grrrr. I should not have to argue about this

[BlaqueKatt]

ok so BG: last monday I had a little bump on my arm, looked like a pimple, monday night I either scratched it in my sleep or it popped. Tuesday I had a dime sized reddish ring around it(covered it in antibiotic ointment), wednesday it was the size of a quarter. Thursday about golf ball size. all this time it's been puffy, painful, and very warm to the touch(infection!), and the original wound has gotten larger. By this point I know it's cellulitus, from the progression over the past few days.


So thursday I manage to snag a doctor's appointment.

I go in and explain everything above, including that I'm 99.9% sure it's cellulitus, this is what I get from the "medical professional"

MP: I think it looks like a bite
Me: yeah it kinda does now, didn't a few days ago though.
MP: are you sure it's not a bite?
Me: nothing I know of causes a pimple when it bites, so yeah relatively sure.
MP: because it looks like a "classic" brown recluse bite.
Me: well considering Those spiders aren't anywhere near here, and 80% of suspected brown recluse bites are actually misdiagnosed MRSA, or simple staph infections*, I don't think it is.
MP: Well, we'll give you antibiotics and culture it, but I'm positive it's a brown recluse bite.
Me: they don't live in WI, are we done can I go now?



It was staph, antibiotics have cleared up the reddness, swelling and pain already, but the central wound is still there, albeit much smaller.

*more info on this from the university of California Riverside Spider research department (http://spiders.ucr.edu/necrotic.html), for anyone who is interested

[teh_blumchenkinder]

o____o staph? Icky. I'm just glad you could get into the doc's office! And, y'know, they took a culture... oy.

[Seshat]

I was thinking 'staph' right from the start. That's how my brother's staph infection happened.

And if there's no brown recluses where you are, how did the doctor's mind go to 'brown recluse bite'?

[Sapphire Silk]

MP: because it looks like a "classic" brown recluse bite.
Me: well considering Those spiders aren't anywhere near here, and 80% of suspected brown recluse bites are actually misdiagnosed MRSA, or simple staph infections*, I don't think it is.

:doh: Ugh. Not every cellulitis is caused by an insect bite. They are caused by all sorts of things. Without actually seeing the insect, it's hard to confirm a bite unless you see fang marks.

Any infection of the skin and soft tissues is a cellulitis, but BlaqueKatt kept careful track of the original injury and gave pretty good information to the doctor, so the only reason I can think of that he went to brown recluse is he had a case as a resident that he either missed or was the only one he saw, so it stuck in his mind.

I'm glad you went to the doctor and got it checked out though.

Staph lives on our skin, it is part of our normal flora and fauna. It is an opportunistic pathogen, meaning it is usually harmless but will take advantage of a break in the skin to cause a infection. It is the most common cause of cellulitis. MRSA is Methocillin Resistant Staph Aureus, which is becoming more and more common in the community because of the abuse of antibiotics.

[BlaqueKatt]

And if there's no brown recluses where you are, how did the doctor's mind go to 'brown recluse bite'?

media hype-BRS bites have been "diagnosed" in Alaska, and other states that don't have them, I don't really expect a physician to know what critters live where, but I get annoyed when they argue about it-"everyone" has seen the pictures on the internet of "brown recluse bites", it's usually the first thing some physicians think of when they see a skin lesion, because the horribleness sticks in your brain, even if it's incorrect horribleness. I lived in Missouri, brown recluses are all over down there(85% of households have them, most people don't notice, or don't know what they are, and it's never just one, you have one you have hundreds of the damn things), and because they're all over, we knew they were pretty harmless. I used to brush them off the bed on a regular basis. Amusingly people would panic when they came to visit, and would see one run across the floor, though only after I let them know what it was.

[Sapphire Silk]

Theoretically, a brown recluse could get shipped up to a place like that in a shipping container, say of food stuffs. Cockroaches do this all the time; if you lived in a place with roaches and move, you need to check your boxes before unpacking them to make sure you didn't bring your old roommates along to the new place.

But that's rare with brown recluses.

On another note, my brother really did get bitten by a brown recluse. He caught the spider and showed it to the doc. He ended up very sick and spent a couple of days in the hospital.

[Seshat]

Staph lives on our skin, it is part of our normal flora and fauna. It is an opportunistic pathogen, meaning it is usually harmless but will take advantage of a break in the skin to cause a infection. It is the most common cause of cellulitis. MRSA is Methocillin Resistant Staph Aureus, which is becoming more and more common in the community because of the abuse of antibiotics.

Oh!

I thought it was Multiply Resistant, as in resistant to multiple antibiotics.

Well that's kind of good - for me. Cause if I get it, they wouldn't be able to use Methocillin on me anyway. Allergy to the penicillin family.

[NateTheChops]

Ah, cellulitus. I've had about enough fun with that little condition. I also had an allergic reaction to the first round of medication that landed me in the hospital for a couple of days.

Fun.

[kpzra]

I saw more than one brown recluse in Alaska while I lived there. They were common on Ft Richardson when they would hitch rides on packed house hold goods...lots of infantry there who came from Benning or Bragg.


I had cellulitus in/on my knee from a small cut from shaving. It started in some scar tissue I have from staples, so I didn't really notice it at first, then it was a rapid spread. By the time I was able to see my doctor (3 days) she was ready to admit me as it had spread to where I had no function in my knee. She also did the worse case talk, as one doc wanted to amputate since nothing was working at first and it kept spreading.

[ShadowBall]

Gotta love when you have to go to a doctor and make the diagnosis for them. Besides, don't brown recluse bites turn all kinds of pretty colors besides red?

Some doctors are just plain dumb, period. When I was 16, my doctor diagnosed me with an infection worthy of a month's worth of antibiotics following a urine test full of bacteria. Turns out that such bacteria in a young child would be bad, but it's normal and harmless in a teenage girl. Probably didn't help I was still going to pediatrics. Same doctor who said I had RA after a fluke ANA test.

I digress. Glad you were about to get some treatment for your infection. I hope it goes away and you get to feeling better soon.

[BlaqueKatt]

*sigh* and now one of my facebook friends is posting pictures of undeterminable origin and veracity off the internet of "brown recluse bites" and claiming they're more valid than peer reviewed medical journal articles(and amazingly one of the pictures is a stock photo from the mayo clinic archive of MRSA-I showed her that and she's still insisting it's a brown recluse bite *headdesk* I really hate willful ignorance. Of course she also just posted a picture of a grass spider claiming it was a brown recluse in her house(it's in a web for pete's sake)

[Eisa]

My mom had the opposite thing happen before. She was bitten by a hobo spider at work. Her charge nurse took her/had her go [can't remember] to this urgent care place. Well, the doctor there didn't like the charge nurse, so he tried telling my mom that it was shingles. She was like "you can still SEE the fang marks! :eek: "


I would think it is possible to somehow come in contact with a stray brown recluse, but I also think you'd notice other symptoms, wouldn't you? Those are nasty spiders. -shudders-

I'm glad you got it checked out, but sorry--that sounds really yucky and having to tell the doctor what it isn't sure doesn't help.

[BlaqueKatt]

I would think it is possible to somehow come in contact with a stray brown recluse, but I also think you'd notice other symptoms, wouldn't you? Those are nasty spiders.

Pain for a few hours, only 5-10% of bites actually require medical attention, the other 90-95% heal on their own in a few days, like any other insect bite. it's mostly hype, kinda like the frenzy over sharks, killer bees, and the like, they're the current "boogyman". I was never bitten when I lived in missouri and my house was loaded with them, as in you'd see 10-15 of them a week, just chillin' or running across the floor-little buggers are fast, the cats loved chasing/killing them.

[Eisa]

-twitch- AAAAAAAH! :runaway:

Would be my reaction. :p

Our house is/was filled with hobo spiders...they'd come up from the basement. My mom's been bitten...3-4 times, I think? They will crawl over other people and leave them alone just to bite her. :p It always looks painful as hell. :(

[fma_fanatic]

media hype-BRS bites have been "diagnosed" in Alaska, and other states that don't have them, I don't really expect a physician to know what critters live where, but I get annoyed when they argue about it-"everyone" has seen the pictures on the internet of "brown recluse bites", it's usually the first thing some physicians think of when they see a skin lesion, because the horribleness sticks in your brain, even if it's incorrect horribleness. I lived in Missouri, brown recluses are all over down there(85% of households have them, most people don't notice, or don't know what they are, and it's never just one, you have one you have hundreds of the damn things), and because they're all over, we knew they were pretty harmless. I used to brush them off the bed on a regular basis. Amusingly people would panic when they came to visit, and would see one run across the floor, though only after I let them know what it was.

We had them in the basement of the old house we rented. That was one of the reasons we moved (the other being the landlord decided it was okay to yell at me when he came over to do some needed repairs).

We caught a few in the spider traps and I think that was enough for me. I was bitten by a spider, but whether or not it was a brown recluse was undetermined, but the bite hurt like a sumabitch for a week or more. The ER didn't want to take any chances and gave me antibiotics for it. I have a nice little scar now.


I'm terrified of spiders, so if I see one, they get taken care of by the husband.

[Sapphire Silk]

Bites of most large spiders will cause infection which can get serious, but their venom is usually not dangerous to humans.

The exceptions being black widows and brown recluses.

[blas]

Where is this clown school I can go to and get this license to tell people that they've been bitten by insects that don't even exist in this state? I could totally use the extra money.

Between that doc, my coworker's doc, and the MRI doc in another thread....I am losing faith in people whose job is to help us.

[Seshat]

Bites of most large spiders will cause infection which can get serious, but their venom is usually not dangerous to humans.

The exceptions being black widows and brown recluses.

... and a few Australian spiders. (Funnelweb spider, Wolf spider, White-tail spider. Redback, if you can call that 'large', and the hybrid redback with the same shape but without the red colouration.)

[Scorpodael]

... and a few Australian spiders. (Funnelweb spider, Wolf spider, White-tail spider. Redback, if you can call that 'large', and the hybrid redback with the same shape but without the red colouration.)

If I recall correctly, the only non-lethal things living in Australia consists of "Some of the sheep."

[Zaiida]

... and a few Australian spiders. (Funnelweb spider, Wolf spider, White-tail spider. Redback, if you can call that 'large', and the hybrid redback with the same shape but without the red colouration.)

Ah yes the fanged veranda brigade. Turn the outside light on and they scatter, it's like a scene from arachnophobia with legs and eyes everywhere. It's not a pleasant event when a huntsman decides to skydive onto your head when you go outside for a smoke. Apparently I squeak like a dog toy when I'm scared :o

Scariest spiders ever are the trapdoor spiders. Damn they are fast little critters.

Glad your arm is getting better BlaqueKatt.

[Seshat]

I've learned to recognise huntsmen, orb weavers, St Andrews Cross....

It's when a spider I recognise as dangerous, or a spider I don't recognise, tries to take a shower with me that I panic. :eek:

Fortunately, A loves bugs and can easily recognise almost any Australian bug. Including our spiders. If it's not dangerous, she'll catch it and try to invite it outside. But she's death on two legs to wolf spiders! (Fearless, that woman.)

[Solumina]

Strange, the wolf spiders around here are pretty harmless, I guess the ones in Australia are a bit different.

[Seshat]

Their venom itself is harmless, but for whatever reason, wolf spider bites here sometimes become necrotic. Whether the spider is carrying the bacterium or it's an opportunistic infection is not yet known: but A doesn't want to risk any of us!

[LadyAndreca]

Brown recluses lived in my high school dorms. They especially loved to sit in the bathrooms and freak us out in the middle of the night. :eek: But only one kid ever got bit in the four years I was there. One took a chomp on his forehead when he was sleeping and it got necrotic. Poor guy got a good deal of teasing because he had to wear a gauze bandage on his forehead for over a week.

[Eisa]

If I recall correctly, the only non-lethal things living in Australia consists of "Some of the sheep."


I'm pretty sure even the sheep in Australia are lethal. :p

Just listen to this! (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=eNEeq5qGh8I) [potentially terrifying images]

[ArcticChicken]

Amusingly people would panic when they came to visit, and would see one run across the floor, though only after I let them know what it was.

I'd panic before you let me know what it was, I HATE spiders. And anything with too many legs, really.

The irritating thing is that if there is anyone else home, I am incapable of dealing with bugs (we get silverfish *shudder*), but if I'm the only one there I can get the vacuum cleaner and get rid of the bastards.

[Geek King]

Their venom itself is harmless, but for whatever reason, wolf spider bites here sometimes become necrotic. Whether the spider is carrying the bacterium or it's an opportunistic infection is not yet known: but A doesn't want to risk any of us!

Wierdness. Wolf Spiders get pretty big in my area--especially those out in the wild with good hunting and warm areas during winter--but I've never heard of them biting anything human size. Maybe if someone grabbed one by accident, or something. The ones I've seen either lumbered off, or did the cockroach, "I'm not moving so you can't see me! Can't see me!"

[Seshat]

Australian spiders, snakes, and other such critters are much the same: for the most, they ignore or avoid humans. We're not prey, we're not predators, and they're not domesticated.

But some people DO go sticking their hands into dark places without looking first. And they're the ones who are most likely to get bitten.

(Intelligent workmen - plumbers etc - whose job involves sticking their hands in dark places wear thick gloves.)

[Sapphire Silk]

... and a few Australian spiders. (Funnelweb spider, Wolf spider, White-tail spider. Redback, if you can call that 'large', and the hybrid redback with the same shape but without the red colouration.)

I should have mentioned I was talking about North America.

I know nothing about the critters of the rest of the world. :o

[Zaiida]

Wolf spiders around here grow to bigger than my hand. I have seen the rare one the size of a dinner plate. The next biggest are the orb weavers then the huntsmans. Huntsmans are the most prolific here but the biggest scaredy cats and will run (scuttle really) away and they are great for keeping bugs down in the house. Just don't repeatedly poke the wolf spiders they will chase you and they run really fast on four legs. Great fun to watch, not fun if you are the one being chased :) (I confess I was a wee bit pissed at the time). Funnelwebs are the most territoral and will attack extremely fast so stay away from their, err, web holes. I find bull ants to be the most problematic pest when you get them. Give me spiders over bull ants any day.

Word of caution: Never ever ever ever try to pet a kangaroo or a koala in the wild. Don't ever get near them especially during mating season - Says she who was chased by a really pissed of male koala as a kid because I stumbled on his territory. They make the most awful grunting tearing nightmarish vocalisations when pissed off and are capable of causing some serious injury. Cuddly creatures my ass.

Australian spiders, snakes, and other such critters are much the same: for the most, they ignore or avoid humans. We're not prey, we're not predators, and they're not domesticated.

But some people DO go sticking their hands into dark places without looking first. And they're the ones who are most likely to get bitten.

(Intelligent workmen - plumbers etc - whose job involves sticking their hands in dark places wear thick gloves.)

Workmen like that around here look like mummies they have to cover up so much before getting under houses, the critters here have a bit plaguey these past few years.

[Seshat]

Hell, I dress up like a mummy just to do heavy garden work. Pulling a few weeds is one thing, but I own Yakka-style cotton drill workpants, lighter cotton drill top with Coolmax (or something similar) ventilation, breathing mask, gloves, workboots, safety glasses, hat...

And yeah, I'll typically use the pants, top, gloves and workboots even for gardening. The glasses and mask for things like trimming branches above my head.

If I had to go crawl under the house... well, I probably wouldn't. Safer to hire someone.

[Zaiida]

I am not looking forward to installing underfloor insulation in the house in a few weeks with all the spideys running around. I'll need a heavy duty CSI suit, I wonder where you get those.

[Seshat]

I got my long-sleeved/long pants kit at the men's department in K-Mart or Big W or some such.
Gloves and other safety gear from any hardware store.
The boots - mine are actually hiking boots, which do the job fine. Army surplus places are also great for this sort of thing.