard to keep eye contact. I keep ducking and looking away/breaking it. I'm uncomfortable, but is that sending a "I think you suck" sign? Or is it "I don't like you"

C

If that's what you need, I'm going to have to be mean here and say that it would be counter-productive to give you any more detailed step-by-step. I hated it when my social coach told me that. However, it doesn't help as much because you need to be able to get a feel for it. Remember how I told you that I can break down really quickly if it's outside of what I'm comfortable? To improve that I need to develop a feel for how socialising goes. Knowing more specific situations won't help.

Eye contact trick: look at their upper cheek, their nose, their forehead, etc. It's almost impossible for them to tell that that's what you're doing. It isn't necessary to make continuous eye contact. In fact this can be detrimental (it's a sign of aggression which makes you look, you guessed it, pushy). I can't help you with how to do it properly, I'm trying to figure that one out myself. And watching other people isn't helping - engineering is not a good place to learn social skills.

Finally, I'm not sure you can actually preclude Asperger's. Women tend to present very differently than men (i.e. the symptoms might be the same, but they show up in different ways.) If you think that there might be some benefit to getting diagnosed you might want to look into it. However, it's an expensive process, and a lot of people don't feel a need for formal diagnosis, so don't feel like you have to do it. It might help you find some closure though, if you can afford the time and money.

Feel free to PM me about this stuff if you want to though.

[Flying Grype]

I've had a thought that isn't very pretty... sometimes, assertive and no-nonsense behaviour that would be admirable in a man is considered to be distasteful coming from a woman. Meet someone's eyes, ask for something without simpering and prettying up your words, and you'll be called a bitch for it. Yes, people do lose their jobs over it. I'm trying to learn myself how to be 'softer' and 'sweeter' so that I'll get along better with people in the workplace, but that is sure as hell not me.

[BlaqueKatt]

I am afraid that I'll not be able to use my computer degree. The entry level work is desktop support/helpdesk, which is direct customer contact. <snip>
When corresponding or communicating via email or phone, I do pretty good. I have the time to think the speech through, to 'try to see consequences' of a sentence, and on the phone I know to keep mouth smiling and calm.


Hmmm my husband is in IT-works remote support/NOC/helpdesk-no customer contact except for phone/email, the people he supports are states away....they do have onsite techs that get sent out-but those are specific people-if you lived here they're hiring.... :(

[tollbaby]

I used to have exactly that type of problem in the workplace (and sometimes I still do, but I recognize it when I offend someone and promptly apologize). What helped me a lot was to create mentors for myself. I see someone successful at what I'm trying to accomplish, either at work or in my personal life, and I try to model my behavior on what I observe that person doing. I write little notes for myself like, "Don't interrupt people" "Smile when you're on the phone" and put them up around my workstation. Yeah, anyone looking closely at my notes will think I'm an oddball, but so what? They help me remember to moderate my behavior appropriately in a professional situation - to the point where a few recent coworkers with whom I ended up discussing asperger's because their children had been diagnosed said they never would have known if I hadn't told them.

To compensate for my lack of social graces, I take copious mental notes on how others who seem well-liked behave in social situations and try to mimic their behaviours and responses. My one cardinal rule is to always approach situation with a positive attitude, as I truly believe that negativity only begets negativity, and I don't want to be surrounded by negativity. (I don't care how much bunk people think The Secret is, it has really change my outlook on my own behaviour).

[Seshat]

To compensate for my lack of social graces, I take copious mental notes on how others who seem well-liked behave in social situations and try to mimic their behaviours and responses. My one cardinal rule is to always approach situation with a positive attitude, as I truly believe that negativity only begets negativity, and I don't want to be surrounded by negativity. (I don't care how much bunk people think The Secret is, it has really change my outlook on my own behaviour).

My main model was my grandmother.

I agree that negativity begets negativity, and positivity likewise. But I have a very specific reason for it.

* I'm nice to the cashier.
* Her mood improves.
* She's more likely to be nice to the next person she meets. (Maybe more than one.)
* That person's mood improves.
* They're more likely to be nice...
* eventually it comes back around to me.
Of course, by that time, I've been nice to twenty different people, so I've scattered 'niceness' in my wake all the way around the shopping mall.

Or obversely:
* I'm nasty to the cashier.
* Her mood gets grumpier.
* She's more likely to be surly or nasty to the next person/people she meets.
* etc etc.
And thus, I scatter 'nastiness' in my wake.

Given the choice, I choose to scatter niceness.

[Rapscallion]

How are you doing now, Cutenoob?

Rapscallion

[Der Cute]

Well, overall, okish.

I'm transtioning medications to get me "higher" on the depression scale, because I've got PostPartumMood Disorder...(used to be called PPD, but now you get a range of mood disorders..anxiety, ocd, totally psychotic...yargh)

So this new drug is kind of rocky, tbh : standard titration is very slow. VERY.

And, I'm still feeling like a failure.

I got feedback from the HR person (when did THIS start happening) that I need to work on my listening skills, that I interrupt and "think I know everything already". This goes along with the "you need humility" and "you need empathy" lines I've heard before.

Sad part is I'm having a hell of a time trying to find a doc to work on all this shit. Because the first priority was/is to get me stabilized with the PPMD stuff. NOW with anxiety exacerbated, depression on crack, and my control freak getting it's freak on, I'm even more f-d up than I used to be. I'm trying currently to get a neuro psych evaluation to get a full list of issues (heh) and then start really working on it.

I feel like I'm playing whack-a-mood in my head.

Strangely enough, I've got my satire/humor working. Sometimes that and my kitty are the only things that keep me going.

Cutenoob

[Der Cute]

Update:

Isn't life interesting? When someone hands you lemons....I hate lemons.

I've been offered a job and hired. I am starting work, and am scared shitless that I might lose it due to the behavior that I've got ingrained in me.

I fought for a psych diagnosis and psych check from my PCP doc. I said, "dude, if I've got coverage, I better use it - so hook me up with someone who can figure out wtf is going on in my head" And it was an interesting quiz/session with the doc.

I've been diagnosed with Borderline Personality Disorder. I was speechless when I realized that is what the Dr. was hinting at, and what it means....it's me all day. And scarily, it's not easy to fix. It takes a style of counseling called DBT. It's like CBT on 'roids and much more strict. (actually, I need that, but hey, I'm a masochist)

I'm hoping that this job (after training) will work for me. The training is supposed to last 5 or 6 weeks, and today was very overwhelming. My brain feels like mush. Runny mush. But I'm keeping my eyes on the goal of Graveyard Shift, where I'll be alone, ALONE, ALOONNNNNE and working via email and phone. Those 2 kinds of contact are much easier for me.

Dr. also pointed me towards some treatment places, and I'm getting the runaround there with them. Did you know that I asked specifically "Does this place do DBT" and that the people said Yes, We Do...come to find out that DBT wasn't done in this city's center, and it "might" be somewhere else.
WTF. I called to get this lined up yalls...

Drugs have changed a LOT - I'm feeling SO much better than I was in June. I'm much more confident as a mom (that's scary too), getting the anxiety shushed, balanced in mood and overall dealing. I'm much better, but not anywhere near perfect.

I hope that I can get working on these issues soon. I need the money to survive, but if I fuck this job up, I'm not going to feel so good...it's an endless loop of needing help, getting a job, losing the job because I need the help....

Guys, I need good thoughts and hugs to keep me going. I'm scared - I know I'll live, but get through this training? That's critical.

Cutenoob

[Mytical]

*hugs and good thoughts* You WILL make it through, and you WILL realize you are awesome. Everybody is unique, unique means special. Just remember that. ((Though not 'spechal' like most SC's think hehe, but I am rambling again)).

[Magpie]

:hug:

I hope that you find somewhere that will do the DBT, and that it sticks in.

Best of luck with the new job.

[Kaylyn]

I've been diagnosed with Borderline Personality Disorder. I was speechless when I realized that is what the Dr. was hinting at, and what it means....it's me all day. And scarily, it's not easy to fix. It takes a style of counseling called DBT. It's like CBT on 'roids and much more strict. (actually, I need that, but hey, I'm a masochist)

I've been doing some research for my novel about suicide, depression, and mood disorders. I stumbled across BPD in several books and just glanced over it. Then I read about it in more detail and realized HOO BOY THAT'S ME.

I don't think my case is as severe as, say, Susanna Kaysen (Girl, Interrupted), but I fit the criteria. I don't necessarily have a problem reading social cues from people, but I do tend to come across as abrupt and rude to people. I also do the whole jumping in on people's sentences and have tried to train myself to let them finish, even if I know what they're going to say or suggest.

My biggest problem is mood swings and blowing things WAY out of proportion. I get what I call the "spiral." One tiny little thing might set it off, for example, a short paycheck that causes something to go overdue because I can't get bills paid on time. Then I'll start thinking about my mother-in-law and how she's too lazy to work, and how she doesn't even get off her butt and pick up her dogs' poop around the house before I step in it, and how she can't be arsed to get off the computer for ten minutes and do SOMETHING around the house, and how her chatrooms are more important than sitting down and actually HOMESCHOOLING her younger son like she should be doing (he's horribly behind and is 16 and functioning at MAYBE a third-grade level)...next thing you know I'm on the phone yelling at my husband for caring more about his Team Fortress 2 or League of Legends games than me. And he has no clue where it all came from. Luckily he understands how I work, and lets me get it out of my system, because he knows in a couple of hours I'll be calling him back apologizing.

I've gotten a LOT better at controlling myself. I've started taking a few extra seconds to think about how what I'm about to say is going to be perceived, and if I'm saying it because I feel it's necessary and will actually improve a situation, or if I just want to rage for the sake of raging. It's really helped with my relationships with my friends that don't understand me quite as well as my husband does.

If you need advice or just to talk, feel free to PM me. I'm here with insight or commiseration (hey, spellcheck says that's actually a word!) if you need it.

[teh_blumchenkinder]

I'm so glad you're feeling better, Cutenoob. Hang in there. *sends fuzzy-warm thoughts, prayers, and ethereal-chocolate to cutenoob.net*