Decisions to make, and I don't know which one is best

[kansasgal]

Background: My husband and I have been married for almost 30 years. He has a variety of illnesses, including cancer (skin), PTSD, Depression, etc. Literally has over 20 diseases and takes multitude of pills a day.

We have a son who is 14 and one who is 27 and married. Everyone lives with us because of the economy, oldest son works but wife is disabled by depression, fibromyalgia and chrone's. Youngest son also has problems, including depression, ezcema, gerd and asthma. Youngest son came out to me recently that he is bisexual if not out and out gay. At the time I found I was pregnant with youngest son, hubby wanted me to get an abortion, and I refused. End background.

My husband has been increasingly obnoxious lately to my youngest son. He made the statement (in front of son) that "We should have done what I wanted 15 years ago" and I told him that this statement was way out of line and that I was extremely upset. He is also very upset that son might be gay (I understand this, but still expect him to be civil).

It has come to the point where I feel I cannot forgive him for the above statement, and have seriously been thinking about leaving him. I don't want to throw my marriage away, but I feel that I need to protect my son from these things, and that hubby is not going to change.

If I leave, I will have to quit school (three semesters short of my BS) and move back to Oregon, and possibly move the rest of the family there (except for hubby) as well. This will cost a LOT of money, and I don't have it right now, plus I will need to find a job and all of the money to support my kid.

Any advice? I am at the end of my rope here and don't know which way to turn.

[Kheldarson]

First, I'm sorry all of this is happening to you.

Second, I'd highly recommend going to talk to someone in a counseling role. I'm sure your school has free counseling for students, or might know somewhere that provides a service. Otherwise, try your church or any local church. Try to take your husband with you if you find a counselor you like. See if you can work it out.

If you can't, how important is the BS? Would getting it make life easier? Make it better to move back to OR? If so, can you pick up more classes to shorten the number of semesters you have to finish? If you can't do that, could you deal with staying with him for another year and a half and save money to make the move easier? These are questions you should consider.

[Gerrinson]

I'm also sorry you have to deal with this, and I second all that Kheldarson has to say.

While you're afraid your husband might not change, the possibility exists. It won't necessarily be easy, but it can happen. If you aren't familiar with the epic ups & downs that Kara has gone through in the past year, I would highly suggest you browse through her posts about coming out and dealing with her family.

Lastly, and you may have alread done this, but you need to be clear with your husband exactly how you feel and how his actions and attitude are effecting you. Irreconcilable differences don't become irreconcilable overnight unless you allow them to do so. If you do tell him what he stands to lose, which is basically everything he should hold dear, then if does come down to leaving you will know you've done everything you could to bring him around.

[Seshat]

There should be a GLBT (gay lesbian bisexual trans-) or GLBTI (add intersex) group somewhere near you. There is also likely to be a friends-and-family group.

I strongly, strongly recommend your bi/gay son and you yourself go to these groups and meet some of the people. Ideally, this will be a cluster of good, supportive folks. (However, the GLBTI community is like any other: some good people, some bad, most middling.)

If they are, you'll have a local resource of actual flesh-and-blood gay and bi people to help you figure things out. You can also introduce your husband to gay and bi people, and he can find out firsthand that they (we) don't spit venom, have horns, or eat babies. (If you prick me, do I not .. leak?)

[kansasgal]

Thanks guys. I have spoken with his counselor (he is in counseling at the VA for the PTSD) and she is trying to work with him, but he refuses to admit he has done anything wrong.

I am in counseling, as is my son, and both counselors say that I have taken the right moves, as I have told him exactly how I feel about this episode and how it has affected me/our marriage.

I may have to wait until I graduate, as the BS will allow me to get a job that will help me to make ends meet, and until then I don't have the credentials, as I have worked in customer service all of my life either as a call center rep or manager.

As to the GLBT group, I have already contacted one, and that is the least of my worries. My son knows that I support his decisions/lifestyle, and that no matter what, I will back him up. If hubby doesn't support/understand/like his lifestyle, he understands. (Btw..when me son came out to me, I called one of my gay friends to make sure I gave him the right advice. Gay friend (Eric) was laughing and said it was the weirdest call he ever had..advising a mom on how to help a child come out, lol. I did get some good advice from him though)

My main problem is that hubby is getting worse and worse. We actually had to make him have a vacation with Haldol and Ativan earlier this year at the VA hospital as he had gone over the top, and I am afraid it will happen again as he is getting into that mode. I married him knowing the issues, but as he gets (there is no nice way of saying this) nuttier, it has become a bigger issue. I don't care if he yells or whatever (no physical violence in the whatever btw) at me, but don't mess with my kids!

[Seshat]

*sigh*

My wife is crazy. Schizoaffective disorder. Her bad episodes can be very hard to live with. You have my sympathy and understanding: but honestly? Until she got the right meds, she was literally unable to understand some of what she was doing that was hard for us to live with.

When she and her psychiatrist did get the right med combo, it was like a light switched on and 'all that counselling stuff' finally made sense to her.

I have no idea if this is what's happening inside your husband's head. It might be, it might not be. But .. well. Sympathy and hugs?

[kansasgal]

Thanks for the sympathy Seshat..I can relate to yours as well. Hubby finally went over the edge when he decided he was going to run for President and get rid of Congress and the Senate and bring his biker friends to run the country...it was an interesting time.

He is on meds, and was doing well, but now has developed additional issues, including possible bi-polar issues as well as a possible schizo issue, and they are trying to figure the whole thing out.

Sorry about the rant, btw, I was just venting and at the end of my rope. I am SOOOO tired of dealing with this, and have no one to talk to here really other then my kids, and I don't want to bring them further into it.

[kpzra]

Talk to his VA councilor, he may need to be admitted to get his meds right, and for in-depth help. My husband has done 2 stints at VA facilities for PTSD. He said they had people there who had other issues as well, and they could change meds up until they were stable and "better".

He sounds like he's at the "doesn't give a shit point". Him getting away from everyone/thing for a bit may help him.

[Seshat]

Sorry about the rant, btw, I was just venting and at the end of my rope. I am SOOOO tired of dealing with this, and have no one to talk to here really other then my kids, and I don't want to bring them further into it.

It's fine. We have a few people here who understand what you and I go through, from the POV of having been there.

[Der Cute]

Dayyyymn.
That's a hell of a mess if I've ever seen one.
I'd like to add my 2 cents. Have his doctors fine-comb the medications and see if the cocktail adds to his odd behavior. It can, trust me.
Another thought: when people have serious mental issues (like moi, for example), the less it's treated and controlled, the stronger the breakthroughs get. I know that my bi-polar got faster and stronger until it was really treated this year. I have also heard that when people have schizophrenia disorders, episodes of un-treated or mis-treated behavior can "pave" a way for the next ones to be stronger. Seizures do this too.

His comment was not very nice- it's damn hurtful and mean. But is it CORE him or Odd Behavior or Drug Cocktail him? So many variables.
No matter what, I wish you speed and good luck to solving this - or figuring out who's what's where.

[houdini]

You have my sympathy and hope - I have never had to deal with a situation like yours, and it can't be easy!

My two cents - if your BS will help you in the future, stick it out until that's done (proviso: as long as nothing gets worse and you're still coping). It's worth having if it will give you and your son a better chance, and it is something that would be yours.

[kansasgal]

Dayyyymn.
That's a hell of a mess if I've ever seen one.
I'd like to add my 2 cents. Have his doctors fine-comb the medications and see if the cocktail adds to his odd behavior. It can, trust me.
Another thought: when people have serious mental issues (like moi, for example), the less it's treated and controlled, the stronger the breakthroughs get. I know that my bi-polar got faster and stronger until it was really treated this year. I have also heard that when people have schizophrenia disorders, episodes of un-treated or mis-treated behavior can "pave" a way for the next ones to be stronger. Seizures do this too.

His comment was not very nice- it's damn hurtful and mean. But is it CORE him or Odd Behavior or Drug Cocktail him? So many variables.
No matter what, I wish you speed and good luck to solving this - or figuring out who's what's where.

Unfortunately, it was CORE him. His meds actually made him better, as has counseling, until now. The bi-polar thing was not recognized until this last June, as the first major episodes involved him cleaning my house and rearranging furniture, and, well, I was actually okay with that. You know, you can act weird, but if the housework is getting done...okay.

This last one was when we recognized he was bi-polar and he started getting treatment, but the majority of the problems have been because he now doesn't trust me as I had him committed, so now he wants to make it as hard on me as possible while still looking like the good boy. Fortunately, his counselor and I talk a lot, and she knows what is going on. She is going to try to get him to see the problem, but we may have to re-admit him soon if things don't change.

While it has not gotten to physical violence, verbal abuse is just as bad, especially for my son. I have told him to stop, and his counselor has told him to stop, but I have not seen much improvement yet. I worry, because I had severe self-esteem problems (still do sometimes) because of verbal abuse, and I don't want my son going through this.

[shadowpanda]

Holy shit this sounds tricky.
I don't want to sound like I am devaluing the years you have had together, but if somebody fundamentally disagrees with the sexuality of his children and cannot accept/embrace it (or keep civil) and distrusts you for something you did (I'm assuming) for his benefit and safety, can you continue your relationship?
If hubbys unhappiness re: youngest son will never change, maybe space from the environment will be for the best. Maybe your son could stay with another family member. I have only suggested that because it could me he is somewhere safe whilst you figure out the other stuff that is going on.
It is never too late to try and take charge of your life, be that moving away or trying to make your husband understand that his behaviour is unacceptable.
I don't know if what I said has been helpful, but you have friends here willing to listen and talk things through with you

[ShadowBall]

Sorry to hear you're having such a rough time with...well...everything. I don't see your husband's attitude toward your son changing - since he most likely views your son as some kind of "defective mistake" for not only being born against his wishes, but then coming out of the closet. For the insecure guys who feel their masculinity is defined by their children being planned males who become grunting beer-guzzling hetero guys, this is like a kick in both balls in his mind.

Doesn't make his behavior or attitude right or justified, but basically I really really do not see an improvement on the horizon in the near future when he's getting worse and not better (especially with professional help).

And yes, verbal abuse can be just as harmful as physical - just because it doesn't leave any scars or bruises doesn't mean it doesn't hurt. Personally I've been mindfucked by my mother my whole life and it has ruined me as a person, and I'd never wish it on anyone whom I didn't hate.

Best of luck with school too - I can't imagine it will be very easy dealing with all the necessary graduation nonsense on top of the stuff at home.

[Kara]

One of the things my mother asked me after I came out to her as transgender was, "What would you do if Holly told you she was a boy? Or Hayden or Zane said they were a girl?" I said, "Do you HONESTLY think that I wouldn't understand? Yes, of course, it would be unexpected. But I love my children, they are my world. And I will support them no matter what. Because that's what parents do." She then asked me what I would do if one of the kids were transgender and I wasn't (hypothetically). I said that wouldn't make any difference at all to me, because I am not a judgmental person, I have known many wonderful people who just happened to be gay, lesbian, bi, and/or transgender and I have nothing against them. And once again, I love my children more than life itself and that wouldn't change a thing. No matter what your husband says or does, kudos to you for standing up for your son. I wish one of my parents would support me the way you do.

That being said, I understand your husband has a reason for acting the way he does, regardless of whether or not his treatment of your son is part of that or something else. But a reason for doing something is not an excuse, it's not a free pass. I know many of the reasons my ex put me through emotional hell for 3 years. Doesn't make it hurt any less. Doesn't make the memories any less bitter.

I'm not advocating divorce, I refuse to believe anyone is hopeless (yes, even my ex could, and should, try for a little redemption), so if you give him some time and he truly applies himself, he could come around. Coming out is a process and for many parents it's like grieving (in the case of a gay/lesbian/bi child, it's more of a death of a parent's expectations than of the child's identity). My parents both went into denial and stayed there. Sounds like your husband may be stuck in anger. However, there is no reason at all why you should have to tolerate or excuse his behavior and actions while you wait around for him to pull his head out. He's seeing a counselor, you've made your stance clear to him. An ultimatum may be in order. Worst case scenario, separations are cheaper than divorces and much easier, and faster, to have done. And in a separation, it leaves the door open for reconciliation.

*hugs* to you and your son for having to struggle like this.