Well I guess they like breathing in dirty air then....

[sld72382]

My dad works at a quick lube place. Of course, he has to offer products and services that customers may need. One of those things is a cabin air filter. It's essential that you get it replaced every 30,000 miles or sooner, especially if it looks dirty before that threshold.

These are the following responses some people gave to my dad when he showed them the DIRTY cabin air filter and advised them it should be replaced:

"No thanks, my car is leased."

"No thanks, I don't use the A/C often enough to replace it." - In our state how could you say this?!

"No thanks, next time...."

"No thanks, it's my wife's/son's/daughter's car I'll let them decide if they want to replace it."

One time my dad showed a man who's cabin air filter was so dirty it turned black. This was part of the conversation when my dad mentioned he should replace it, like, now....

Dad: This is your cabin air filter. You really need to replace it, like, stat....

SC: That's okay, I think I'll pass.

Dad: Didn't you mention in passing to me one time that your son has asthma? That alone is reason enough to replace it.

SC: Giving him his inhaler in the off chance he has an episode in the car is free. That cost extra money. So no.

Dad:

My dad and his CW's couldn't believe that he would say that. Oh, and I believe he said he drove some sort of high-end luxury car. Figures.

Now I know some responses are going to say, "That's because these people know they can get it cheaper by going down to whatever auto store and installing it themselves." Well if that's true, wouldn't these people have done so already?

I also blame those damn consumer "watchdogs" that tell you to decline any extra product or service that the service writers offer you.

[Jay 2K Winger]

"No thanks, I don't use the A/C often enough to replace it." - In our state how could you say this?!

Maybe they're hyper-milers? I know that those fuel economy experts do say that turning on the A/C will reduce your fuel efficiency.

I personally would rather refill my tank sooner than swelter in a hot car, but that's just me.

[Headset Hellion]

SC: Giving him his inhaler in the off chance he has an episode in the car is free. That cost extra money. So no.

Wow...that's just sad.

[AmbrosiaWriter]

That guy obviously doesn't have any idea how asthma really works. It's not just "episodes" that you can then pop an inhaler and VIOLA! No more worries for a while.

It builds up. Driving in a car like that makes his condition worse in all aspects.

He should really know more about the condition his child has.

[Chromatix]

Maybe they're hyper-milers? I know that those fuel economy experts do say that turning on the A/C will reduce your fuel efficiency.

I personally would rather refill my tank sooner than swelter in a hot car, but that's just me.

They do have a point. Unlike simply blowing fresh air into the cabin (whether or not it goes past the heat-exchanger with the engine coolant), air-conditioning systems consume significant amounts of power, which needs to come from somewhere. Pulling numbers out of my backside, suppose it takes 5kW to run the A/C, and 20kW to maintain highway speed. Total is 25kW, so your previous 25mpg just went down to 20mpg. It gets worse in urban driving.

One type of diesel locomotive in Britain (Class 31/4) was modified to provide ETH (electric train heat) in such a way that the ETH power was *permanently* removed from the traction supply, whether or not it was actually in use. As it wasn't a terribly powerful locomotive in the first place, they richly earned their nickname of "Pedestrian". On the upside, they were very well suited for preheating (or pre-cooling, with later stock with air-conditioning in summer) long trains while they shunted them from the depot to the terminus platforms, where the train would be taken over by a much more powerful loco.

Even knowing all that, I'd use the A/C if the weather justified it. I don't live in a region where it would often be needed, mind.

[mhkohne]

I also blame those damn consumer "watchdogs" that tell you to decline any extra product or service that the service writers offer you.

Sadly, the number of quick lube places that try to sell you a load of stuff you don't need is pretty damn large. The problem is that these idiot customers don't take the next step and have a trusted mechanic look at the thing every so often, so that the actual maintenance needs get met.

[malmalthekiller]

And I'll bet those people are the ones that complain about your father and say that he tried to swindle them into "things they don't need."

I go to a quick lube place, and they're great. They bring issues like that to my attention that I would have no idea about, and they aren't pushy.

I hate people sometimes.

[Ironclad Alibi]

They do have a point. Unlike simply blowing fresh air into the cabin (whether or not it goes past the heat-exchanger with the engine coolant), air-conditioning systems consume significant amounts of power, which needs to come from somewhere. Pulling numbers out of my backside, suppose it takes 5kW to run the A/C, and 20kW to maintain highway speed. Total is 25kW, so your previous 25mpg just went down to 20mpg. It gets worse in urban driving.

There is a factor that is overlooked in this analysis. Driving without A/C, the car windows are open. This increases the drag on the car, causing increased use of gas. I have always heard the two situations result in the same gas usage.

[Jay 2K Winger]

There is a factor that is overlooked in this analysis. Driving without A/C, the car windows are open. This increases the drag on the car, causing increased use of gas. I have always heard the two situations result in the same gas usage.

Correction: Driving without A/C, if you want to cool down, you open the windows, which does indeed increase drag. In that situation, the fuel economy is going to be about equal.

Some hyper-milers, however, don't open the windows, and just broil in their cars in hot weather.

[bainsidhe]

Sadly, the number of quick lube places that try to sell you a load of stuff you don't need is pretty damn large.

So very true. I avoid having my oil changed at one shop because, although it's incredibly convenient and they do it right then, I have to listen to an unending sales pitch on services and things I "really should consider". Funny how they suggested changing the cabin filter when I just had it changed the month before.

[sld72382]

Sadly, the number of quick lube places that try to sell you a load of stuff you don't need is pretty damn large. The problem is that these idiot customers don't take the next step and have a trusted mechanic look at the thing every so often, so that the actual maintenance needs get met.

My dad's last place could actually get you in trouble if you sell stuff the customer doesn't need. His new shop doesn't have the same policy but he believes in being honest with the customer. He would rather keep the final price lower but keep the customer coming back.

[Catwoman2965]

My dad's last place could actually get you in trouble if you sell stuff the customer doesn't need. His new shop doesn't have the same policy but he believes in being honest with the customer. He would rather keep the final price lower but keep the customer coming back.

And not to lump them all together, but many dealerships do the same. My independent mechanic left the one he worked it, after being told he MUST find something wrong with each and every car he looked at.

And I have a friend, who took her late Saturn to the dealer for oil changes, and she never left without spending anywhere from another 300-500 extra on things that "HAD" to be done right then and there. I woudl have made them explain in detail why, and so on. But that too, is why I will never take my car to the dealer, esp since my mechanic is so awesome.

He tells me (at least with my former car, aka the Demon Car) what needed to be done right then and there, what could wait, and also what might be coming down the road "another couple oil changes before you need new brake pads" which of course isn't an exact science, but gave me some idea.

I also have friends (sadly, mainly women like myself) who don't have the first clue about cars and whatnot. I'm no expert, but I do know and have some idea when brakes, tires etc. at leaste need to be checked out. Others, nope. my one friend said oh, i may need brake fluid, i'm getting a warning light. i said well, when did you have them done? oh, i haven't, and the car had 75K on it. Maybe it did or didn't need them, but I would have had them checked well before that. Same thing with her tires. never even had them checked, let alone replaced. And them whines when her car costs a lot to maintain.

[Gerrinson]

Correction: Driving without A/C, if you want to cool down, you open the windows, which does indeed increase drag. In that situation, the fuel economy is going to be about equal.

In my experience, this is not the case at all. The 'extra' drag from opening my windowas had no noticeable effect on my overall gas mileage.

Running the AC knocks an immediate 5 mpg off the fuel efficiency.

Running the heat knocks an immediate 3 mpg off the fuel efficiency.

That's been the case with my last 5 vehicles, which accounts for every car I've owned for the last 20 years.

Also, while I'm too lazy to look up a link to the episode, Mythbusters did a test of this with 2 SUVs of the same type with similar amounts of fuel. The one with windows down drove approx. 50 miles further than the one with AC, if I remember correctly.

[Jay 2K Winger]

In my experience, this is not the case at all. The 'extra' drag from opening my windowas had no noticeable effect on my overall gas mileage.

Running the AC knocks an immediate 5 mpg off the fuel efficiency.

Running the heat knocks an immediate 3 mpg off the fuel efficiency.

That's been the case with my last 5 vehicles, which accounts for every car I've owned for the last 20 years.

Also, while I'm too lazy to look up a link to the episode, Mythbusters did a test of this with 2 SUVs of the same type with similar amounts of fuel. The one with windows down drove approx. 50 miles further than the one with AC, if I remember correctly.

Maybe I'm misremembering, then.

I'll take the hit to my fuel efficiency over suffering heat stroke or freezing to death, all the same.

[Chromatix]

I would accept that a car with the windows all the way down would incur noticeable extra drag. A car with the windows merely cracked open, however, is still quite well ventilated with almost no effect on drag.

As for heat, perhaps some cars have supplemental electric heat now, but every one my dad has driven used only waste heat from the engine. Once, there was something wrong with the cooling system, so we turned up the cabin heat full blast (thus providing extra sources of cooling to the coolant loop) to stop the engine overheating. To stop *us* overheating as a result, we had to wind the windows down. And yes, we did experiment, and every time we turned off the cabin heat, the engine temperature went up alarmingly.