Got in Trouble 2 days ago at work (aspie conversing with a latino girl)

[HALFHUMANHALFZOMBIE]

Well I was asking a girl at workout who was latino and doesn't speak really good english and afterwards she told me she wasn
t interested. the next day I was just making conversation with her and she was giving me one word responses and I guess she got tired of me and told the CSM about me. I went to the office and the manager told me that a cashier was getting annoyed with me and saying that i was acting too friendly towards her, he then told me to ease off. Strange how I always would talk to girls that I like and has never been ratted on except this one time.

[Ree]

What does your "aspie" and her nationality have to do with anything?

I am assuming the aspect of Asperger's where the person doesn't recognize nonverbal cues in others or has poorly developed social skills, is coming into play here.

You asked a girl out, and she declined.
You continued to chat her up, obviously, and it bothered her.

If you are a true 'aspie' and not another of the numerous self-diagnosed 'aspies', then perhaps you didn't recognize that you were boring her, or that you made a comment that she found upsetting or offensive.

"People with AS may find themselves socially isolated, although unlike those with autism, they are not usually withdrawn around others; they approach others, even if awkwardly, for example by engaging in a one-sided, long-winded speech about an unusual topic while being insensitive to or unaware of the other person’s feelings or reactions, such as signs of boredom or wanting to leave. This failure to interpret the context of, or react appropriately to social interaction may appear as disregard for other people's feelings, and may come across as highly insensitive."

Were you asking her out and conversing with her during your break, or was it on store time?
There's a big difference.

Perhaps that is why, this time, you got "ratted out".

Possibly, before, the girls just didn't bother.

[blas]

Maybe the language barrier had a play in it. Maybe she thought you were propositioning her?

Anything is possible.

Maybe she just thought it was weird that someone who had already been rejected by her was still talking to her. I know I get weirded out when I tell a guy "no" and he still comes up to me and tries to initiate conversations. I've had experiences where a guy gets the wrong idea and thinks I'm playing hard to get and will continue to ask me out time and time again, and I will say no over and over again.

Who knows?

[Seshat]

the next day I was just making conversation with her and she was giving me one word responses and I guess she got tired of me and told the CSM about me.
<snip>
Strange how I always would talk to girls that I like and has never been ratted on except this one time.

Curt, short responses are often indicators that a person isn't interested or is busy.

If you're Aspie, you need to replace the instinctive knowledge of social indicators with an intellectualised knowledge. You will have to study people, and study social indicators, and learn to react based on what you see.

With people you're close to, who know you're aspie and are happy to help you, you can specifically ask: get someone like that to watch a DVD that's heavy on social interaction with you, and keep pausing it and asking 'why did he do this?' 'why did she do that?' 'what do the tones of their voice mean?'
(Make sure they know that's the point of this particular exercise, rather than to enjoy the show!)

The reason she got upset with you, by the way, is not that you were making conversation. It's that you were continuing conversation after she'd signalled disinterest.

You've seen cats playing, I'm sure. A cat with her ears forward is eager and happy to play, and in a mood to play. She lets a kitten pounce her, and bats back happily.
But then after a while she wants to stop playing, so she puts her ears back and crouches in a particular way. The kitten she's playing with doesn't catch the signal, and keeps trying to pounce the older cat, so the older cat hisses and swats.
However, if another adult cat was playing, the adult cat would catch the signal, and wander off to do something else.

You were the kitten, in this circumstance. You missed the signals.

Do you understand better, now?

[Horsetuna]

That description of aspergers' sounds a lot like me. I will talk and talk about a subject, and not realize if I am annoying or upsetting others..

[Ree]

That description of aspergers' sounds a lot like me.

Well, I'm sure there's much more involved in a legitimate diagnosis.

That's only a small part of it.

Asperger's is actually not as common as it seems. It occurs in only 0.024% to 0.36% of children, and males are 6-8% more likely to have it than females.

[TNT]

Well, I'm sure there's much more involved in a legitimate diagnosis.

That's only a small part of it.

Asperger's is actually not as common as it seems. It occurs in only 0.024% to 0.36% of children, and males are 6-8% more likely to have it than females.

I'm not an expert on Asperger's, but I when I was worked in human services, one of my clients was duly diagnosed with it by one of the few psychiatrists I trusted.

Granted, the H-man may have been at the extreme end... but anyone who met him will never quite forget the experience. Trust me: it wasn't a matter of, "hmmm... that guy's a bit on the odd side."

[HALFHUMANHALFZOMBIE]

What does your "aspie" and her nationality have to do with anything?

It's just me observing myself being socially clumsy with someone who doesn't know english too well. Just the interaction with her and me makes very little understanding amongst each other.

[JustADude]

That description of aspergers' sounds a lot like me. I will talk and talk about a subject, and not realize if I am annoying or upsetting others..

If I still had access to Mom's copy of the DSM-4 I'd give it to you straight from the pages, but here's a link (LINKY) to the OASIS website listing the criteria, along with a "practical" description of AS.

The really odd thing I noticed when looking it up is that I pretty much seem to fit the criteria. It's actually a bit of a relief to have a possible explanation to why I've always felt like I was on a different page than everyone else to the point I've started triple-checking myself before I open my mouth socially... face-to-face at least. We're all weird enough around here I don't feel that same need to "filter".

[Ree]

Thanks for the link, but I strongly caution against anyone self-diagnosing, based on reading an internet site.

If you feel you fit the label, then seek professional help for a confirmation.

[Rapscallion]

We get self-diagnosed people at work all the time. We've had to take a stance of "If the doctor or someone they referred you to hasn't made the diagnosis, we cannot offer any assistance."

One woman claimed that a questionnaire she'd filled in in the back of a magazine proved beyond all doubt that she was coeliac. The reason for her call? We'd started added gluten to oatbran. We'd only added a warning label to alert people to the fact that oatbran contains gluten - always has and always will, and she'd been eating it for years - but she was adamant that she could have been killed because we added it.

I don't trust self-diagnosis. I pretty much self-diagnosed myself as lactose intolerant - along with a doctor who was suspicious it could have been that - a year or so back. I'm not convinced any more and have had a proper blood test taken that should prove it either way (results to follow). I'm now very cautious to point out that it's suspected, but unlikely.

If you think you have a condition, get a professional medical diagnosis.

Rapscallion

[Seshat]

The really odd thing I noticed when looking it up is that I pretty much seem to fit the criteria. It's actually a bit of a relief to have a possible explanation to why I've always felt like I was on a different page than everyone else to the point I've started triple-checking myself before I open my mouth socially... face-to-face at least. We're all weird enough around here I don't feel that same need to "filter".

The exercise I mentioned is one I did for myself, and continue to do on an ad hoc basis. I don't know if I'm Aspie, and don't particularly care (except in that it might give me access to additional help, if I do get the label). What I do know is that I have to concentrate in social situations, and have to try to intellectually determine things that it seems most people can determine on a less intellectual level.

There's a pair of general rules here that I think apply:

1. If other people react to you in ways you don't want, then there are two possible solutions: everyone else needs to change, or you need to change. It's a lot easier to change yourself, so do so.
(Or accept that they'll continue to react in a way you don't like - and never complain about it, because it's your choice not to change.)

2. A diagnosis puts a label on you. This label is for the purpose of deciding how to improve your quality of life: it tells other medical people to try the techniques and tools that have worked on other people with your diagnosis. It also tells you where to go for help, and which books to read to learn how other people have coped with your diagnosis.
A diagnosis is not an excuse. It's a tool to use to work your way around the problems you have. Sure, in some cases it's impossible to get through life without some sort of assistance - a lower-limb paraplegic can't climb stairs, for instance - but where possible, the person with the diagnosis needs to try to work with what they've been given.

In this particular case, it doesn't help anyone for you to say 'oh, I can't deal with social situations, I'm Aspie'. It certainly doesn't help you!

It's a lot more helpful to say 'oh, I can't deal instinctively with social situations, so I'll apply my Aspie ability to learn and focus on things to studying social interaction, until I can replace the instincts I'm lacking with intellectualised knowledge'.


I may or may not be Aspie - never been diagnosed, see no need for that particular label. I have enough of them! But I do have some sort of social handicap, disability, whatever. I invented my own exercises to intellectualise social signals. I solved the problem. I recommend that the OP (and others with similar problems) does so, too.


~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
Edit to add sample exercises:

A) Watch a social show with a friend, as described earlier in the thread.
B) Watch nature documentaries, especially primate ones, especially the sort where someone's explaining the interactions. 'Monkey Business' and 'Meerkat Manor' (both Animal Planet) are good examples. Pay particular attention to the body language and sounds the animals use to communicate.
C) Watch human interactions. Sit in a shopping mall and people-watch, trying to guess at what's going on between individuals in a group. Try not to be creepy about it - never watch any one group for more than a minute or so.
D) Watch shows like Judge Judy, or even Jerry Springer. The interactions in these shows are more extreme than you'll normally see, but it's helpful to see the extremes at times.
E) Hit your local library, or preferably your state library or a university or college library that will let non-students read their stuff. Read first-year-college-level psychology, sociology and anthropology texts. Primate communication texts are also helpful, especially chimpanzee and bonobo studies.

[TNT]

It's important to remember that the DSM leans towards extremes -- phrases like "marked impairment," "clinically significant," "encompassing preoccupation" have serious implications when it comes to separating the normal range of human behaviors from the pathological.

And even extremes are not necessarily pathological. There is nothing wrong with keeping a super-clean house. There is very much wrong when keeping the house clean interferes with the rest of one's life -- say, when the slightest bit of disorder consumes a person's life until it's cleaned up.

This is a true story: I knew a guy who mowed his lawn with a riding mower. After the lawn was mowed, he washed and waxed the mower -- even the parts no one could see -- until it looked brand new. Okay... that's extreme, and maybe even a little flighty, but not particularly disordered. However... he absolutely couldn't function until the job was done. If he had plans that night and the cleaning was taking too long, the plans would get canceled. He had no ability to say, "I'll go and enjoy myself, and take care of the mower later tonight or even tomorrow." That's pathological.

There's a very large difference between "being shy" or "socially inept" and having Asperger's.

[Ree]

There's a very large difference between "being shy" or "socially inept" and having Asperger's.

Exactly!!!

[thegiraffe]

Asperger's is actually not as common as it seems. It occurs in only 0.024% to 0.36% of children, and males are 6-8% more likely to have it than females.

I'm not sure if that figure is accurate anymore. Disorders on the Autistic spectrum (Asperger's being one of them) have absolutely skyrocketed - almost to the point where it's being called an epidemic in psychological/psychiatric circles. Case in point: I teach elementary school. We have fewer than 500 kids in our school (about 460 or so). Of those 500, we have:

• Two Pre-K classes - one is Autistic, and one is VE (varying exceptionalities - there are a few kids in there on the spectrum also)
• K-5 autistic class that has 10 or so kids in it (mainly boys)
• A separate pull-out VE teacher for K-5 that has a couple kids in it on the spectrum
• A primary ED (emotionally disabled) and a secondary ED class - both with kids on the spectrum in it
• AND several mainstreamed autistic kids.

Oh yeah, and we only have a handful of kids (fewer than 10) that are bussed across zoning lines to come to our school. Also, all of these "spectrum" cases are diagnosed, not merely suspected.

Autism and AS are becoming MUCH more common. I just wish they could figure out which genes cause it and figure out how to somehow work with it.