Class Advise

[Mytical]

I am afraid the advice I am seeking will also sound like bragging...

My question is .. should I retake one class. Before explaining, some background info has to be noted.

1) I get absolutely no concessions from my job, ie no flexibility in days I work, hours I work or anything. I have to work my classes around the job.

2) If I retake the class, it will be at the end of my degree, after I graduate. It will be completely out of pocket..as I am going to go after my BA and do not want to use federal aid/etc.

Ok .. now here it is. Since going back to college, I have done pretty good. I am sitting on a over all GPA, as is, of 3.444444 (etc) for three quarters. However, my OCD is going nuts over a single C. If I retake it and bump it to an A, my overall gpa would be a 3.7 (ish). So it wouldn't change much. I also realize that employers are not going to care about that lone C...but I honestly need help deciding. Retake the class...out of pocket..or just let it go?

[shadowpanda]

What would you lose by re-taking the class? I know there is a financial element, but doing something whilst you have the motivation and (some) time to do it is important. Why not go for it? What's the worst that could happen? (I'm actually asking here, not just being rhetorical, could you lose your job due to time priorities, shifts changing etc?)

[Treasure]

Talk to the Dean of the department - find out if there would be a way to "test or clep" for the class, explain that you've taken the class previously, you want to bump that C to an A for your own peace of mind - the Dean may then be able to provide you with options.

Also it depends on why you got the C - did you just do poorly on tests; was the professor a super-hard-ass; were you otherwise distracted that homework wasn't done/turned in.. etc.

If you still have the work from the class take it with you when you meet with the Dean...

also - what is the worst that happens if you DON'T retake the class? and like you said most employers won't be bothered by 1 C, (we all have that one class we wish we had done better in) also most don't look at your transcript, just the GPA/degree.....with the class as it stands do you still graduate "with honors" or higher? - If not is it that important to go back and change it expo-facto?

[trailerparkmedic]

If you have the money and the time, go for it. If money or time makes taking the class a stretch, think through who cares about your GPA and what they expect it to be.

As a nursing student, I know that grad school cares about my GPA. I know that if I apply for one of the very competitive internships in the area, my GPA will be considered. At no other point in my career will my GPA be important. I also know that my GPA for this semester, while lower than I want, will be high enough for both situations, so I'm living with an expected C. Theoretically I could retake the course, but it would be a lot of money and stress and that doesn't make sense for me when I can still reach my goals with the current grade.

[Mytical]

Treasure - It was the first math class I had taken in 15 years, and the instructor when asked why something was done some way would answer "Because that is the way it is done." I went on to a higher math class and aced it.

[K'Z'K]

Taking a class over does not eliminate the original grade from your transcript, and I've never heard of a school which would replace a C in GPA calculations for any reason or give credit for retaking a course you already passed (some schools have a grade-replacement policy for Fs). And even if any of those things were possible, it'd have to be while still a student, not post-graduation. You can't change the past.

In other words, there's no such thing as "bumping up" a grade. You got a C. Retaking the course will not change that. Once the semester is over, your grade is your grade. It's a reflection of how you did in that course, not how you could do at some point afterward. Your GPA is 3.44. Deal.

Definitely don't bug the prof and/or dean. They'll laugh at you, if only behind your back. You'd come off as a whiny grade-grubber--after the fact, which is even worse than doing it while it's still possible to change things.

I was going to suggest auditing the course in the future if you feel you didn't learn the material the first time around, but then I reread and saw that you've aced more advanced classes. So get over it and move on. No one will care that you got a mediocre grade in a low-level class (and may even be impressed that you then aced a tougher one, if they bother to even look). No one will care that your GPA could be a bit higher.

I'm in grad school. My undergrad GPA was 3.42 overall, and that included a whole bunch of Cs (including one semester of nothing but Cs). There's even an F on my transcript, though I was able to replace it in calculations with a B-. No one cares. My GPA and GREs met the requirements, and from there it was based on the interview.

Employers really don't give a shit. I've never known of one that asks for GPA, and I'd be rather surprised if there were any that actually looked at transcripts. Generally, if they require a degree, the fact that you earned one is enough. It's like the old joke: what do you call the person at the bottom of their medical school class? Doctor.

And really, would you want to wok for someone who'd be so intolerant of minor imperfection?

Of course, if you want to spend the time, effort, and money to prove to yourself that you can now do well in that course (since apparently doing well in a more advanced one isn't enough) then go for it. Just know that doing so won't affect anything.

[Taboo]

Taking a class over does not eliminate the original grade from your transcript, and I've never heard of a school which would replace a C in GPA calculations for any reason or give credit for retaking a course you already passed (some schools have a grade-replacement policy for Fs). And even if any of those things were possible, it'd have to be while still a student, not post-graduation. You can't change the past.

I'm pretty sure this varies by school, but that should be asked. I think a few schools will put both grades on the transcripts though I don't know if they will adjust the GPA.

My school doesn't let you retake things unless you had a C or lower, but for C's they will replace with the new grade-- I think that's only because you need minimally a C+ to be eligible for any classes that require that one as a prereq, whereas you need only a C to pass if you are not doing followups. Therefore C = fail for those purposes. I don't think this will apply in your case though.

Honestly though, if you've since passed a higher level class, you've already proved yourself. There's really no reason to go through the hassle of paying for and spending time in that class again, especially if you do it after you graduate because that would be auditing, not replacing, and wouldn't even go on a transcript.

[Seshat]

Before going to the effort, make sure it will be replaced. As many have said - it probably won't be. If it won't be, your OCD won't be satisfied anyway.

The fact that you can now pass - well! - more advanced courses means you've learned the material. So there's no advantage in terms of learning anything.

[Mytical]

Good advice. I will absolutely check to see if the grade would be replaced or not. It was 15 years ago and a different college, but the last college I went to replaced the grade regardless. IE if your first time was a B and you got an A second time around, they would only factor in the A for the GPA.

[K'Z'K]

Good advice. I will absolutely check to see if the grade would be replaced or not. It was 15 years ago and a different college, but the last college I went to replaced the grade regardless. IE if your first time was a B and you got an A second time around, they would only factor in the A for the GPA.

15 years ago? Another school? Some schools do allow students to take a course with them to replace an equivalent at a previous school, but most don't. Even the few that do would be highly unlikely to have a policy going back that far (many are new) or bother with anything that old or after graduation. Your last school's policy was asinine, and thankfully rare if not unique.

I get the OCD thing (I'm quite capable of obsession myself), but this is a bit much. Try to do like me--be proud of having imperfections. Be proud that you have a 3.44 even with that pesky C. Hell, I practically brag about failing Organic Chemistry.

Besides, your math is off. A single C cannot affect your GPA that much by the time you graduate.

You say you have a 3.444, and that raising that C to an A would get you to a 3.7. If my (literally) back-of-the-envelope calculation is correct, that would mean you only have only 32 credit-hours. If you have more, then your math is wrong. And at any rate, the effect of one anomaly gets smaller with more credit-hours, and how close your other grades are to that anomaly--a C won't affect an otherwise 3.00GPA as much as an otherwise-4.00.

(Step-by-step for anyone who doesn't know how this is done. And yes, it's stupid that we turn numerical test results into letter grades and back into numbers.):

A typical Bachelor's program requires 120 credit-hours. A typical math course earns 3 credit-hours.

For each course, the number of credit-hours is multiplied by a number corresponding to the letter grade:
A = 4.000
A-= 3.667
B+ = 3.333
B = 3.000
C+ = 2.667
C = 2.000
and so on.

So an A in a 3-credit-hour course earns 12 points, while this horrible C earns 6.

GPA is calculated by adding all those points and dividing by credit-hours.

If you have straight As, you'd have 120 * 4 = 480 grade-points by graduation, which is a GPA of 4.00. 440 grade-points in 120 hours is a GPA of 3.667.

Let's say you maintain your current GPA. At graduation, you'd have 3.444 * 120 = 412.8 (approximately) grade-points. Had you gotten an A rather than a C, you'd have 412.8 + 6 (the difference between a C and an A) = 418.8 grade-points, for a GPA of 418.8/120 = 3.490. A difference, but not a big one.

But wait. You're on quarters. That means instead of 120 credit-hours, you're looking at 180. The math is the same, but each class matters less.

So...3.444 * 180 = about 620 points.
620 + 6 = 626
626/180 = 3.478

Even if you had otherwise straight As...
180 * 4.00 = 720
720-6=714
714/180=3.967

or for semesters...
120*4 = 480
480-6=472
472/120=3.93

A single C would "ruin" a 4.0 by thirty-three thousandths of a point on a quarter system and seventy thousandths for semesters. Unless you're like the person I knew in undergrad, who lost his scholarship by a thousandth of a point, it doesn't mean anything. [His scholarship required a 3.25 or better. He fell below that, and had one quarter probation to bring it back up. At the end of probation, he had a 3.249 and lost the scholarship.]

[And thus ends the demonstration of MY OCD, since I actually did the math to make my point, and even now am considering double-checking it or fixing my significant figures. I will refrain, since I know I'm in the ballpark and this is just a forum post .]

tl;dr?

That C may be bugging you, but it has the significance of having failed a spelling test when you were 10. Yeah, it sucked, but it's time to move on.

On the plus side, doing math has made me want to actually work on my game theory project .

-K'Z'K

[Mytical]

Right now I actually have a little less then 32..at the current college. I have to go part time since my job gives me ZERO flexibility. Can't afford not to work . The transfer credits don't have an official 'grade' so do not apply to my GPA. 49 Credits transferred. It's a good thing though, cause in my previous attempt I was more about the .. college experience then the classes. ((Ie I played more then studied)) While I did 'fair' in the classes, I am absolutely appalled now by the grades. Despite the current number of credits, and the number that transferred I have 43 credit hours to go.

So despite having 49 credits transfer, it will still take me over two years . Believe me if somebody offered to pay all my bills while I went to college (and until I found a decent job) I'd go full time. .