Creepy Old Men (plus one young guy)

[alowlypotato]

Thought of this post while in Irving Patrick Freleigh's "Good boy" thread.

So, ladies of the board, how many of you have experienced this: the sleazy, older man who hits on you, attempts an ill-advised move, or makes a comment in such poor taste that your stomach clenches? It seems to happen pretty commonly to women around my age (I'm 24), and, well, I've definitely got some tales of my own.

But he Seemed so Grandfatherly...

Venture back with me, CS denizens, to my first foray into the exciting world of retail finance. I had this regular customer that I loved. He reminded me of the sort of grandfather you see on TV, the jolly white-haired fellow with a twinkle in his eye. He had a long, bushy mustache and he vaguely resembled a muppet. Walked and talked like one, too.

One day, he came to me about some trouble with his savings passbook. He was having difficulty understanding a few transactions that had been recorded. I was holding the passbook on the counter in front of him, running my finger over each transaction as I explained to him what it all meant. Suddenly, he grabbed my hand and started stroking it.

Me: *blink*
Muppet: You're such a beautiful girl!
Me: Um...um, thank you... *hastily retracts hand*
Muppet: *begins breathing heavily* You're...I would very much like... *stares intensely*
Me: *tries to complete explanation of passbook as quickly as possible*
Muppet: *grabs for my hand again*
Me: *takes a step back* Do...do...do you have any other questions, Mr. Muppet?
Muppet: No; you've done wonderful. You're so wonderful!
Me: *wants to cry*

It all made me so uncomfortable that I refused to help him after that. It was quite sad, actually, since I'd so enjoyed working with him before that.


The Man who Called my Boss -- for a Hook-up

Was still at the same institution patroned by Mr. Muppet. I had had a hard day, so my manager pulled me aside to give me what I suppose was meant to be a pep talk.

Manager: You know, our customers think very highly of you. One of the regulars called me the other day to ask about you.
Me: Oh?
Manager: He said, "she's really got her act together." He wanted to know if you were available.
Me: ...
Manager: I told him, "she's very involved with a young man, it's very serious," but he was persistent. I told him he was old enough to be your father. And he is, you know. I can't tell you who he is, of course, but I thought you should know about it.
Me: *boggle*


You're Not my Guy

Flash forward to my current job, also in the financial services industry. We've this regular in his late middle ages who loves to talk (well, actually...that's about a third of our regulars), and being as it's part of my job, I oblige him. I guess he really enjoyed our conversations, because after a while, he started referring to me as "his girl," generally when bumping into acquaintances while in line. It goes something like this:

Other Regular who Knows Me: Hi potato! *steps up to my window*
Not My Guy: Hey, you stealing my girl? Don't mess with her!

Well, okay -- whatever. He's just joking around, right? Well, one day, as I completed his transaction...

Me: Anything else I can do for ya, Not My Guy?
NMG: Nah, thanks, potato.
Me: All righty, take care!
NMG: I'll take you home with me! *wink* *shit-eating grin*
Me: *shocked stare*

This is a married man in his 60s. Ew.


Hairy Chest

There's another guy about the same age as NMG. He's...different. A few weeks ago, when it was unseasonably warm outside, he came in wearing nothing on his upper body but a poofy winter vest. Believe me when I say that it was barely decent, and that I am not pleased with having seen his chest hair.

Anyway, he's entitled to his poor fashion sense. What he's not entitled to, however, are the following comments:

Hairy Chest: *to CW* Oh, not wearing glasses today, huh? Trying to look sexy?
CW: Uh...
HC: *to me* You always look good.
Me: *blink*
HC: Don't tell your boyfriend about us.
Me: Oh, don't worry about that. (Thinking: I won't tell him because there is no "us.")
HC: Bet he doesn't know you like older guys.
Me: Actually, he's a few years older than me.
HC: Not by as many years as I am, though! *creepy wink*
Me: *gives up; focuses all attention on the computer*


Younger than the Rest, yet Perhaps the Most Creepy

There is a gentleman in his early 30s whose creepiness is known far and wide at my institution. He long attempted to get into the pants of a woman who used to occasionally work at our branch. He foisted his number upon her at one point, then berated her for not calling him. He has a habit of staring longingly at my supervisor while she's helping him, and of lingering after she's finished his transactions -- ostensibly to, well, do some more staring.

I had the...privilege of helping him approximately two months ago. After getting through the necessary formalities, he immediately initiated his first phase of attack.

Young Creep: Are you married?
Me: Uh, no. I'm engaged, though.
YC: Oh. *pause* He's a lucky guy.
Me: Why...thank you.
YC: *stare*
Me: *smiles and nods*
YC: I don't have a girlfriend.
Me: Oh, ah...I'm sorry.
YC: I need a girlfriend. I need a nice girl. *pause* A nice girl like you.
Me: *nervous* Well, don't you worry! I'm sure you'll find someone!
YC: I guess... *stare* You're always so nice. You would be a good girlfriend.
Me: Heh, thanks, but uh, yeah...engaged, heh. *brandishes ring*
YC: Yeah. *stare*
Me: Well have a good day!
YC: I will, thanks. *continues standing at my window* *stare*
Me: *nervousness increasing* Okay, bye!
YC: Bye... *finally turns to leave, glancing back over his shoulder a few times as he heads toward the door*

As he left, this girl being helped by one of my CWs gave me this look like, "WTF WAS THAT?"

My thoughts exactly.

[Bramble]

Ok first of all I don't care HOW old you are(unless it tis a SMALL child) do not EVER touch me. Especially not while you're trying to(and failing at it epicly) come on to me. Another thing I've noticed. I NEVER get the cute eye candy young men to hit on me it's ALWAYS the creepy/massively overweight and stinky/old/FUGLY guys that I wouldn't touch with a ten MILE pole. Why is that? I feel your pain potato I feel your pain

[Raieth]

I haven't posted in a while but I HAD to speak up about this.


These are warning signs you have to pay attention to and DEAL with. I know from personal experince that if you do not firmly and very clearly tell them that you do not like them, want nothing to do with them and the like, it can get very nasty very fast.

Most of the time yeah, they are just creepy old men that are lonely. but there are psycho's out there. You NEED to tell them very firmly that "NO you do not feel that way about them. You are polite because your job requires you to. Not because you "like" them."

I cannot stress how important it is to let them know you are just doing your job.

They may be old, and you may be old enough to fight them off. But it's still a long legal process to get out of. You'd be surprised how much people stand up for the lecherous bastards when they get put in the hospital because the girl they decided to lunge for has good reflexes.

Please, stress the engaged part to them. Stress that they are married. Find out what there wives would say if they knew. Imply they can't have sex anyway. ANYTHING, please, please don't let it get out of hand.

I'm sorry if I come off wrong. But too many people have been hurt by "the old pervert" and I really don't want that to happen to anyone else.

[blas]

I would take getting hit on very seriously.

I've told this story before (it wasn't an older older guy, just a guy a few years older than me, but still a creep nonetheless) from my gas station days.

This guy called up the store a while after he'd been in there and asked me out. I told him no, and he got violent. "So, you're a MEAN GIRL, huh?" he said to me.

I told him "I guess I am."

He went off the deep end and yelled into the phone "DO YOU WANT TO KNOW WHAT I DO TO MEAN GIRLS?!!!!?"

Better safe than sorry. Do not be cute or coy and do not give in or try to be nice or let them be indulged.

[Irving Patrick Freleigh]

He went off the deep end and yelled into the phone "DO YOU WANT TO KNOW WHAT I DO TO MEAN GIRLS?!!!!?"

Run them over with a school bus?

[alowlypotato]

I'm sorry if I come off wrong. But too many people have been hurt by "the old pervert" and I really don't want that to happen to anyone else.

You don't come off wrong at all. I understand your concern completely, especially since I do have some trouble being firm at times (and I don't come across as very firm in this thread, which is largely because all of these incidents took me a bit off guard).

I can say that I have actually turned to the tack of stressing my being engaged, and it's worked very well -- particularly with "Not My Guy." I'm also lucky to have a manager now who takes all of these tales seriously. The manager I had at the bank that "Muppet" went to just thought it was funny.

[blas]

Haha, Irv. Just call me Regina George.

In all honesty though, every time I tell that story and look back on it, I wonder why he said something like that versus "DO YOU KNOW WHAT I DO TO STUCK UP CUNTS LIKE YOU?" but I guess that's all he could blurt out at the time.

[Seshat]

I can say that I have actually turned to the tack of stressing my being engaged

That only works on the ones who don't then say "would he like a threesome?" or "he doesn't have to know."

My advice is to use increasingly escalating, but very clear, 'no' statements. Not signals, statements. Statements of YOUR disinterest - stalker personalities will find any excuse to think you really do want them.
None of these ever become rude, but they are firm and clear.

1. "I appreciate the compliment, but I'm not interested."
2. "No thank you."
3. "I said no." (start documenting. Include previous incidents.)
4. "I've told you I'm not interested. Please stop making approaches to me." (Involve management)
5. "Please use a different teller from now on."
6. (point to different teller) "Over there."
7. (call manager over, have manager deal with customer)
8. (involve police)

Also, read the thread on harassment in General Work Chat's advice subforum.

[RetailDemon]

I work in a luxury retail shop and get creepy old guys all the time. I had one when I bent over to grab a box look down my shirt. I got back up and he asked me if I was married, I said no, and he said I will be soon with my "assets".
I used to dress nicely for work, but now I kind of "dress down" as much as I can. Now most of the guys coming in think I'm a lesbian because to the clothes and I use the "authoritative voice all the time.
Side note* Ironically , I did get married earlier this year, so creepy old man was right.

[blas]

It doesn't matter what you wear or how you present yourself. All creepy men are the same in their being pitiful, obnoxious, and lecherous, but no two creepy men are exactly alike in their preferences.

Don't bother changing the way you look or trying to change who you are. You'll attract others.

The only thing I'd advise changing is being more assertive, hell even aggresive in turning them down and making them feel like the scum of the earth that they are.

[XCashier]

BTDT. I used to be a cute teen-twentysomething whom all the creeps hit on. Unfortunately, nobody really teaches you how to handle something like that. You may wish to ask your manager for advice on how to handle the creeps, or try different methods until you find which works for you.

What I would do if it happened now: Always be polite and friendly, but never coy or flirty with customers. When they start in with the harrassment, go ice-cold and say, "Excuse me?" That gives them the chance to back off without losing (too much) face. If they keep up, tell them, "That is not acceptable." Stay ice-cold but polite until the transaction is finished or they apologize (unlikely).

They need to learn that their crap is not appreciated or acceptable. If that gets you the label of "bitch", well, so be it. You don't need their opinion anyway.

If they start getting physical, don't be afraid to scream or make a scene. They're hoping the girl doesn't want to make a scene so they can get away with their crap. And it's always the "nice girls" who "don't want to make a scene" who become the victims.

[EvilEmpryss]

I found that sometimes the ice-cold slap of "What you are doing is considered sexual harassment and I will not tolerate it" is enough to shock them into a semblance of reality. Point to the cameras that witnessed everything and suggest that a jury would be happy to judge his behavior in a court of law.

[Seshat]

I used to dress nicely for work, but now I kind of "dress down" as much as I can. Now most of the guys coming in think I'm a lesbian because to the clothes and I use the "authoritative voice all the time.

Dress to make yourself comfortable in the job. The creeps, for the most part, aren't looking at your clothes. They're looking to see if you're vulnerable to their creepiness - and that's a behaviour thing.

Learning the behaviours to block creeps can actually save your life - it can enable you to "fail" a 'pre-rape interview'. While only a small percentage of creeps are rapists - and I do mean a small percentage - my research into personal safety indicates that a 'pre-rape interview' is a lot like what the creeps do.

If you are firm in your 'no', and make it obvious that you will NOT be meekly and politely obedient, you're making it clear to a potential rapist that you're more trouble than you're worth.

In a customer-facing environment, in a service industry, you may need to be a little more lenient than you would otherwise be - but that just means giving one more chance before making a scene. It doesn't mean tolerating their behaviour. And if you're alone in the store, don't give that one more chance!

One effective 'scene' to make is this: learn a pre-fight blocking stance that puts your hands up in front of your chest. Then practice saying "No!" in a firm, carrying tone of voice, while snapping yourself into a very-slightly-varied form of that stance that *looks* like you're just shoving your arms between you and the creep to emphasise the 'no'.

Gives the appearance to uninvolved people that you're just enforcing your personal space. Gives a CLEAR signal to the creep. Fails you almost all pre-rape interviews - and if the creep really IS enough of an idiot to try to touch you, you're ready to block them, break free and run towards the nearest security officer.

[EvilEmpryss]

Seshat, you are my hero. All of your advice is excellent, well phrased, and could be life-saving. I hope the people who see it here pass it on to others.

[ThePhoneGoddess]

Ohhhhh yeah, I'm 36 years old and I still get it. I work on the phones, though, so I don't get it from customers all that much. I have problems with coworkers on occasion, as we have such high turnover, and I have problems when I go into stores.

I had one coworker a year or two ago who used to follow me around and stare at me creepily and would try to corner me in the command center to say totally inappropriate sexual things to me. He got fired after 3 different women made complaints about him (including me).

We also had a guy at work, mid 50's I'd guess, and gay. He got fired because he was apparently stalking young gay employees---he'd follow them into the bathroom, and hit on them *while* they were using the urinal. I'm talking like barely 18 year olds. 3 complaints and he was gone. HR is prettty good about this at my work, each complaint gets the perpetrator a meeting with the head of HR. 3 strikes and you're out.

I mostly have issues with guys in suits in public places. This is a quirk that is apparently somewhat unique to me, even my Mother has seen this happen and commented on it. It happens in Whole Foods a lot. Strange men in suits will come up to me and try to get my phone number or hit on me or both, and some of them are creepily persistent. I had one guy follow me out to my car, and seeing that I drive an older, cheaper car, told me that if I would be his girlfriend he'd buy me a nicer one. Sorry, I am not a trophy girlfriend. Ugh.