Human Pinata, or How to Be a "Man."

[crazylegs]

Oh for fucks sake.

I just can't form the coherent sentences I want to to convey my total and crushing disapointment thet TD has gone back to this absolute wank stain of humanity, well he's not really humanity he merely has bipedal locomotion, and thats all he shares with his fellow man.



Jester, You've been a fantastic friend to TD, you've put your personal safety on the line, you've put yourself out for her and I whole heatedly agree with you when you say you'll be the shoulder to cry on but you won't be putting yourself in the firing line again.

I personally don't beleive that TD will ever now leave BB, even with the escape network you provided she has still gone back to him, only if he has a nasty accident involving a chainsaw and some alligators will she be free of this shit stain on the face of this earth.

Everyone else,
There are stories of women who leave their abusive spouses, and throw them out, a good friend of mine decided she's had enough when her then partner decided to drink a bottle of scotch, run her over in his car then go speeding around town. He was arrested, lost his licence and his job, as well as K my friend, it does happen but not very often.

Look after yourselves everybody.

[Becks]

Wow.

I've read this thread since the beginning, but haven't commented on it because words can't express the emotions I felt...well, at first anger at BB, of course. Hope for TD. Now I'll just use a quote.

And though I know this might sound cruel, I feel no sorrow or pity for TD going back to BB.

If that makes you cruel, it makes me cruel, too.

[Amethyst Hunter]

This is extremely disappointing to say the least.

I do, however, feel pity for TD. Was this a huge honking mistake? Sure. I still feel pity though. She's only going to get more of the same (if not worse). No woman deserves that. Ever.

[Myra]

Okay not that I feel sorry for TD or side with her, but as others have stated, she's going to have to come to the realization herself that she's in a bad situation. She obviously feels that she's not worthy of being treated better, and no amount of telling her otherwise is going to work until she sees it for herself.

My Mother-in-law was in a horribly abusive relationship before she met and married my wonderful Father-in-law. The ex beat her, called her names, controlled her, and cheated on her. She went to work with a broken nose once. Luckily she worked in a hospital, so she got fixed up. She miscarried several times, and had a baby with a weak heart who died a month or so after birth. These were not related to the abuse, but they didn't help.

What finally gave her the power to leave was one night where he put a gun in her face and held it there for what seemed like eternity. When he finally left to go out "with the boys" she packed her shit and ran like hell. She was raised in a house with an abusive father who targeted her, so for a long time she thought that was normal. She thought men were supposed to be controlling assholes. She finally realized it wasn't that way.

TD is going to have to realize on her own that she deserves better. Like others have said, hopefully her "last straw" isn't death. I do hope that when she comes to this realization, that Jester and others will be there. It does feel like a betrayal that she's done this, but I hope when she reaches out for real, that you guys can forget that and be her support. My MIL had nobody, and was able to do it anyway, but it's certainly easier with help.

Also, I'm sure the reason you're not hearing from her is that he's got firm control of the "situation" right now. He's taken her phone, and I'm certain he's got her contained in his world and she doesn't fart unless he tells her it's okay. If she goes to work, I'll be shocked.

I pray for her safety and she manages to come to her senses before something horrible happens. Or maybe he'll go outside to get the mail and get creamed by a drunk driver or something. One can only hope!

[Shangri-laschild]

That's exactly what TD has done. She's betrayed everyone who stood up for her. In my eyes, she's no longer a victim. She's chosen to destroy herself. For the time being Jester, I think it's best to leave her behind to suffer the consequences of her own actions.

Not trying to start a fight, just trying to add some perspective to it.

While I understand that it can be frustrating to stand up for someone and have them go back to the bad situation, it's harder than you think to get out of that victim mind set. You convince yourself that it's your fault or that you don't deserve better and it's hard to get that out of your mind. It's not as simple as just walking away sometimes. A lot of times it's having to change your whole mind set and realize that you're better than that. Because usually the problem isn't realize that what he's doing is wrong, it's realizing that you don't deserve it and having the courage to say so and not waiver.

[Rahmota]

Wow i feel bad for your friend Jester. i too hope she finds the strength to pull herself out of the situation before its too late. I also hope BB has a very personal encounter with a chipper shredder. Him and his kind are an embarresment to real men who know how to be decent. Althouh it does lend credence to evolution when you see a throwback like that. Or is it being insultign to neaderthals to compare the two?

I don't blame you jester for feeling a bit betrayed and tired of the situation. Just look at her the way a person who's addicted to a bad drug acts. Its gonna be painful to be near but good friends are a rock they can hopefully maybe someday pull themselves up with. Anhow hopefully things wil work out for the good.

[Slayergrrl]

The fact is, kids, that she did what millions of women do all the time. And that at some time in the future, I will probably be attending her funeral and/or his murder trial.

Sadly I see this day in and day out.. I've mentioned before that I work for the Police. I've seen woman come in covered in blood, broken noses, beaten bodies.. They convince themselves that they somehow deserve it. I heard one woman say to our victims advocate that her husband loves her and that is why he beats her.

Most of them go back.. Sadly there is nothing that we or anyone can do about it..

I've seen a lot working where I do.. Sometimes I wish I could unsee those things. But it's made me a stronger person..

Jester, I don't know you from Adam but you seem like a wicked cool dude! Everyone should be as lucky to have a friend like you..

[Jester]

If you continue to be there in that regard, you're just a crutch (her words, not mine) and she'll use you as such, getting away from him, running to you, until she's no longer scared and then going back to him.

And perhaps I am a crutch. But because she is my friend, and because I care for her, I will be there for her, even if that makes me a sucker. I don't know that I'll be willing to stick my neck out nearly as far next time around, but that doesn't mean that I won't be there to comfort her. It's just the way I am.

Were I in your position, I honestly believe I would wash my hands of it and not be involved in the situation at all anymore.

But you're not. You have to do things your way, and I have to do them mine. Doesn't make me better or worse than you....we are just built differently.

Especially after pulling a 180 like that, she wasn't even wishy washy leading up to it.

It wasn't quite the 180 it seems to have been. I did not post everything that was going on in with TD, as she was struggling emotionally with the whole thing, and I really didn't want to post all of that, especially since it looked to me like she WAS going to rid herself of this yahoo. There were signs there before this, and we saw some of them, but I did not write about them. That was a conscious decision on my part. And there are still things I have not posted, and won't, for a number of reasons. But I have to stress that it was not a complete 180. None of us who were dealing with TD should have been completely surprised by this...even though most of us were.

[auntiem]

I have to say this on the behalf of TD.
I yo-yo'd in and out of a very bad relationship. I went back to him and stayed for a full year and a half after an incident so bad he had to call the ambulance for me. I consider myself a strong person and I know the red flags so I never get into a relationship like that again. The situation is undiscribeably emotionally complicated for the person going thru it. Please do not call her "stupid" or "weak" even though she seems to be. Hopefully, she will be able to get out and stay out the next time, it is very rare for someone in this situation to get out and stay out the first time (sadly, sometimes the second or third). You have to get to a point where you have somewhere to go where you can't be contacted and be willing to walk away with nothing but the clothes on your back. She got far this time, I hope with every fiber that next time she will make it.

Jester - I understand that it is horrible to watch this happen and not be able to stop it, but I hope you can be there for her again when she tries to get out next time.

[myswtghst]

Wow. I've been reading this thread all along, but haven't commented, and I have to be honest, I was terribly disappointed to see she'd gone back to him. Not terribly surprised, but disappointed and saddened.

While many people here are right on the nail, that TD will have to break the cycle on her own, when she is ready, and that what she did IS, in my opinion, a betrayal to Jester and all the friends who helped her out in this tough time, I think there are a few things (some) people seem to be missing.

One, in my opinion, is that no matter how much it may be a bad decision on her part to go back to BB, TD does not deserve what she gets. No woman deserves to be used as a punching bag. The only time anyone deserves to be treated like that is if they started the fight and are just getting what they gave, particularly if they struck someone defenseless.

Two, what is a friend, but someone who stands by you, through the good and the bad? I know there are times you need to walk away, but unless a friend is abusing you (mentally, physically, emotionally, etc), I don't think it's right to abandon them because you disagree with their decision. I think Jester actually has a very healthy mindset on this - he says himself that he will be a shoulder, and he will remind her that this is a bad situation, but will not stick his neck out or put himself in danger again. He's already on BB's radar as a "bad guy" and that won't change, even if Jester cuts himself off from TD, who he does care about.

And three, I am still impressed that TD took things as far as she did. She made an effort to change, and I think this story does illustrate how hard it can be to get out of a situation like this. I went through something similar with emotional abuse from an ex in college, where, even though he humiliated me and cheated on me, I still cared about him and we had too much shared history and life for me to "just walk away." Sometimes the right thing to do is incredibly difficult, and I give TD respect for trying, even if she did not succeed.

What she did, in the end, hurts her, and hurts the cause. And that just plain sucks. Especially if she does decide to be strong in the future and walk away from him. But she made her bed and now she'll have to lie in it, and even if it only takes one more bout of abuse for her to leave, she'll pay for her mistake, one way or another. She's lost the respect of friends, and credibility in the eyes of the law, which will make everything that much harder the next time around, if there is a next time. And I think that's more punishment than anyone deserves.

[tropicsgoddess]

Human Pinanta or How To Be A "Man"

I was happy for TD when she reported him, banned him from her job and had an RO. But now I'm disappointed that she went back to that douche bag. She had a chance to free herself of that bastard and now that's ruined. He's probably got her under lock down for all we know. I hope that she's okay and that one she will wise up and dump his sorry ass. I hope BB dies in a fire, or any painful and torturous manner possible. Jester, you were a good friend for helping her out and sticking your neck out for her, so mad respect ! Seeing that you and I are fellow Floridians along with my giant fiance (he's 6'8 and 300+ lbs. NO LIE!), we could make BB "disappear" in the Everglades.

[MMATM]

Seeing that you and I are fellow Floridians along with my giant fiance (he's 6'8 and 300+ lbs. NO LIE!), we could make BB "disappear" in the Everglades.

Your fiancé is an alligator? Damn, he must be an animal in bed. (THAT WAS A JOKE PLEASE DON'T STRING ME UP BY MY BIG TOES!)

In all seriousness, though, ditching BB in the Everglades would probably be harmful to the local wildlife, as years of horrible filth seep out of his body into the surroundings. And the poor alligators who would hopefully (and likely) eat him before his body would be found! If he does happen to vanish in the Everglades, I would at least hope he'd vanish with a couple family-packs of TUMS in his pockets, for the alligators' sake.

[Der Cute]

Well, what a story. *shakes head*

Jester, thank you for being supportive and trying to help someone who needed it. A person in jeopardy of harm needed a clearly thinking person - and you came through. Thank you.

TD - girl, you may not read this. I hope you do.
I've been there and done MOST of what you've done. I had a bf who was abusive - verbally. I was a depressed, 60% functional adult who came from an abusive home. So, staying w/ Butthead was easier for me than trying it on my own. Or so I thought. For a few months I stayed with Butthead, feeling worse and worse. Finally when he hit me I snapped out of it, and my survival switch came on. And stayed on.

TD- you chose to go back. To a place you feel comfortable in, although you kinda get the idea it's not Nirvana. You know it's iffy-good, it's not really all that...but it's what you KNOW. Why try the Nice Shiny Place across the street, it may turn out to be a tar pit.....and being scared and tired of it doesn't help. I truly hope you will find that spark of faith in yourself sometime soon and say, "I don't CARE if I sleep in the rain. I don't CARE if I am outside with $20 and a phone card. I don't CARE if someone thinks I look weird because of the black eye. I'M DOING IT FOR ME AND FOR MY SAFETY." You're worth it. Really.

Jimmy hit me. I knew he was a hitter. He had told me his first wife had pressed charges against him for it. And I thought, well, hmm...I can be me, and give him a chance...and he won't hit me. Not for a while, at least. The SOB yelled. Just like my dad. Hollered. Just like dad. And, so, to me, it was ok-ish. I had left home from it, but was around it again - my old worn sock that I knew had been good, but now had holes in it...I hoped the hole would heal.....
After a few months together, Jimmy tried to strangle me to show control. I had to struggle. You know what? He wouldn't give up. So I faked it. I called UNCLE..and let him think he was in control. As soon as the SOB got off me, I hauled ass out the door...and called the cops. RO, him in jail, me safe - fine. F U, SOB.

I didn't care. I didn't have much support. So what? I said I'd rather be in a homeless shelter than anywhere close to the SOB anymore. Yelling, meh, iffy. Choking me - NO. So I chose.

Every day, TD, you make a choice. Every day. And one day you will pull out of it. May not be tomorrow or next week, but you will. Because you'll figure out that you do NOT deserve to be hit, NOBODY does, and that you're WORTH FIGHTING FOR.


Jester - take a day off. I bet your brain needs a defrag sans Everclear.

Cutenoob

[Jester]

Well, today was interesting. Much happened, most of it bad. The above post, that I posted at about 8:00, was actually a post I had been working on this morning, but had to finish up after I got home from work, after everything went down, but I still wanted those thoughts posted. And now, more fun-filled family entertainment:

Last night, fed up and freaked out by the whole situation, the girl who had taken TD in (we'll call her Cheer Girl) decided she was done getting screwed over, so she packed up all of TD's stuff in her place, put it her (Cheer Girl's) car, and this morning, when she went into work, she brought it all there, and texted TD that she could get her stuff back, and that she needed her keys back from TD. She got no response to her text. She also changed the locks on her place (costing her $50) as she didn't want there to be any chance BB could have access to her place.

I got a text from Rockin' Manager to call her. I was at my other job, not The Bar, so I called her and found quite a bit, and found out more as the day went on, through texts from RM and others. See, TD's job is The Bar, with me and RW and Rockin' Manager and Cheer Girl. I didn't mention it earlier (intentionally) but am clarifying now. So when I got a chance to, I called Rockin' Manager, and she told me that she had actually talked to TD voice to voice (rather than via text), something none of the rest of us had done. So TD is alive. Can't say she is well, but she is alive. TD could not or would not explain to Rockin' Manager why TD did what she did, but did ask about picking up her stuff from The Bar.

Then at a little while later, a lot happened all at the same time. I got three phone calls from the same number, which I did not recognize, which I am pretty sure is BB's, though I did not think of it at the time. I later tried calling that number twice, but got no answer and no voice mail.

Also, about that time, Rockin' Manager texted me to tell me that TD, rather than come get her stuff herself, had sent someone else to get it for her.

Okay class, does anyone want to guess just WHO it was that TD sent to The Bar to get her stuff? Anyone? Anyone?

RIGHT! She sent Big Boy himself. You know, the guy who had beaten the crap out of her, starting this whole saga in the first place. The same guy who is BANNED by management from setting foot on the premises of The Bar for any reason, ever. BB called Rockin' Manager from TD's phone (which he had with him), and they got in a screaming match. I guess BB thought it was unreasonable for him not to be allowed to set foot in a business from which he had been banned to get the possessions of the woman he had beaten bloody and senseless. Rockin' Manager in no uncertain--but definitely impolite--words told BB what he could do with this opinion. Finally, sick of it, Rockin' Manager called the police. BB finally got smart and left.

At about this SAME time, I started getting texts from TD. Or at least from TD's phone. Can't say it was TD, can't say it wasn't. But she was telling me that she was simply using BB for the moment, and would be leaving for her home town tomorrow. In different texts, she would later say that she was checking in to a battered women's shelter/home/whatever for six weeks, THEN going back to her home town. Either way, she was saying she was leaving him.

Okay class, can someone please explain why a woman who had left a man who had beaten her bloody and senseless, who had taken out a temporary restraining order and applied for a permanent one against the same man, who had gotten all her stuff from his house two night before while he was in jail for said incident, who had tons of people around her helping her with everything from transportation to clothes to a residence to counseling to court dates, who had actually left the guy....can someone please explain why this woman would go back to this man so that she could then leave him?

Anyone? Anyone? No one? Right. About what I figured. No one can answer this because it defies all logic, even severely twisted emotional logic.

It's at about this point that a lot of people involved in this whole mess started to get the face going full bore. Myself included. I believe my exact thought was "HUH?!?!?!?!"

This all went down about an hour before TD was scheduled to work. Okay, everyone who is surprised to find out that at about this time TD quit her job at The Bar as I had predicted she would, please stand up.

Hmmmm.....interesting. Everyone seems to have remain seated.

So, shortly after this, Cheer Girl left The Bar, her day shift done, and was driving home to the residence she had just cleaned TD's stuff out of, when she found herself being followed by BB's truck. Cheer Girl is a naturally emotional person, and she reacted appropriately: she freaked the fuck out. Turned back around, drove back to work, and they had the head chef follow her in HIS car so she could get home safely.

A little bit after this, I got another text from TD, asking me if I could meet her somewhere so that we could talk. Since it was a text message, I could not be sure that it was TD wanting to talk, or BB trying to get me some place so he could have a new target for his violence. I texted back for TD to call me after I got off work, eventually coming right out in a text and saying that since I could not be sure who was texting me, I would only speak to her voice to voice.

So, later that evening, after work, TD called me. She wanted me to get her stuff from The Bar and meet her somewhere, so she could pick it up and go to a "friend's" house. She had a "friend's" vehicle. I did what any good friend would do.

I told her no.

I told her I WOULD help her get her stuff at The Bar and load it into her vehicle, but I was NOT being her transporter anymore. She told me she couldn't handle facing people at The Bar. I countered by telling her that she needed to take responsibility for her actions. She said that she would, but not when it endangered her mental health. I pointed out that the person most responsible for damaging her mental health was not anyone at The Bar, but BB. The guy she had gone back to. Yeah, him. She finally agreed to meet me at The Bar at a certain time.

Keep in mind, THIS whole conversation was shortly after the one where she hung up on me for "yelling" at her. I never raised my voice. That I was not angry with her, but many other people were. I explained to her why everyone was upset at her. "A lot of people went out of their way to help you, and they are feeling betrayed right now by your actions. People feel like you shit on them. You DID betray a lot of people, but more than anyone, you betrayed yourself."

So finally I met up with TD down at The Bar. Her "friend's" vehicle was none other than BB's. He, however, was not there. She claimed that she was using his truck to get her stuff and bring it to another friend's house. I was rather skeptical. So we load up the truck with all her stuff. I suggest to her that she should probably get Cheer Girl the $50 she had to spend to get her locks changed. I suggested that more than once, since I was getting no response from TD at all. Finally she said, "Yeah, when I get the money, I'll send it to her." My thought right now looking back: "The check's in the mail." After we finally get everything loaded, TD goes to leave. No thank you, no nothing, just an "I have to go." And she went. Later I texted her with "You're welcome." A bit after that, "That's ok, no need to thank me." I have yet to receive any response to either message.

As if all this wasn't enough, there was more. I went to a local bar and got a LARGE shot and a beer, and was calming down from the day's stupidity, getting ready to join some friends at trivia night, when I got a call from Cheer Girl. She had gotten physically ill, and was wondering if I would come over for a bit. She sounded horrible, so I went, picking up soup and Gatorade along the way. She was not acting....she was having cold sweats, puking often, shaking, having bad dreams, and was generally just looking really horrible. So I stayed with her a while, calmed her down, made her soup which she couldn't eat (I ate it, but there is more soup there), stuck around for a bit, and then finally came home to type all this up.

But even the above situation was not simple. As obviously very little is beneath BB, I could very well picture him having gone to Cheer Girl's place with one of his guns, taking her hostage, and making TD go get her stuff and come back....and using a fake illness to lure me, one of his chief detractors and one of TD's chief helpers, back to the place to "take care of me" in some violent way. Cheer Girl's lights were all off when I got there, and I did a slow circle of the parking lot checking to make sure BB's truck was not there. I also called a friend who lived nearby, and had him go with me into Cheer Girl's place to make sure it was just my paranoia. It was, in fact, just my paranoia, but that is how crazy all of this is making everyone.

While I understand that it can be frustrating to stand up for someone and have them go back to the bad situation, it's harder than you think to get out of that victim mind set. You convince yourself that it's your fault or that you don't deserve better and it's hard to get that out of your mind. It's not as simple as just walking away sometimes.

The situation is undiscribeably emotionally complicated for the person going thru it. Please do not call her "stupid" or "weak" even though she seems to be.

That's the thing. She HAD walked away. Many of us had helped her do it. She was struggling with things emotionally, and was in contact with BB without most of our knowledge, but she kept saying to me, "I'm better than this. I deserve better than this." And she believed it. She was OUT. She said she wanted it all to be over, for him to be out of his life, and she was so close to making that happen.

I know it is not a simple situation. I know that people struggle a lot with this kind of thing. But too many people went out of their way for this woman, and most of them are more pissed off than me, and I am somewhat pissed off. I am not ANGRY at her, as many are, but just feel very, very sad for her, and pity her.

I am not calling her "stupid" or "weak." But many other people are, and I cannot blame them or disagree, to be quite honest.

Jester - I understand that it is horrible to watch this happen and not be able to stop it, but I hope you can be there for her again when she tries to get out next time.

I don't know that I can. For someone else in a similar situation, sure. For her.....even I am having trouble with her actions of the last two days, now that things are clearer. Does he have some kind of hold over her? Of course. But if she is serious that she is just using this as a ruse to get away from him, she is obviously not thinking of the collateral damage to other people, and that is very fucking selfish.

Jester, I don't know you from Adam but you seem like a wicked cool dude! Everyone should be as lucky to have a friend like you..

I am. But as I have said from the start, I am not the only person who went out on a limb for TD in this. The whole business circled the wagons protectively around her. Cheer Girl opened up her home to TD. Rockin' Manager was amazing in so many ways. Reformed Waitress was absolutely angelic in her counseling of TD. Me, I drove her around some, and helped her with some cargo.

The time and resources of so many people that were wasted on all this is staggering. Emotionally, I am drained. Rockin' Manager has had two run-ins with BB, both at the business, and while she is a tough broad, she has been left shaking from both of them. Cheer Girl is physically, violently ill. Even The Wall, a very large, thick guy who works at The Bar, saw BB one day at another bar just glaring at him for over an hour. It takes some serious stupidity to glare at a guy The Wall's size. (I didn't choose his pseudonym in here for no reason, after all.) Many people at The Bar have lost a lot of faith in the police, the legal system, and people in general. The police and the court system wasted a lot of time and money on this whole thing, and while I hated the fact that they dragged their feet on this, it is situations just like this one, that they see every day, that cause them to do just that.

I like to think I will be there for TD again. I still consider her a friend. But I am not beyond getting disappointed in or mad at (or even furious at) my friends when they fuck up. And TD fucked up. She was out. She knew that, and she knew she had an amazing support system, even if the legal system wasn't working that great or that quickly to help her. And she threw it all away to go back to this shitstain. Whether it is in fact a ruse to leave him (which makes no sense) or she is just lying and is going to be back with him (which also makes no sense) doesn't matter, really, in the end. She is not the only person that was hurt in this, but she can't see that.

So now I come to the end of this whole sordid tale.

But I am going to end this with a message. A message to the world in general and several CS.com members in particular. You know who you are.

(Those with delicate sensibilities should probably leave. Now.)

Many of you are stuck in an abusive relationship. You think you can't get out, but you can. If this thread has taught you nothing else, it should have taught you that there are tons of people willing to help you, oftentimes people you don't even know that well, or at all. Look at the outpouring of emotion TD got not just from her friends and coworkers, but from so many people who never met her right here on this website.

I know that it is not an easy thing to do. Leaving someone you love is never easy. And I am not going to lie and say it is.

But for the love of all that is holy on heaven and earth, if the love of your life is using you as a punching bag, sending you to the hospital, making you fear for your life, or even just treating you like shit without hitting you physically, and everyone you know is telling you to get the fuck out, you might want to consider that it's time to
GET THE FUCK OUT!!!!

And when you finally do get up the courage to talk to people, to seek help, to get out, please, do whatever you can to not go back to him. Because the next time around, people and cops and courts are going to be much less likely to help you.

And please consider other people. Because once you go back to him, all those people who helped you are left hurt, betrayed, mad, and sometimes even become targets for that waste of skin that you love so much that you can't live without their loving hands using your skin as a conga drum.

So once you get the fuck out of that failing miserable relationship, please do yourself and those around you a huge favor and
STAY THE FUCK OUT!!!!


Don't allow yourself to become a Tiny Dancer.

Don't hate yourself so much that you become a Human Pinata.

[Jester]

Jester - take a day off. I bet your brain needs a defrag sans Everclear.

I'd love to. I can't. Not only do I need the money (and took yesterday off for other reasons), but I am probably going to have to work Cheer Girl's day shift tomorrow in addition to my own night shift. She is REALLY sick.