Short but rude.

[Kanalah]

Off-topic: I hate that term. It's way too loosely used.

Before I chain myself to the sewing machine for the day, which term would that be?

[LillFilly]

Woah. Way for that guy to burn his bridges when the other people he chose can't/won't make what he wanted Bwahahaha! How much will your time be worth then?

[Andara Bledin]

Before I chain myself to the sewing machine for the day, which term would that be?

I suspect it's the "ripping people off" phrase.

Because most people who say that are full of shit and using it wrong.

Bait and switchers are ripping people off. Vendors who double their prices during an emergency are ripping people off. Thieves are ripping people off. People who charge for premium parts and use cheap knockoffs are ripping people off.

Artists who choose to actually charge a living wage for their time and expertise are not ripping people off.

^-.-^

[Kanalah]

Ty Andara.

That's what I was thinking, but lots of work for 1 day + only 1 me = cranky

[EricKei]

.. and always get %50 up front at least.

Absolutely. In fact, I'd say 100% of mats (nonrefundable) plus 50% of labor (mayyyybe half refundable) up front.

Here, you guys might enjoy this youtube video!

The Vendor Client Relationship in Real Life Situations

Loved it ^^ Hit a bit too close to home at times ~_~ I'm just glad I didn't have to do the collection calls back at the ol' office. One of the comments on YT reminded me: some Vendors LOVE to do the the "we only pay bills once a month" thing...and yet, they expect Terms (discounts for prompt payment), and often do not offer Terms themselves. I can kinda sorta see how this woud be simpler -- you just have one day where you gather up all the bills and pay them -- tho I imagine it would be one busy day x.x Why not just do it every Friday or whatever to spread it out and at least have a chance of getting Term discounts?

Tho, come to think of it, that could be an effective way to get someone to pay on a big project: Terms. Let's say this applies to any project where the Labor is projected to be over a hundred dollars.
- Product does not ship until 100% paid, but...
- Mats paid for up front, no matter what. No refunds once purchased
- Require 20% of Labor up front, no matter what, nonrefundable unless project is cancelled before you actually start work or buy mats
- If total labor is estimated at $300, offer to knock 10% off of the labor if it's ALL paid up front; or 5% off if he pays at least half of the labor up front AND the balance before the project is completed. If at least half is prepaid, allow for partial refund (no more than half of what they've actually sent you)
- Prepayers would also get certain perks such as guaranteed WIP shots that others might not get.
- If payment is late, no Discount (remove it retroactively if need be) and no refund on what has already been paid.

I do understand that you must be careful not to "price" yourself out of the market (tho this would not increase pricing, just when you get paid), but it can also serve to run off people who are just 'grazing' at your expense.

[depechemodefan]

Here at the library, we get people who call/email/write to us wanting us to copy a page from the newspaper. We charge $2 a citation and $1 a page. A few people are shocked that we don't copy it for free for them. Oh, and they expect us to mail the copies to them.

A copy we could make for $.15 includes the time we have to spend looking for the thing needed to be copied, time we can't devote to the patrons actually here at the library.

[Seraph]

Here, you guys might enjoy this youtube video!

The Vendor Client Relationship in Real Life Situations

Bless you. Bless you. BLESS YOU FOR THIS VIDEO.

[dragon_wings]

The Vendor Client Relationship in Real Life Situations

Wow. I'm speechless.

[zombiequeen]

Ugh. I think that's just them trying to be mean.
How could you say that and not mean it as an insult? There's a reason I don't make things for my mother, and this is it.

[charred]

http://vimeo.com/22053820

Not a rick-roll. Promise.

[rose_metal_nz]

The Vendor Client Relationship in Real Life Situations

Oh, I love you for this!

[Kanalah]

Yeah I need to stream that video at my craft shows.

Then again I know some of my customers just wouldn't get it.

Funny aside: My mom crochets baby things (sweaters/blankets/booties/etc.) She gets people custom ordering things and they're always nice and polite. She's never had a haggler or a loony.

[Pezzle]

All I ever get are the people who find me via the cesspool of the interwebs art world, DeviantArt, and leave me a note saying they love my work and would love to work with me. I get all excited.... THEN there's the caveat.

"But, we figure these would be good portfolio pieces for you so we're not prepared to offer compensation"

F you! Next please

[zombiequeen]

"But, we figure these would be good portfolio pieces for you so we're not prepared to offer compensation"

F you! Next please

Is that the proper way to reply? I would love to email that to people!

I'm working with my brother's girlfriend/fiancee on a portfolio piece for her. I'll buy the materials, and pay labor so I get to pick out the stones and metal I want, but she gets to design it around a couple of simple rules.
1. It's a ring
2. Make the other church ladies jealous
3. Won't break (I'm rough on jewelry) but still fancy-pants

THAT is how you work with an artist for a portfolio piece. I get an awesome bragging-rights ring-ama-thing, and she get's the experience and design skills for her portfolio. Plus I'll be a walking talking advertisement!

[Pezzle]

@Zombiequeen:

It's very much different when it's a friend or a family member and you work out a deal like that methinks! I do that a little with my family and a few buddies (ie, tattoo designs for my friends once and a while for free and I get beer and a cool portfolio piece in return)

I'm talking more along the lines of random people on DeviantArt wanting to hire me as the lead artist on an indie video game project or an indie RPG project that they don't even know will get off the ground. They're not willing to make ANY sort of monetary investment into it, period - even for the artists. They won't profit share with you later either. The project won't make it. The deadlines will be too stupid, they'll make tons of changes, they won't want contracts etc. It's a great way for them to get free work from the desperate.

And no :P I respond properly:

"I am highly interested in working on an RPG. What type of pieces do you need and what is your art budget for this project? My rate varies depending on the type of work necessary. I will need %50 up front to begin all work."

Which usually gets the hint through that I do not work for free.

Doesn't happen often though, I don't have many art jobs right now since I'm focusing on improving and not finished, polished pieces (lots of studies and anatomical drawings, not conducive to getting hired on as an illustrator, but a necessary evil)

I also do not break down any cost for materials, since a lot of my work is digital. I just factor in an overall material add-on into the total labor price, since Photoshop, Painter X, my computer, my drawing tablet and my pencils and paper are all overhead.