Fun with archery!

[Gizmo]

There's an excercise for building up the muscles I learned when I was on the Univ. team. If you'd like, I can detail it here.

As I'm currently out of action myself I would be interested in hearing that exercise please.

[wolfie]

If you want, but you don't have to go to a compound bow to have a high draw weight. All the pulleys do is reduce the draw weight once they kick in. It makes it easier to hold a full draw for a longer period of time. It's entirely up to you.

The "arms" of a bow follow spring law (force increases linearly with deflection). For a given draw weight, a recurve bow puts more energy into the arrow than a stick bow (the ends act like separate springs), while a compound puts the most energy into the arrow - the eccentric pulleys work to turn the increasing force (at the arm ends) into as close as possible to a linear force, dropping in the last inch or so of draw to a holding force significantly less than the draw weight.

Some competitions ban compound bows but allow recurves, since the recurve is a traditional design.

[Crossbow]

As I'm currently out of action myself I would be interested in hearing that exercise please.

Ok. It's pretty simple, but can be extremely taxing.

For starters, get your bow and any arm/finger/clothing guards on. You want to be set up as though you were getting ready to shoot.

Second, at no point are you loading an arrow or releasing the string. I would hope that anyone involved in archery knows that dry-firing any bow is a Bad Idea (TM).

Exercise steps below.

1: Draw the bow to full draw
2: Hold the full draw position for 7 seconds.
3: Slowly lower the bow, bringing the string carefully back to the rest position.
4: Rest for 1 second.

This is a single "rep" for the exercise. A "set" consists of 10 reps. The full exercise is 3 sets.

*IF* you can do the full exercise without your arms shaking like a dubstep dancer, then congratulations! You are strong enough to safely use a bow of that draw weight without worrying about fatigue. You might even want to consider moving up in draw weight a bit.

Don't feel bad if you can't do it. It's not easy, and I can tell you that right now, I couldn't do it if my life depended on it. Either cut down on the number of reps per set, or only do a single set.

If you can't get through a half set, you might want to downgrade the draw weight a bit.

***Note concerning "draw weight" on a bow: The limb strength is only part of the equation. Limb weight is measured at a given draw length, traditionally 28 inches. If you draw longer or shorter than that, either add (for longer) or subtract (for shorter) 2 pounds of weight per inch.

The "arms" of a bow follow spring law (force increases linearly with deflection). For a given draw weight, a recurve bow puts more energy into the arrow than a stick bow (the ends act like separate springs), while a compound puts the most energy into the arrow - the eccentric pulleys work to turn the increasing force (at the arm ends) into as close as possible to a linear force, dropping in the last inch or so of draw to a holding force significantly less than the draw weight.

Some competitions ban compound bows but allow recurves, since the recurve is a traditional design.

Exactly. The pulleys allow for a mostly stick-bow configuration with a much shorter limb and still have a very high draw weight.

I've fired a compound/recurve combination (bizarre little beasty) that had a draw let-off of almost 85%. So basically, while the bow was rated as a 70 pound draw, when I got to full draw of 29 inches, I was only holding about 12-15 pounds. Oddest feeling I've eveer had shooting... (The Oneida Eagle, if you're curious...)

[wolfie]

In case anyone doesn't understand how 2 bows with the same draw weight can put different amounts of energy into the arrow, imagine a graph with draw distance on the X axis and force needed on the Y axis. The highest point on the curve is the draw weight, while the area under the curve is the energy stored in the bent bow. Some of that energy will go into accelerating the bow arms during release, the rest goes into the arrow (so a short bow, which has less mass in its arms, will transfer a higher proportion of the stored energy to the arrow than will a long bow).

The 2 extremes would be an "ideal" spring unstressed at rest (straight line from zero force/zero draw to draw weight/maximum draw), and a constant-force spring (nominal draw weight from zero to maximum draw). The second one has twice the stored energy as the first.

[fireheart]

Ok. It's pretty simple, but can be extremely taxing.

For starters, get your bow and any arm/finger/clothing guards on. You want to be set up as though you were getting ready to shoot.

Second, at no point are you loading an arrow or releasing the string. I would hope that anyone involved in archery knows that dry-firing any bow is a Bad Idea (TM).

Just a heads-up, there's a bow trainer out there that you can get that allows you to do said exercise without having to set up your bow. It works for different draw weights too. http://www.bow-trainer.com/about/ (Partner bought one the other day)

Also, I did my second session the other day (weather kinda threw off the last two weeks). Luckily I didn't need too much correcting beyond my aiming and that I was releasing at my draw point instead of letting my hand travel with the string for a bit. Partner and I were more focused on our grouping for this session (meaning that my technique was getting more consistent) and as a result, by the end of the session I was grouping 2 out of 3 arrows each round. (Last round resulted in all 3 being grouped nicely)

This time around I was shooting 18lb at 66" for the whole session, which worked in my favour, although my hand was wobbling a little at some points. We're going to try next session again on an 18lb and possibly a 68" to see which one suits me best. There's a guy at the club who runs an online store and I plan on getting in contact with him to be measured up and whatnot since he offers one of the better deals out there. (Around $700AUD to get set up with everything apart from a chest guard, but he also shows you how to set it up and all that.)

Our last session is in 2 weeks, after that I'll be making arrangements to join the club located at the range I've been shooting at. We discovered that being a member at said range has a few added benefits. Namely that we get a whole section of the range to ourselves and that we can use it for free whenever the site is open. (We DO pay membership fees )

[Crossbow]

Just a heads-up, there's a bow trainer out there that you can get that allows you to do said exercise without having to set up your bow. It works for different draw weights too. http://www.bow-trainer.com/about/ (Partner bought one the other day)

Interesting. Would you mind giving a review once you and your partner have had a chance to work with it for a bit?

Also, I did my second session the other day (weather kinda threw off the last two weeks). Luckily I didn't need too much correcting beyond my aiming and that I was releasing at my draw point instead of letting my hand travel with the string for a bit. Partner and I were more focused on our grouping for this session (meaning that my technique was getting more consistent) and as a result, by the end of the session I was grouping 2 out of 3 arrows each round. (Last round resulted in all 3 being grouped nicely)

Sounds like you're progressing nicely! I've always been of the belief that there are two parts to any sport like archer, shooting, bowling, fencing, etc.: consistency and accuracy. Consistency is the most important, as without being consistent, accuracy is pretty much a matter of chance. get your groupings down first. Once you've got that, you can much easier work on where you're putting that group.

[Jester]

I've learned that 2.5 hours of archery does not work in my favour. 90 minutes, yes. 2.5 hours? Not so much.

The longer you shoot and get used to it, the easier it will be to go up in draw weight.

Conditioning. Just like any athletic endeavor, your body needs to be conditioned, and once it is, things will be easier and you will be able to do them longer. When I was on track in high school, the first month was brutal...I'd get home after track practice and be wiped out, often napping. After that first month, though, I actually felt more and more energized, as my body was getting into shape and getting used to the running and other forms of practice we had. Same when I start bicycling again after long layoffs. (I no longer run. Fuck that. ) And the same will be true with you and archery. Your body is not used to what you are doing to it. Continue to do it on a regular basis, and it will get used to it, will get in better shape for it, and it will be easier for you to do. And you'll be able to do it for longer, with less difficulty, and perhaps with improved performance on your part due to your improved conditioning.

I would hope that anyone involved in archery knows that dry-firing any bow is a Bad Idea (TM).

For those of us that are archery civilians, can you please explain why it is a bad idea? And please use simple language and avoid archery jargon, as us civilians will look at you with utterly blank confusion.

[fireheart]

For those of us that are archery civilians, can you please explain why it is a bad idea? And please use simple language and avoid archery jargon, as us civilians will look at you with utterly blank confusion.

The way that my archery coach explained it is that the arrow carries all the energy when you release the string. If you release it WITHOUT an arrow, all that energy travels to the top and bottom of the bow and can basically shorten the life of said bow.

[Jester]

Okay, explained that way, that makes total sense.

[Crossbow]

Okay, explained that way, that makes total sense.

What firehart said. the only expansion on the explanation I'll say is "shortening the life of said bow" can be an understatement. I have seen bows literally (and I do mean literally) explode when dry-fired. As in everything from the limb splitting lengthwise to shrapnel flying around. The higher the draw weight of the bow, the higher the chance of a catastrophic failure.

[Gizmo]

What firehart said. the only expansion on the explanation I'll say is "shortening the life of said bow" can be an understatement. I have seen bows literally (and I do mean literally) explode when dry-fired. As in everything from the limb splitting lengthwise to shrapnel flying around. The higher the draw weight of the bow, the higher the chance of a catastrophic failure.

yeah, very much "good bye rubber band" moments when that happens.

[fireheart]

What firehart said. the only expansion on the explanation I'll say is "shortening the life of said bow" can be an understatement. I have seen bows literally (and I do mean literally) explode when dry-fired. As in everything from the limb splitting lengthwise to shrapnel flying around. The higher the draw weight of the bow, the higher the chance of a catastrophic failure.

Yeowch. I think my partner would be very pissed if someone dry-fired his bow (he's going longbow, I'm going recurve)

For Jester's benefit (and any other folks who have NO clue what we're referring to), here is Fireheart's Guide To Archery Terminology:

Recurve: These look like your "typical" archery bow and is the only style permitted at the Olympics. Most recurve bows nowadays come in three parts minimum: the riser and the limbs.

Compound: These are the "modern" bows and are a heck of a lot more expensive to purchase and maintain. They do however, have the benefit of added accuracy.

Riser: Sometimes simply called the handle, this is the part of the bow that you hold onto when you're drawing it to fire. These tend to come in 2 flavours nowadays: 23" or 25" and can be wood or metal. Most training bows are wooden ones. (There are smaller or larger ones, but these are typically used by kids or petite/large folks)

Limb: These are the top and bottom parts of the bow and is also where the string attaches. Limbs are sold by both draw weight and draw length. Over time, as your strength increases, these need to be replaced. The good news is though, is that you can mix the limbs and the riser, so your riser can be from Brand A while your limbs can be from Brand B. (This will be my planned route)

Draw length: Roughly how far back you can pull the string. This measurement is used when you go to buy your bow. I'm not going to get into HOW its measured, but this mostly affects what size limbs you need. They come in 3 main flavours: Short, medium and long. Usually a 23" riser takes short or medium, while a 25" riser can take all 3. Having a bow with too short or big a draw length can result in poor technique and frustration.

Draw weight: The amount of force needed to pull the string back. This can and will vary between people, the more you shoot, the higher your draw weight will eventually be. Limbs are sold by draw weight and can go from as low as 16lbs (of force) to as high as 40-42lbs.

Arrow: What you're shooting of course! An arrow has four main parts: the point, the shaft, the fletching (feathers-the pretty coloured things on the end of the arrow) and the nock (what clips onto your string). Arrows are also measured by draw length: if you have an arrow that's too short for your draw length, there's not as much force generated behind the arrow and things wind up going "off".

Dry-firing: A very bad idea. Seriously, this refers to basically "shooting" without an arrow loaded onto your bow. If a bow is dry-fired, all the energy released from drawing it back travels through the limbs and can result in limbs splitting, exploding or shrapnel flying everywhere. Limbs are also not that cheap: usually around $120 (AUD) for a budget set, through to $800+ for professional ones.

Target shooting: As it says on the tin, you're basically shooting at a target from a certain distance. This is the style done at the Olympics and is one of the more common styles out there. This can be done indoor or outdoor.

Field Shooting: Also known as 3D shooting, this involves traversing a set course with targets set at various distances along the course. 3D shooting is similar, but with wooden "animals" with targets painted on them instead. Archery Australia has used the term "Archery golf" to describe it.

Clout Shooting: I like to think of this one as the archery version of lawn darts. You have a set point (the "clout") that is marked by a flag. One at a time, everyone shoots with the aim of getting their arrow as close to the flag as possible, points are awarded accordingly. The difference between target and clout shooting is that target shooting measures accuracy, clout measures distance mostly. Clout shooting is not as common since you need a large-ass field to shoot from. (The club I plan on joining HAS done clout shoots in the past, but they've done them early in the morning and done them across the width of the field instead of the length like they do in regular shoots)

[Crossbow]

Re: Clout shooting - if you happen to be shooting in the SCA, clout shoots are quite common. The usual method is a central point of some sort (frequently a cuutout of a knight or some such) set at a distance of 100 yards, with a (typically) 10 yard radius rnig to simulate the top of a castle tower. Goal is to get the arrow into the ring, and ideally into the knight.

This is a shoot where you definitely want to make sure there's lots of space behind the target area. I usually shoot a 36lb draw at 29 inches, and I can routinely put an arrow 150 yards downrange. With my crossbow, it's closer to 250 yards. And I don't have an insanely heavy crossbow.

[Jester]

Having a bow with too short or big a draw length can result in poor technique and frustration.

And this whole time I thought my frustration was from lack of sex!

Target shooting:
Field Shooting:
Clout Shooting:

What? No hunting?

Archery Australia has used the term "Archery golf" to describe it.

Nothing like bicycle golf!

[wolfie]

Recurve: These look like your "typical" archery bow and is the only style permitted at the Olympics. Most recurve bows nowadays come in three parts minimum: the riser and the limbs.

The term "recurve" comes from the fact that a line drawn from one tip to the other will fall on one side of the bow when unstrung and on the other side when strung (as opposed to a stick bow which is either straight when unstrung, or bends the same way in both states (but less when unstrung, obviously). The traditional English longbow was a stick bow.

Would a stick bow be permitted at the Olympics? If it were, I doubt if anyone would use one, since a recurve gives more power and better accuracy for the same draw weight.