The talking service has terrible service!

[Little Retail Rabbit]

Well....about 6 weeks ago I finally decided my anxiety, stress and depression needed addressing. I've been suffering from depression for well over a decade without professional help so better late than never I suppose. Had several nightmares in a week, and I knew something was wrong, not to mention panic attacks. My doctor was very helpful and took me seriously and had me referred to a talking therapy that is done mostly on the phone- it specialises in people dealing with depression and anxiety. He knows I would like to avoid medication if I can and felt that therapy would be more appropriate.

I had to wait for a certain number of days after seeing him to call them and arrange a time for them to call me and start going over what I need. So I did that. Each time I called them, though, the phone just kept ringing. 3 times I called. The 4th time, someone picked up, coughed into the phone and then hung up! It officially took 5 calls to get to speak to someone.

The following week, I get a call from "K". K tells me she's a trainee and that she'll be working with me. We go through the tests I have to do (and already did with my doctor). Although my scores were lower than they were at the doctor's I still scored enough to be clinically depressed/anxious. I told her that the worst of my anxiety had recently died down due to confronting some anxious situations and I strongly feel that my depression, while linked, is a bigger issue.

We arrange a therapy session (on the phone) for Friday (last week). 2 days after talking to K, I recieve literature from the service in the post- all of it regarding anxiety. I filled out the questionnaire, and while it was interesting to see some of my meek behaviour is actually a sympton of mild anxiety, I felt this stuff was for people with extreme anxiety- not me- and my depression wasn't being addressed at all.

Between the call and Friday last week, I had a mini break down I won't get into. My fiance became more concerned. He said how my doctor believes I suffer from a form of depression similar to manic depression but he (my fiance) has seen this behaviour before, has seen it in me for YEARS and fears I may actually be a manic depressive and I need to bring it up with the therapist as soon as I speak to her, because I really need help in learning to cope with it. I agree.

On the morning of Friday last week, I wake up quite excited about getting stuck into therapy only...there's a voice mail saying my session has been cancelled because my therapist is off sick. Due to conflicting dates and rota schedules, the earliers my next (or rather, my FIRST) session could be rebooked for is Monday next week. I was not happy. I was starting to get a bit concerned, and expressed this to my fiance- I'm concerned that my therapist is not trained to deal with someone like me and is not taking my depression into account.

Today i realise my rota for next week has changed and I needed to call the service again to rearrange. This was actually easy enough...after 5 call attempts. Yes, 5 is the magic number! Each time I called them, it kept ringing and ringing. Now my first session will be on the Tuesday....7 weeks after I went to see my doctor.

I'm getting rather concerned now. Not only my previously mentioned concerns, but this process is taking a LOT longer than I expected to even get going. I knew full well I wouldn't change overnight, but I expected that by now I would have had SOME sessions, not NONE. As my best friend said the other night "Its a good thing you're not suicidal, you could be dead in 7 weeks!" I agree!

My fiance says I should just quit it now and go back to the doctor. I want to go through with it for a couple of months to see if ANYTHING changes; that way I can go back to the Doc and say honestly "Well...I tried!"

[Sapphire Silk]

It's unfortunate it is taking so long for you to get anywhere.

I've never heard of therapy over the phone. How long will the sessions last? How often will you get them? It takes time to build a trusting relationship with your therapist, and she's going to have to get to know you a bit to really dig into the reasons for both your depression and anxiety . . . . both of which are very different in terms of treatment.

May I ask, is there some reason you have to do this over the phone instead of in a therapist's office? I find that it is much easier to learn certain things about a patient with direct contact. For example, she will be unable to evaluate your body language, which might speak volumes.

Please do follow up with this therapy. In your first meeting, tell your therapist what you want to achieve from therapy. Have some goals in mind, then ask her what kind of plan she will make to get you there (she may not have one the first meeting, but should after a couple of sessions). Remember, treatments for depression and anxiety are very different.

If you really are manic depressive, or bi-polar, you will probably need medication. Talk therapy is very helpful, but usually can't treat bi polar disorder on its own.

Anxiety is a different story, it can be successfully treated without medication.

Remember, getting the right therapist is KEY to success. If this one doesn't work out, don't give up on therapy. Find another therapist.

Good luck!

[42_42_42]

Bi-polar disorder (manic depression) runs in my family. My grandfather had it, my uncle has it, and we strongly suspect my sister has it (along with borderline personality disorder). It's caused by an imbalance in brain chemicals (to put it very simply). Much like a diabetic needs insulin injections to replace the insuline her body cannot make naturally, someone with bi-polar disorder needs medication.

Not sure what kind of doctor you went to see, but sounds to me like you need to be under the care of a psychiatrist.

[Seshat]

Remember, getting the right therapist is KEY to success. If this one doesn't work out, don't give up on therapy. Find another therapist.

I've fired therapists before because they were inept and couldn't get their act together. It's hard enough for me to get out anyway: there's no reason for me to go out to a therapy session and find my therapist not there, or double-booked, or otherwise useless.

Do feel free to go back to your doctor, tell him/her exactly what you've told us, and ask for a referral to a different service.

You may benefit from a few visits to a diagnostic psychiatrist. Neither of you will know how many visits you'll need until after he/she has seen you at least once, possibly several times in several different moods.

A diagnostic psychiatrist can determine whether you have one of the mental illnesses which is an anatomical or physiological fault and may need medication (equivalent, as someone else said, to a diabetic needing insulin); or something where talking therapy and coping techniques may be a complete cure.

(I do advocate talking therapy and coping techniques as additional tools for people who need the medications: they help Anna a lot.)

[midnightaurora]

Since you've been having fun with getting in touch with those peoples, I'd make sure to ask your therapist their degree, whether or not they have their license, and what there preferred methods are. Therapists are required to answer those questions, so if yours doesn't, don't continue talking with them. Lack of license doesn't always mean bad, btw - depending on the state, licenses could be as easy as a short test to as difficult as the BAR/CPA exams.

[Eisa]

They sound incompetent, to be honest. There's nothing wrong with getting a referral somewhere else. If you can go through face-to-face sessions, they might be more helpful. I think it's cool that places offer over-the-phone though.

[Sapphire Silk]

Since you've been having fun with getting in touch with those peoples, I'd make sure to ask your therapist their degree, whether or not they have their license, and what there preferred methods are. Therapists are required to answer those questions, so if yours doesn't, don't continue talking with them. Lack of license doesn't always mean bad, btw - depending on the state, licenses could be as easy as a short test to as difficult as the BAR/CPA exams.

Asking about credentials is always a good idea.

With therapists, there is often a period where the therapist has to work so many hours before taking a national test. During this time, they often cannot get a license, and work on the license of another therapist.

Most therapists will have at least a Master's degree. Some will be psychologists, some counselors, and others clinical social workers.

Asking about their preferred methods is a good idea. If you're looking for psychotherapy you may not want a cognitive behavioral therapist.

[dragon_wings]

I've fired therapists before because they were inept and couldn't get their act together. It's hard enough for me to get out anyway: there's no reason for me to go out to a therapy session and find my therapist not there, or double-booked, or otherwise useless.

QFT.
I've had varied results from therapists. One of my first was a complete bitch. My mom and I went to her for a while then she wanted to do a session with my brother and dad as well. That session ended with my dad and brother hating her and my mom and me looking for a new therapist (the therapist was for me but as I was around 14 my mom was involved to a degree).

[Moirae]

Quite honestly, you need to go back to a doctor. What you're trying isn't working, so try something else.

[Little Retail Rabbit]

I was under the impression (although now, trying to recall, cannot remember if my GP explicitly told me this) that this particular service (run by the NHS) is mostly carried out over the phone, but sometimes, later on, you can meet the therapist at the health centre where the GP is. I don't remember exactly; I do remember my GP saying that that particular practice is a litte unusual in how they deal with these sorts of conditions. I think the service is meant to be to get help to people who may otherwise not be able to see a therapist/etc without having to go off into the city. You know, what I'm gonna be honest with you, I flat out don't know. The health centre where my GP is situated is huge and I assumed that there would be a mental health section on site being as there is pre-natal section, a dentists...its huge. I guess the next place is the shit-awful hospital QA and that would be difficult for me to reach regularly and in a timely manner. But yeah, I'm not sure. At first I thought it being on the phone was pretty cool, as it means that I don't have to waste a lot of time on travel trying to get to the sessions, and I can do this in my pyjamas if need be, then get ready for work.

The leaflet I was given says it caters to people with anxiety disorders and depression. The doctor says I have global anxiety and a form of depression that is "similar" to manic depression, but not the same- similar in the sense that it goes through cycles. They are short cycles too...first time I saw my doctor, I was pretty chipper, but the following week I was starting to feel very gloomy again. He said it isn't manic depression/bi-polar, but after the mini break down I had, my fiance is concerned that it maybe more serious. Personally, I didn't think it was as bad as some I've had in the past, but my fiance feels that little has changed in the past few years, coping wise.

I do not want to be on long-term medication. To put into perspective, I suspect I have been this way for almost 15 years, and while I do need help, I think if I were at the point of needing medication, it would have been about 5 years ago. I used to self-harm and have suicidal thoughts, but the latter doesn't really happen now, and the former, well, I get the urge, but I haven't SH in about 2 years now out of sheer will-power (I'm gonna be a bit conceited here, but I give myslf a good ole pat on the back for that!). It has meant my coping mechanisms are all over the place as SH is a (ill-advised) coping mechanism in its own right. As I told my trainee-therapist when I spoke to her a few weeks back, my goal is to just learn how to cope with it. I pretty much accept that I'm probably going to be living with this for life now, and I need to know how to handle it- and that is why I don't want pills. We know full well that my main problem is that I bottle up everything that upsets me, and then it explodes. I could be panicking about something at work, and at the same time, being pissed off by customers/colleagues/family, then my fiance and I may have a tiff, and then suddenly, as far as my irrational mind is concerned, it is the end of the world and everything is on fire. This is why its tied in so much to the anxiety- while they are 2 different problems, they are very much linked.

I can't say the therapy hasn't worked because I haven't even recieved any yet. I am trying to do my own thing right now because I already feel pretty pessimistic about the therapy, given everything so far. I am beginning a down cycle right now, and I knew it was happening around about Friday- basically I'm taking note of my behaviour and feelings and being mindful of it. I was very upset about something last night, but when i spoke about it to my fiance, I remained very rational and calm as I spoke about it. The only good thing that has come so far was reading this questionnare and it turns out some of my "weak" and passive beahaviours are actually linked to anxiety (which backs up that I've been this way for YEARS). For example, i ask people to repeat themselves even if I'm sure I heard them right the first time because I'm worried I'll have misheard them. I didn't know that was a sign of anxiety before, but apparently it is.

[Thuringwethyl]

Frankly, I wasn't able to get anything close to real help until I became suicidal. Then it seemed like everyone was falling over themselves to point me in the right direction. I wish that it was easier to get help before anyone reaches that point.

I'm a lot like you; I've been dealing with depression for years and, after seeing a psychologist and a psychiatrist, have come to realize that I also have anxiety, OCD, am on the bipolar spectrum, and may have silent epilepsy (doing tests to rule the last one out). My issues are genetic (every women on my mother's side has depression) which makes medication a good idea. It's not my fault, you see, my brain just doesn't make enough serotonin.

Note: about a year ago I complained on this site about my boyfriend. Interesting how things work out - he was the one who talked me down when I was ready to go the bad place and stood over me to make sure I called for help. If anyone remembers that thread (surprised if they do) I would say that he really redeemed himself.

[Pairou]

I have Borderline Personality Disorder and was in and out of therapy for years. The latest therapist I was seeing seemed great but nobody seems to want to take it seriously enough to actually do any, you know, useful therapy... and then for various reasons I couldn't get in touch with my T's office to get another appointment so basically I'm ou tof therapy that I probably need.

That being said, it sounds like these phone service people are pretty incompetent. It sounds like you should really tell your GP about it and get a referral for someone in person... it can take a few tries to get someone who can really help but it wouldn't take weeks and weeks to get someone (usually)! If you need help then it's best not to wait. And being given the run-around with anxiety issues can make them worse for a while- it got worse for me!

[Seshat]

As I told my trainee-therapist when I spoke to her a few weeks back, my goal is to just learn how to cope with it. I pretty much accept that I'm probably going to be living with this for life now, and I need to know how to handle it.

Then you probably want one of the techniques such as cognitive behavioural therapy, or (I think) neurolinguistic therapy, or art therapy or ... well, 'or, or, or'. There's quite a range.

DO go back to your doctor and talk to him about seeing someone else. This place seems to be behaving unprofessionally towards you.

In the meantime - and NOT (repeat NOT) as a replacement for seeing your doctor - pop on to http://www.moodgyn.anu.edu.au/ and give CBT (cognitive behavioural therapy) a look. Show the site to your doctor as well: if your doctor approves, you might be able to just use moodgym under your doc's supervision.

Repeat: under supervision. If you've self-harmed and had suicidal thoughts, Moodgym alone is NOT adequate: but it's a full CBT course and MAY be sufficient if you do have your doctor looking over your metaphorical shoulder.

Check with doc.

If you look at Moodgym and it looks 'okayish but not quite right', tell your doctor that, too. And the ways in which it feels 'not quite right'. That might help him direct you to a therapist who knows & uses one of the other 'how to cope' techniques; one that's more suited to your particular personality and life. MoodGym is CBT, there's a ton of others.

[Hyndis]

Frankly, I wasn't able to get anything close to real help until I became suicidal. Then it seemed like everyone was falling over themselves to point me in the right direction. I wish that it was easier to get help before anyone reaches that point.

I've noticed the same thing myself, sadly.


Also I am bipolar. Runs in my family on my mother's side. I do not want to have to take medication for the rest of my life, so I ended up using the medication as something of a crutch --- something to get me through a rough time until I got better. But only tempory.

Knowing what was going on was a huge relief. I was beyond ecstatic to finally get the diagnosis because that meant that I could finally put a name on what was wrong with me. Oddly enough this positively baffled the person I was seeing (and she charged a pretty penny for the appointments), causing her to strongly tell me to not label myself, do not embrace the label, and so forth.

She completely missed the point. I was ecstatic because I now knew what was wrong with me, meaning I also knew what the signs and symptoms were, and so I could fight it.

And fight it I did. Just out of sheer willpower. It was definitely not easy. It was hard to the point where I could barely see straight, could barely even get out of bed, and was puking seemingly every 10 feet. Hardest thing I ever did.

But I beat it. I won. I was able to just force myself through the down portions of being bipolar and to endure it. Intellectually I knew exactly what to expect, I just had to force my emotions into line. They weren't behaving of course, at least not at first.

Sometimes its still a struggle at times, but I think for the most part I've got it taken care of.

Almost 10 years of my life lost to this illness. Wish I had figured it out sooner.

[Little Retail Rabbit]

Update...

(First of all, thank you to everyone's suggestions. Seshat, I will be looking into those links you provided I find that very interesting. Haven't had a chance to see my doctor yet).

So I had my "first" therapy session the week before last. I was told to set aside an hour to speak with K.

It was over in 14 minutes -_-

We discussed a test she wanted me to take, and she added up my scores. Now I am really surprised I scored as high as I did because I answered "zero" for so many of the questions, but it was actually a test for Obsessive Compulsive Disorder. It was called an OCI. I was actually really annoyed when she told me the test was for OCD because I've been referred to her for Global Anxiety and whatever depression (I still can't find out what sort of depression my GP actually said. Tried looking up different kinds. Like I said before, he said it was similar to manic depression due to its high/low cycles, but nowhere near as severe). OCD has never been an issue. I am actually quite a neat freak and I like things lined up neatly, but I'm also a bit of a slob at times. While I enjoy things to be zestfully clean, my bedroom currently is rather overdue for some hoovering and I'm not losing any sleep over it.

Anyway, apparently, you need to score 40 or more (out of what I don't know) to be diagnosed as OCD. I scored 36. Eh, kinda high. Makes sense in a way as I do like things to be clean and orderly. But I don't get UPSET about it.

K then tells me that when someone scores 40 and above and is diagnosed as having OCD she then has to refer them to a face-to-face therapist as the service she works for doesn't deal with OCD. She decides that because I have "quite a few issues" going on, apparently including OCD (um...no, I don't have OCD and I didn't score high enough!), she's going to go ahead and refer me. To be honest I felt like she didn't want to admit that she's not qualified to actually deal with me and just make out I'm crazier than I actually am. Keep in mind she is a trainee.

Problem with the face-to-face therapist, despite it sounded as though they would be far more adept at dealing with me, the waiting list is at LEAST a month. At least.

So by this point, I was already giving up. I had already decided "fuck this. I stopped cutting myself without any help. Fuck them all." I'm sure some of you are thinking thats a bit unhealthy but to be honest I was just feeling like, well, whats the point?

I had a pretty bad "down cycle" last week. Its weird actually, as normally, something bad will happen during my down cycle, that is, something that would normally upset me anyway. I'm a sensitive person as it is. When I'm in a down cycle, if I get upset about something in particular (usually work), or I'm anxious about something, it sets me off into a spectacular doom spiral of crying and hating my life and so on. NOTHING HAPPENED Work has been relatively stress free (shit-stirring bitch is gone). Been getting overtime, so I'm not so broke. Its weird...but it also gave me a chance to see what happens if I'm just left to it. I rode out the cycle really well. I would continuously feel depressed and sad about NOTHING, so I would actively distract myself from my emo-misery (little bit of a dig at myself there, I am a goth, and I know the stereotype XD). I would call my fiance and say "hey hon, I feel really down, talk to me, distract me" and it would be fine. We actually had some lovely conversations. I spent hours on Cracked.com, I watched movies, I did some art. I was very glum but I didn't have Marvin moments ("whats the point?") and by the weekend it was fading away.

So in a way, it strengthened my resolve, that I can do this alone. I was able to watch my own behaviour and see what happens.

Then I get a random call today. Its K again! She claims that she left me a message not too long ago, but we've actually been checking our messages as my mum is expecting one and its important. Oh well. Well she tells me that she had a chat with her supervisor about my case and she said that her supevisor has said not to refer me to the therapist and to work with me as she had intended in the beginning.

Mixed feelings here. On one hand, that means treatment NOW not at some undetermined point in the future. On the other, it means I'm stuck with a kid who doesn't sound experienced enough, and has soooo obviously been told by her supervisor that I don't have OCD (something I could have told her nearly 2 weeks ago).

On a funny note, when told my parents, everytime I mentioned OCD I would pause and line up something on the desk- phone, makeup brush, matches- very neatly. The joke is that if any of us has OCD its my mum, and like me, its not actually a disorder that affects her life. She just has high standards of cleaniliness ^^;;

I'll give it another shot, but it really is the very last chance.